Where & what is your 'Hope?'

Where & what is your 'Hope?'

Hope in NT scripture is the anticipation of something that is not yet now in the present but is in the future, being a 'certainty,' and not a false expectation that is purely conditional.

And so the non-believer has but physical death and the decaying of their physical body to look forward to. They have no hope or something beyond their present conscientiousness....they go from conscious existence to terminal energy with no propagation of their existence. Seems like the 'cheap' way out for their mundane existence w/o penalty for their wrong decisions...thus, irresponsible behavior affecting many ppl that is not rewarded with justifiable actions and results & allows for a false feeling of present day security and guiltless following of one's lusts and earthly desires. Ergo, the epitome of selfishness and what is known as self-centered hedonism..

 

How would one explain how the most ardant believers in an after-life even cosmic justice...are capable of the most egregious sins (even by their own religion's moral code....i.e. the priest who abuses children or the evangelical minister who employs male prostitutes)?

And examples of atheists and agnostics who work for peace (a peace they may never see in their life-times)...are charitable (to no benefit of themselves)...and lead lives of non-hedonistic natures???

 

My hope is that all religion will become redundant.

 

Wait why do i need your unsupported supernatural claims to have an afterlife?
Admittedly theirs no support for that as well


and what’s wrong with lusts and desires so long as you don’t harm people with them?

 

But being certain doesn’t make you right what you expect could be false on the condition your faith is

 

I am against 'formal religion!' But that doesnt mean that I am not open to truth....being closed minded shows one's ignorance and bias against such....closed minded ppl cannot receive anything..esp in their arrogance and self trust as having all knowledge....i.e. lacking any humility in their prideful lives. Ergo, they 'judge' themselves....patting themselves on their backs but judges themselves. As scripture says, "Pride goes before a downfall."

 

this seems closed minded

Hope in NT scripture is the anticipation of something that is not yet now in the present but is in the future, being a 'certainty,' and not a false expectation that is purely conditional.

 

I hope that the followers of Jesus - as opposed to the 'religious' people - will regain some sort of toehold in the US, and that enough ordinary people will survive capital's destruction of our world to start again in the Twenty-Second Century.

 

It seems being moral because you will be "rewarded with Heaven" or if not "punished with Hell"....is a pretty weak morality. The morality of a gun to your head with one hand and a wad full of cash in the other and you're told "Do the right thing, you get the cash...do the wrong thing, I'll blow your brains out."

And then being expected to be patted on the back by others for your "superior morality" after the gun-man leaves and you wave the cash around in front of them.

 

If I make you a 'promise' of something that is not manifested in the present but 'guaranteed' as occurring in the future, it is not just wishful thinking but a 'hope' in something that is not presently manifested but a surety of result...what's so hard to understand, unless one is tainted by the present day performance/record of fallible and lying mankind? You are judging my words by the record of man, and not by the promises of God...

 

Iolo is fun to read and dismiss in debate, as he is but a religious scoffer and is living back in the archaic Anglican days of scripture....I'm sure he thinks that he means well, but is doing nothing for the advancement of the Kingdom of God....still havnt been able to figure out his Christian motives other than rebellion..other than just being angry..may be just a personality trait(?)

 

My hope is that one day, the children will have a chance with truth, on the first pass.

Religions will be extinct.

 

but your not a god no one who has ever told me about a god was a god your words are a record of man

 

I agree Bish, as 'religion' is but a tool and bondage of man....but the one who says 'there is no God," is no one more knowledgeable and powerful than he, and is but a fool...as they dont have all the info but what they want to accept & believe in..as being 'closed minded' in their thinking..and so the pure atheist is but an ignorant and biased ideologue w/o all the truths ergo facts in their logic..thus they are a biased denier of possibilities not yet discovered. Their bias blinds then to other possibilities..and so bias makes them ignorant!

 

Let us post our professional degrees in this discussion, as to date it always comes to YOU calling out insults and derogatory comments.

I have a MSEE in the filed of Science (major in Engineering), have taken Modern Physics & Astrophysics credits, been an Inet info junkie all my adult life, but also have been 'open' to what's out there in these multiple fields. One can 'weigh' the discussions with or w/o bias, and taint their belief system accordingly. But what is the 'fruit' of one's life is shown by their postings on this forum..and what is YOUR fruit?!! I.e. what makes YOU a credible authority to supercede my arguments?

 

All I have to do is replace theist with atheist and this post is now about you.

How do you prove it to be otherwise?

You can't.

And with four sentences we are back where the debate belongs. What evidence do you have to support your position?

Because without any evidence to support your position we are stuck listening to your bias being passed of as knowledge.

 

This post like the many before it only proves one thing. That the same hypocrisy can be spewed forth in oh so many ways.

How ignorant and flimsy is the information used in this post when considering its supposed message?

But look at all the the words like ergo and epitome and hedonism. How could one not be swayed by it?

It doesn't matter how you say it, in the end you are saying "if Y = truth (and it does because I say it does) then x must also be true proving that z = you're wrong and I'm right"

And then you top it all off by pointing out how ignorant we are to accept our biased ideology as truth.

 

I assume by "look forward to" you must mean at the point of death only, since I have plenty of things to look forward to while I live. In that sense you are partially correct. I don't look forward to things that happen after I die as I don't expect to be able to experience anything after that point. But it does not follow that I don't hope for things after my death - it's just that the things I hope for are for the ones I love and not for myself. Some say we live on (or 'propagate' as you say) through our children, and I hope for the best for my kid.

Yeah, wrong decisions aren't always penalised. But I'm satisfied that, more often than not, choices have consequences, so contrary to your allegations, I tend not to act irresponsible, certainly no more than any religious person I know. Contrary to your allegations, I do not follow my lusts and desires without guilt. Contrary to your allegations, I am not selfish. Contrary to your allegations, I am not self-centered, and contrary to your allegations I am not what most people would call a hedonist.

In general, then, your post is full of accusations that are almost entirely mistaken.

 

I have no problem with people believing what ever they so wish .. god in heaven, fairies at the bottom of the garden .. where I do have the problem is those same people telling me what I should believe, there are far to many a-la-carte christians around who pick and choose what bits they want, and discard the rest.

In the end why should it matter to a christian if I believe or not?

Religion may have started out with grand ideas, but it has been turned into just another control of the masses, now those masses have education and think for themselves religion has lost its power for many people

 

And so you are basically saying that you can 'save' yourself (being 'good enuf' on your own merit) and that Jesus Christ died for no reason? And so you and your deep mindset supercedes the wisdom of the ages and places you in the position of a god (all knowing)?!

Good luck with that......as in making your own rules....

EDIT: Denial is a wonderful thing, huh. If one doesnt like the rules then they can just ignore them...absolutely brilliant but at the end is the futility of a prideful mind. And as scripture says, "The greatest enemy between man & God is man's pride."

 

you keep pretending to be a god yourself your faith is not true because you wish it and neither are the supernatural claims wise because you wish them to be

 

i post HOPE

you go overdrive on putting your head up your blank

2 questions;

Why havent you figured out that the current model is wrong?
and what have you done for mankind?

no sh't.

You make your degree as useful as toilet paper, because your posts have no weight of integrity. This post is just evidence of the stupid tangents because you have not measure to support your ignorant beliefs.

the awakening of minds

integrity

Meaning that if you research, each, any and all items I mention, you will find it all consistent with what is real.

When i said 30 yrs back that light is UPON MASS, you now have excitons, polaritons, solitons, and about every rendition of light upon mass, that can be found

When I say that LIFE: abuses entropy............................... you personally should know the truth of that matter, or are just stupid!

 

do you take medication?

no sh't

Imagine the idiots that actually believe 'god' gave them the garden.


Their bias blinds then to other possibilities..and so bias makes them ignorant!

 

Your analogy only works if I believe I need to be saved by your unseen, unproven god .. The god you choose to believe in has no more merit than Oden or Zeus .. You call it pride I call it common sense

 

From my personal experience there was nothing before i was born ( I didn't exist) and there will be nothing after I die.