5 Reasons Hillary Won't Run

I really don't see how the fact that Bill Clinton was never convicted of perjury in any way impacts whether Hillary Clinton runs for president.

The fact that he has the highest rating of any president ever is of minute significance, if any at all, compared to her having the most positive numbers of any potential candidate.

 

Another self identifier.

While I don't mind (in fact I think it's a good civic duty) to provide links to back up my argument, you are playing the same game as expatriate is, by using the term "convicted," So you really don't want a link because you've never ever heard of what was a pretty widely reported story at the time, you want to say, "see? He was not convicted in an actual court!" So to be clear, I never said he was convicted, merely that he admitted his guilt and the issue was adjudicated by the bar and he was punished. I don't understand your dishonesty on this issue though. It must be some sort of crazy party loyalty.

 

trust me. I don't need to convince myself of anything.

if he had been found guilty by a court of law of felony perjury, he would have not only lost his license to practice law, he would have been branded a felon and deemed unworthy to cast a ballot in either Arkansas or New York until after he had served his sentence and his parole period had been satisfied. That never happened because he was NOT convicted of perjury in any court of law. sorry.

Not at all. Unfortunately for you, the justice department did not have a case for felony perjury and therefore did not charge him with, or convict him of such a crime. As it was, his license to practice law was administratively removed for five years... a period of time long since past. Bill Clinton is free to reapply for his license in Arkansas any time he decides he'd like to do so.

answered

we both know the answer to that question, and we both know that it did NOT entail being convicted of the crime of perjury.

again... his license was administratively removed for five years. As of 2006, he has been free to get his license back to practice in Arkansas - and before SCOTUS - whenever he decides to reapply.

I said he was not found guilty of any felonies and he wasn't. Every untrue statement offered under oath does not automatically rise to the level of criminal perjury. I would imagine you were unaware of that, eh?

 

and again...there is giving a false statement under oath, and then there is the crime of perjury. The former does not automatically equate to the latter. That ain't "word games", that is merely using the language with a level of precision that I assumed most adults expected. I guess, shame on me for making such a mistake in your case.

 

perjury is a word that I use in its criminal sense. There are more elements to the crime of perjury than merely making a false statement under oath. I assumed you were aware of that. Silly me. I won't assume anything beyond basic bodily functions for you going forward.

 

You did not read the link. Clinton did not just get the rapist off, she lied about the 12 year old victims background, claimed the victim "asked for it", played the "blame the victim game". In the recorded interview, Clinton laughed at getting the rapist a not guilty verdict.

 

I did read the link, must have missed that part. If she wasn't just offering the best defense then that's pretty low.

 

Scroll back. The assertion was how great it would be if she won and appointed him to the SCOTUS, got it now? And the fact remains a federal court held him in contempt for submitting a false affadavit, prima facie evidence of perjruy, and purposely give false answers under oath, perjury and both obstructions of justice. He paid a $90,000 fine and lost his license to practice law and can never practice before the SCOTUS to which some want him appointed.

Now are you denying he did any of the above and that a federal court said he did and applied legal sanctions to him? If not then explain exactly what he did to receive those sanctions.

 

Why indulge in such idle speculation?

Fantasizing about reasons that Hillary Clinton would not run for the presidency, the thread's ostensible topic, is fanciful enough.

 

she did the job of a defense attorney in our adversarial judicial system, and she did it well. Don't like our system of justice? renounce your citizenship and move away.

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where do you get the idea that he can NEVER practice before SCOTUS again? If he reapplies for his law license in Arkansas, he certainly can.

 

He plea bargained the criminal charge after being convicted of the civil contempt and being legally sanctioned.

What did he do to be held in civil contempt? He committed perjury and obstruction of justice, felonies.

Yes they did, are you denying he submitted a false affidavit and that the federal court said he did so and also testified falsely under oath?

Are you really ignorant of the fact he plea bargained and why Ray did allow him to cop a plea?

Yes a very serious punishment for a lawyer. And why did the Arkansas bar do that, what did he do in the court to warrant that?

So what? Can he practice law before SCOTUS?

Dodged again.
What exactly did he do to be held in contempt and recieve all the sanctions, what did Judge Wright say he did? And are you denying he submitted a false affidavit?

No I don't think you do. Prove me wrong and tell me what it is he did to be held in contempt of court?

And you know why Judge Wright only held him in civil contempt and not criminal?

Yes he lost it for 5 years, a VERY serious punishment for lawyer, why did the Arkansas bar do that, what had he done to warrant it?

Wrong he can NEVER practice law before SCOTUS, you really don't know what you are talking about here.

Associated Press Writer

Monday, Oct. 1, 2001; 10:48 a.m. EDT

WASHINGTON –– The Supreme Court ordered former President Clinton disbarred from practicing law before the high court on Monday and gave him 40 days to contest the order.

The court did not explain its reasons, but Supreme Court disbarment often follows disbarment in lower courts.

In April, Clinton's Arkansas law license was suspended for five years and he paid a $25,000 fine. The original disbarment lawsuit was brought by a committee of the Arkansas Supreme Court.

There are no fines associated with the Supreme Court action. Most lawyers who are admitted to the Supreme Court bar never actually argue a case there, but the right to do so is considered an honor.

Clinton agreed to the Arkansas fine and suspension Jan. 19, the day before he left office, as part of an understanding with Independent Counsel Robert Ray to end the Monica Lewinsky investigation.

The agreement also satisfied the legal effort by the Arkansas Supreme Court Committee on Professional Conduct to disbar Clinton for giving misleading testimony in the Paula Jones sexual harassment case.

The Supreme Court followed its standard rules in the Clinton case, which include suspending Clinton from practice in the court and giving him 40 day to show why he should not be permanently disbarred.

The court order did not mention any vote by the justices.

"Whenever a member of the bar of this court has been disbarred or suspended from practice of any court of record, or has engaged in conduct unbecoming a member of the bar of this court, the court will enter an order suspending that member from practice before this court," Supreme Court rules say.

Julia Payne, a spokeswoman for Clinton, referred calls to his lawyer, David Kendall, in Washington. Kendall did not immediately return a call seeking comment.

Associated Press Writer

Monday, Oct. 1, 2001; 10:48 a.m. EDT

WASHINGTON –– The Supreme Court ordered former President Clinton disbarred from practicing law before the high court on Monday and gave him 40 days to contest the order.

The court did not explain its reasons, but Supreme Court disbarment often follows disbarment in lower courts.

In April, Clinton's Arkansas law license was suspended for five years and he paid a $25,000 fine. The original disbarment lawsuit was brought by a committee of the Arkansas Supreme Court.

There are no fines associated with the Supreme Court action. Most lawyers who are admitted to the Supreme Court bar never actually argue a case there, but the right to do so is considered an honor.

Clinton agreed to the Arkansas fine and suspension Jan. 19, the day before he left office, as part of an understanding with Independent Counsel Robert Ray to end the Monica Lewinsky investigation.

The agreement also satisfied the legal effort by the Arkansas Supreme Court Committee on Professional Conduct to disbar Clinton for giving misleading testimony in the Paula Jones sexual harassment case.

The Supreme Court followed its standard rules in the Clinton case, which include suspending Clinton from practice in the court and giving him 40 day to show why he should not be permanently disbarred.

The court order did not mention any vote by the justices.

"Whenever a member of the bar of this court has been disbarred or suspended from practice of any court of record, or has engaged in conduct unbecoming a member of the bar of this court, the court will enter an order suspending that member from practice before this court," Supreme Court rules say.

Julia Payne, a spokeswoman for Clinton, referred calls to his lawyer, David Kendall, in Washington. Kendall did not immediately return a call seeking comment.

No you questioned that statement committed felonies. And yes Judge Wright's court found he submitted a false affidavit and convicted him of doing so. That is a felony.

DUH, what does that have to do with Clinton, he submitted a false affidavit, prima facie evidence of perjury. He also testified falsely as Judge Wright ruled and convicted him of.

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No one is forcing you to participate and direct your question to the OPer not me.

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That is the second time you have posted that so do tell what about Clinton's false statements did not meet standard for perjury and prove he did not submit a false affidavit.

 

nothing that SCOTUS did regarding Clinton being able to practice law before them is not reversible if and when he regains his law license. sorry.

again.... the crime of perjury has more elements than merely making false statements. Clinton was not found guilty of the crime of perjury. that's a fact.

 

They PERMANANTELY BANNED HIM......he declined to contest it just as he declined a trial in the federal court over his perjury there he admitted his guilt......sorry once again you don't know what you are talking about.

Fine then what elements were missing in Clinton's false statements. Why weren't the perjury? And once again submitting a false affidavit is prima facie evidence of perjury, do you know what that means?

The court found he lied under oath for the purpose of obstructing justice and convicted him of that, that is perjury. That is a fact.

 

The only possible reason Hilary won't run would be that defeating whatever idiot the Republicans nominate won't be enough challenge to keep her interested.

 

Touchy aren't you? You must have a crush on Hilary.

Hilary is not in trouble for doing her job, she is in trouble for blaming the 12 year old victim for her rape, claiming (now known to be flat out lies) that the 12 year old victim fantasized about older men, and for laughing in the interview about getting the guy a not guilty verdict.

This is the same Hilary that goes on and on about the "war on women".

 

no court "convicted" him of anything. Like I said, there are more elements to the CRIME of perjury than merely making a false statement under oath. Your use of the language is annoyingly imprecise.

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she mounted a vigorous defense of her client. We should all be so lucky as to have lawyers like that representing us.

 

Ah the pseudo arrogance of the rabid (yet curiously uninformed) internet partisan. You managed to not only imply I wasn't acting as an adult, but you managed to throw in a comment about body functions. Oh the irony...

Here's the deal: You were trying to be too smart by half, and that's half from a very low bar, by trying to challenge Bluesguy on Clinton's perjury because he was never charged in a criminal court. Now perjury is a criminal charge, but it is also a term that describes a particular offense; lying under oath. Now even though you have not admitted that Clinton lied under oath, you've not challenged it directly either. You've tried to dodge that saying it's not perjury unless you have a conviction. Well, Clinton admitted to lying under oath, he was punished by the bar and Supreme Court in Arkansas, so saying that it's not perjury because he was not criminally charged (not counting the impeachment of course), is begging the question when Clinton admitted to the offense of perjury.

Now, I've observed that there are two types of people on these forums. Those who are interested in public policy and foreign policy issues, have strong opinions on them and want to discuss them, and those who are rabid partisans to don't understand issues but they do understand what side they are on and want to throw stop sticks on any discussion that goes against their side because to them, the only issue is my side / your side. Even being factually correct is irrelevant. You are clearly the second type of person.

 

I merely point out that when Bluesgay says that a court convicted Clinton of perjury, that is not correct. He would not found guilty of any crime. He has been called a felon in this very thread.... also incorrect.

 

conviction n. the result of a criminal trial in which the defendant has been found guilty of a crime.

 

If Hilary had remained a lawyer and been consistent, I would agree with some reservation. But she did not, she entered politics and is a leader of the party claiming they are for women and dishonestly smearing the political opposition. Hilary the lawyer was the epitome of the stereotypical lawyer who blames the woman (in this case a child) for her own rape, something that was headlined as a disgraceful tactic throughout the womens rights movement. And then in the interview, rather than apologize for it, she laughs it off as if its a grand joke and a testament of her skill at deceit.

 

Bluesgay? That's not a very nice thing to say.

 

Hillary will not be nominated. Joe Biden will be the next president of the U.S.

 

because she quit practicing law, you think that, when she did, she should not have been as good at it? yeah... that makes tons of sense.

 

Maybe I'm not making my point.

Hilary the lawyer did everything that Hilary the politician says is wrong. Hilary the politician says its wrong to blame the rape victim, and lie in a trial, and says children are to be protected (remember the victim was a child).

But when Hilary the politician was confronted with the case, her lying, the fact the rapist got away with it, and the victim was traumatized for years by the rape and the trial, she thought it was funny and laughed. No apology to the victim, no remorse, no second thoughts about what she did.

Its the hypocrisy of Hilary that's the issue. She castigates other lawyers who "blame the victim" and say victim "asked for it", she claimed it was a travesty that rape victims get traumatized twice - first by the rape then by the trial.

But she thinks its just funny when she does it.

 

because she was a good lawyer, does not preclude her from being a good politician or from being a good president. If you don't like her, by all means, don't vote for her.