Australia to save White South African's lifes

Discussion in 'Australia, NZ, Pacific' started by Glücksritter, Mar 20, 2018.

  1. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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    Your scenario is an interesting point. In our shopping centre, you'll see help "wanted ads" in Mandarin. I believe that action has been taken on this, by the relevant agencies but it is an instance of discrimination.
     
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  2. slipperyfish

    slipperyfish Well-Known Member

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    Yes but is it discrimination?

    If 99% of your clientel prefer to speak Mandarin, is it really discriminatory to want your employees to speak mandarin?

    These are some of the arguments that are going to become commonplace as we see larger enclaves of same same within the broader collective.

    And their arguments aren’t without merit. What language you speak in your employment will seem trivial in comparrison to other arguments as values and ideologies clash.

    There is no wrong or right here. It will be difficult to navigate.
     
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  3. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Here's what I think, depends on the job, if it's a job that does not require a lot of experience or qualifications, like working behind the counter and talking to customers who predominantly only speak Mandarin it's not racism.

    If it's a job like an accountant, where you do not need to interact with clientele and you require a level of knowledge, that would be discrimination.

    What is confusing for some people is this "preferring to mingle with people "like us" because we relate" to be honest other ethnic groups feel the same way, (as demonstrated by the way they group together in Melbourne and Sydney). Preferring the company of your own group is not racism, pushing someone out because they are different, is racism.

    If you have two people applying for a job, one is of the same ethnic group as yourself, the other is from another. And you employ on a basis with preference to ethnic group instead of qualifications, that's clearly discrimination. The area becomes muddled when specific characteristics of a particular ethnic group is required for the job.
     
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  4. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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    99% of the population in this area don't speak Chinese and the customers at the shopping centre are 99% Anglo Saxon. The Chinese in the area are the shop keepers.
    ps. The advertising is discriminatory if only a particular ethnic group can understand it. They could perhaps advertise in English and explain that a bi lingual speaker is preferred owing to the demands of the job.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2018
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  5. truthvigilante

    truthvigilante Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You are feisty SW, but love it

    Of course it’s not racism...,.sorry, just taking a swig ; )

    Institutionalized and intergenerational discrimination of a whole ethnic group of people, who were consequently devalued as humans historically and systematically across their entire country is a totally different discrimination SW. That’s why we don’t understand what discrimination is!

    Racism is not subjective, you’re just confusing racism with stereotyping.

    I think others have addressed your Chinese business man query.
     
  6. LeftRightLeft

    LeftRightLeft Well-Known Member

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    Well said, couldn't have put it better.

    People who think like that are doing the bidding of the terrorists. The object of terrorism is to create fear. The terrorists want hatred and discord. They want non Muslims to react against Muslims, it promotes their hatred and inspires more young suseptable minds that have been marginalised because of their beliefs to search for answers and they are then are ripe for radicalisation. Most Muslim parents I have spoken to are terrified for their children.
     
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  7. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    No government is above criticism IMO and yes, that applies to the corrupt and inept ANC government in South Africa.

    You are right that South Africa did have nuclear weapons under the apartheid regime but I believe that eliminating them was part of the deal to transition to a democratic government of all of the people but I could be wrong about that. Speaking from what I have learned about the ANC government I would not be happy in the knowledge that nukes were "safe" in their hands.

    The apartheid regime space program was cancelled because it was at the point of launching missiles. However in 2010 South Africa did start up a new space program that is primarily focused on weather tracking in order to help with farming. Got to give credit where it is due.

    You are also right about the HIV/AIDS epidemic in South Africa. It is the largest in the world but I suspect that is only because it is better documented there than in it's neighbors to the north. All of Africa has a serious HIV/AIDS problem and fixing it in one place is not going to work if it continues to thrive in the rest of Africa.

    The solution to that problem is beyond what a single government can achieve IMO. And to be brutally honest about this there is another factor that has NOT been taken into account when it comes to the spread of HIV/AIDS in ALL of the 3rd world nations and that is the RCC. In 2009 Pope Benedict claimed that the use of condoms would make the AIDS epidemic even worse. WTF? :eek:

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2009/mar/17/pope-africa-condoms-aids

    So I am not giving a pass to the ANC government for the HIV/AIDS epidemic but I am going to point out that it doesn't help when the LARGEST religion in the continent of Africa rails AGAINST the single most EFFECTIVE means of stopping the spread of HIV/AIDS.

    That is my 2 cents worth.
     
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  8. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    I raised my daughter in what is one of the most diverse towns in my state. The 2010 Census officially made whites a minority for the first time. Looking back at pictures of my daughter's birthday parties she was usually only one of a few white children while the rest came from all over the world. At an event in her Elementary school for 3rd graders over 30 different nations were represented.

    So in that respect she was raised "color blind" and when I talked to her and her friends it is obvious that they see each other as individuals and not as part of any racial or ethnic group.

    Because of this diversity there were shops and even a full sized supermarket that catered to the tastes of the population. The local library celebrated Diwali and Chinese New Year alongside Christmas and Thanksgiving.

    My daughter was participating at a NaNoWriMo event one year and she had a friend from the midwest visiting so she took her along. Her friend looked around the room at all the kids and remarked at all of the diversity. My daughter responded that it looked just like America to her and she was right about that.

    I don't know Australia personally well enough to comment on the changing diversity that is happening there now. Given my own personal experience working for the last 4 decades when I finally left corporate America I was managing diverse teams of people from all over the world. That is the future and while it might be a "change" from our perspective it is normal to those who have grown up with it.
     
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  9. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    The same feeling exists amongst black parents here in America given how they are worried about their own children.

    But to get back to the point that you made so succinctly about doing the bidding of terrorists by promoting fear that is why I believe it must be called out for what it is. We can't defeat an opponent we don't understand and if we are mislead into attacking the wrong opponent we are definitely going to lose. The problem is not the religions but those who are exploiting them the way that terrorism does.

    It was the dumbest thing in the entire history of the United States for Bush jr to "promote" terrorists to the status of "enemy combatants" IMO. They are nothing more than international criminals who abuse religion for their own nefarious and lethal purposes. There needs to be the equivalent of the FBI's Most Wanted list of all terrorists and rewards offered for their capture. They are the ones who are the threat to all of the nations of the world. They are costing us taxpayers a fortune in military spending for what should be police actions to hunt them down and bring them to justice.
     
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  10. slipperyfish

    slipperyfish Well-Known Member

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    Now you have added the extra information, it appears a cunning attempt at pre qualification.

    I don’t think this particular business is looking for a non Chinese worker. Being bi lingual may not mean anything in this case.

    However it does bring up an interesting question.

    Is it discrimination if the main language spoken in that community is mandarin, even though the language of choice in broader society is English?
     
  11. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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    My "cunning attempt at pre qualification" was an effort to clarify my point.
     
  12. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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    It is against the law here to discriminate on the basis of race, sex, etc.
    Advertising in mandarin excludes non mandarin speakers in a region which is not predominantly Chinese.
    The ads were for shop assistants in a shopping centre.
     
  13. slipperyfish

    slipperyfish Well-Known Member

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    Yes, I thought I made that abundantly clear after you divulged the added information.

    My question was hypothetical, as they all have been.

    Even on your post here you have touched on my hypothetical question. What if that region was predominantly Chinese, does that still make it discrimination?
     
  14. slipperyfish

    slipperyfish Well-Known Member

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    I think you misunderstood my post.

    Why is everybody so outraged so quickly these days in conversation?

    The cunning attempt is by the store owner, not you.
     
  15. yiostheoy

    yiostheoy Well-Known Member

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    life
    life's
    lives
    lives'
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2018
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  16. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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    If it were in China, it would be fine.
     
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  17. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    I know that I have already addressed this but I want to get back to your comment about the spread of HIV/AIDS.

    https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entr...id-needle-sharing_us_5ad4afd4e4b077c89ceb0442

    If America cannot stop the spread of HIV/AIDS in a state with some of the best healthcare in the nation it is a much bigger lift in Africa where healthcare is largely nonexistent for millions of people. Your point about ignorance is equally valid since it appears that Americans have forgotten all about the AIDS crisis back in the 1980's and how to prevent it from spreading.

    I don't know if I have an answer to either situation but it would be hypocritical of me to criticize the failures in Africa given the failures here in America. On the other hand Australia has done an excellent job of dealing with the problem and while it is not eliminated at least it is under control.
     
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  18. DennisTate

    DennisTate Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    And skilled workers and investors will be needed to green the outback of Australia if
    humanity decides on a more rapid response toward stabilization of the
    climate than a carbon tax.

    Should Sorek 2 be in Australia or California?


    https://www.technologyreview.com/s/534996/megascale-desalination/
    Megascale Desalination
    The world’s largest and cheapest reverse-osmosis desalination plant is up and running in Israel.


    This could be the most effective way to prepare for the possible collapse of the
    West Antarctic Ice Sheet.... not to mention the land based Greenland Ice Pack.

    https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/02/090205142132.htm
    Collapse Of Antarctic Ice Sheet Would Likely Put Washington, D.C. Largely Underwater


    [​IMG]
    Every cubic meter of ocean water that is desalinated for agriculture in Australia is good news for New Orleans, New York, Miami, Bangladesh, The Netherlands..... and especially the residents of Truro, Nova Scotia, Canada and Anchorage Alaska where some of the highest tides in the world occur.


     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2018
  19. ThirdTerm

    ThirdTerm Well-Known Member

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    Most Asian shops in the Perth city centre were stuffed by Asians because they were family-owned businesses, employing their family members or relatives. But I wonder how a Chinese immigrant can get a job without starting his own business in Australia. More than any other place in Australia, South Africans have migrated to Western Australia probably it's easier to travel back home from Australia's west coast. South African migrants also find it easy to get employed and integrated in Australia compared to Chinese migrants.
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2018
  20. Sallyally

    Sallyally Well-Known Member Donor

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    If the situation in South Africa is as bad as is reported, why would they want to visit home?
     
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  21. Diuretic

    Diuretic Well-Known Member

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    Example being a very good old friend of mine who came from Cambodia to Australia as a refugee and when I met him was running his own restaurant in Adelaide. He did phenomenally well but he told me he wanted out of Adelaide (this was about 20 years ago) because the economy was crap. He checked out Brisbane but didn't rate it (back then) but Perth he loved. So over he went and opened up and did very well. Unfortunately it eventually fell over and he shot through back to Cambodia leaving it in the hands of his wife. I think he called the business Chef Han's Cafe. Anyway the point of all this, he Anglicised his name from Sy En to Ian, Ian Han. Well it worked for a long time.
     
  22. Diuretic

    Diuretic Well-Known Member

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    Because they can. My next door neighbour just got back from several weeks in a small town near Johannesburg. Said it was quite peaceful, not sure about the city though.
     
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  23. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Except you keep ignoring the fact South Africa was a first world country, now 20 years later a 3rd world country. The difference between our arguments. You keep saying but it's 3rd world and I keep saying... only for the last 20 years which is essentially my point how corrupt government can cause millions to die with neglect, stealing money meant for health services and mismanagement.

    Americans always think if America can't no one else can... also a bullshit argument. Get rid of theft, corruption and mismanagement and you certainly can stop it. Other African countries who never had the benefit of South Africa's 1st world health system have far lower HIV rates. You can try and make excuses till you are blue in the face, not holding the South African government responsible only gives them permission to sit by while more people die.

     
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  24. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  25. scarlet witch

    scarlet witch Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I have posted before how South Africa changes the murder and other crime rates to hide the number of people dying, the numbers raped, white genocide and the crime rate.
    Question
    In your opinion, should the Australian Government warn Australians or listen to the South African Government and delete this advice?

    Diplomatic feud worsens as South Africa accuses Australia of issuing 'misleading' travel warning over violent crime

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...stralia-travel-advice.html#i-c12dbe0468e7a269
     

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