Tariffs are not a meaningful negotiating tool

The European Union and the United States have the largest bilateral trade and investment relationship and enjoy the most integrated economic relationship in the world. Total US investment in the EU is three times higher than in all of Asia. EU investment in the US is around eight times the amount of EU investment in India and China together. EU and US investments are the real driver of the transatlantic relationship, contributing to growth and jobs on both sides of the Atlantic.

From the rest of your comments it is easy to see why you agree with Trump. You both wish to destroy the American economy.

 

We need to be treated fairly by other countries. Or do you prefer to be treated unfairly by other countries?

 

There is no question that the EU is an important trading partner but that doesn't affect what I said. Why is it that our tariffs will destroy our economy when the tariffs imposed by our trading partners have not. I didn't know Trump wanted to replace income tax with tariffs.

 

In that case we don't have free trade at all. I can't remember when tariff free trade existed anywhere. Our trading partners engage in protectionism as you define it. The term doesn't apply to them?

 

Free trade is an ideal.
You don't have Free Trade in absolute. Just closer to it than anyone else.
Much closer.

Everybody uses protectionism to some extent.
Some more than others.

 

There seems to be a pattern here.

On March 8 Trump spontaneously agreed to talk to the North Korean dictator based solely on the statements of a South Korean envoy. He did not consult his state department, National Security Council, or our intelligence services. Since then he has said a great deal about all the progress that has been made even though that progress has been mere rhetoric.

April 18, “If I think that it’s a meeting that is not going to be fruitful, we’re not going to go,” Trump said at a news conference at his Mar-a-Lago estate in Florida, standing alongside Prime Minister Shinzo Abe of Japan. “If the meeting, when I’m there, is not fruitful, I will respectfully leave the meeting.” He has begun laying the groundwork for changing his mind. As everyone else knows, Kim is not giving up a thing. He may give up testing, but that is only because he has the weapons he needs and they have passed the rigorous testing.

March 1, speaking at the White House, Trump said he has decided on tariffs of 25 percent for foreign-made steel and 10 percent for aluminum. “We’ll be imposing tariffs on steel imports and tariffs on aluminum imports,” the President said. “…You will have protection for the first time in a long while, and you’re going to regrow your industries.”

March 8, in his formal announcement of the tariffs, he exempted Canada and Mexico, nos. 1 and 2 steel exporters to the U.S.

The tariffs were to into effect on March 23. On March 22, Trump exempted Australia, Argentina, South Korea, Brazil, and the member countries of the EU. Those exemptions end April 30.

On April 27, CNBC reported, "The May 1 deadline for steel and aluminum tariff exemptions for U.S. allies is likely to be extended, according to sources who have been in discussions with the Trump administration."

January 12, “Today, I am waiving the application of certain nuclear sanctions, but only in order to secure our European allies’ agreement to fix the terrible flaws of the Iran nuclear deal,” Trump said in a statement. “This is a last chance. In the absence of such an agreement,” he went on, “the United States will not again waive sanctions in order to stay in the Iran nuclear deal.” The deadline for the Iran nuclear deal was set for May 12.

April 27, U.S. Secretary of State Mike Pompeo said Trump has not made a decision on whether to pull out of the Iran nuclear deal but was not likely to keep to it without substantial changes. "There's been no decision, so the team is working and I am sure we will have lots of conversations to deliver what the president has made clear," Pompeo told a news conference.

April 29, National security adviser John Bolton said Sunday Trump still hasn't decided whether to leave the Iran nuclear deal ahead of his May 12 deadline.

It is patently obvious both Bolton and Pompeo are simply ignoring what Trump has said.

Conclusion: Trump is big blowhard. His threats mean nothing. His orders mean nothing. There is little doubt that more and more Trump is simply being ignored.

 

Thank you. You must be a Republican.

 

I predict, tomorrow Trump will exempt all those nations again.

Otherwise, whatever you do, get your money out of stocks.

 

If he can get these nations to be fairer by threatening tariffs, what is wrong with that? China has given some, so has S. Korea. We don't know how talks went yet with France and Germany yet. But wouldn't it be nice if all of them gave up something to make trade fairer and Trump didn't have to put on tariffs with any of them. I am sure besides threatening tariffs, he is pointing out the huge trade difference between them and saying all he is asking for is fair trade. I'm not as paranoid as you are that Trump is out to ruin our economy.

 

Carrot and stick. Nations do NOT response favorably to weakness. It is the unpredictability of President Trump - with his occasionally taking a hardline, that has foreign concessions coming all over the place.

American MSM is NOT American. It is the global super rich wanting to rip off the USA anyway possible, want all their foreign sweatshops, want to control the US government, and want the US government to endlessly borrow more money to buy off the 100,000,000 Americans without jobs so there isn't a revolution against those global super rich. So Americans are fed endless propaganda - and most Democrats buy it hook-line-and-sinker, particularly about Trump.

But foreign leaders look at reality. Think of what Kim saw - but we don't hear about. Year after year, ISIS grew and grew. Seemingly unstoppable. Team Obama basically talked only of containment - maybe - and bizarre ideas of getting the jobs and warnings before bombings so nobody hurt and nothing accomplished. Along comes Trump. He tells the military to do whatever it takes. So the US military gave a couple of weeks for civilians to get out of ISIS cities - and then between artillery, bombings and missiles levels ISIS cities. Totally obliterated them. Overwhelming, massive and unstoppable destruction. ISIS was DESTROYED in about a month and the US military didn't even have to work of a sweat, virtually no loses. There were no real protests. Not even much news coverage. Just President Trump ordered our military to destroy ISIS, so that's what the military did.

THAT is what Kim Jung Un knows about Trump. At anytime, Trump could order the obliteration of the capital of N. Korea and every N. Korean base - with virtually no risk to American lives. Take out the capital of N. Korea and you destroy almost everyone of wealth, influence and position in N. Korea - and Kim Jung Un, even if living, would have a country with no utilities, no food, the limited infrastructure obliterated, and us hunting him by every satellite, drone, and the other dozen ways we have to do it - not having to put ONE American into N. Korea. His WW2 style military is nothing. Maybe he could try to kill Tokyo and Seoul with a nuke. Likely we would have destroyed the few he has still while all still in storage and on the ground.

Some artillery shelling hitting the Northern suburbs of Seoul? How does that hurt US - and we'd take out that artillery quickly. Our satellites would know exactly where each one is with the first shot. But, regardless, that does NOT hurt the USA and does NOTHING to defend Kim Jung Un's world. He lives a life of luxury. Suddenly, and permanently, he'd be having to hide where ever he could, living off a generator. No more $400,000 a year cognac for him, huh?

THAT is what Kim Jung Un knows about Trump - not the worthless personal attacks on the American MSM. He knows that any day Trump could permanently destroy Kim Jung Un's world and life - and not a damn thing Kim Jung Un could do to stop it or counter it against the USA.

Foreign leaders respond to STRENGTH, not weakness. The seeming unpredictability of President Trump is one of his strongest attributes. Kim Jung Un knew that Clinton, Bush and Obama would never do ANYTHING. Trump? Trump my destroy Kim Jung Un's world and life - just for the hell of it or in a bad mood.

Seriously, if you were the leader of a 3rd rate country, who would YOU most fear being in a pissy match with? Nice President Obama wanted to get everyone to like him and the USA? Or crazy President Trump who always fires back at anyone who fires at him? President Trump publicly told the whole world and Kim Jung Un what Obama would never say: "I will do anything to stop Kim Jung Un's nuclear program. My buttons are much, much bigger than his." Thus vanished even Kim Jung Un's nuclear weapons threat. When the old, volatile leader of the most god awful powerful military on earth says "do what I say or I will totally obliterate your world" - probably a good idea to listen that - particularly when he just obliterated the entire nation of ISIS in few weeks, I mean LEVELED their cities. COMPLETELY. FAST.

THIS is what is motivating Kim Jung Un. He's afraid of President Trump - and with good reason (maybe). Can' really know for sure. He knew he was completely safe with Obama. He knows President Trump will level entire cities. Kim Jung Un lives in a city.

 

EVERY country has tariffs. We have tariffs. All have tariffs.

In is AMAZING how the MSM has so many people thinking tariffs are something new and terrible.

25% tariffs on German cars would pound the German car industry. Since American cars are basically banned in Germany anyway, why not?

 

How much stock do you have? What is the risk to you?

 

That is exactly what the USA needs to do. To take a WW2 attitude and rebuild American heavy industry as if at a war level.

CHEAP imports at the lost of American jobs isn't CHEAP at all. They are the most costly products of all. What good is a 20% savings on goods at the expense of your income going to $0?

 

National debt. Trade debt imbalance.

In the 1950s, 40% of all wealth in the world was in the USA. It is down to less than 15% and still falling. Plus massively growing debt - domestic and foreign. THAT is the problem. Nor does GDP equate to either national wealth or personal income of ordinary Americans.

"Full employment" isn't true - and the quality of the job and salary matters. Working half days at Home Depot and Half days at a C-store with no benefits qualifies as "employment," but does not equate to a full time $40K a year job with medical and pension, does it?

 

What exactly is the problem Trump's tariffs are supposed to solve?

Consider that in 2017, Germany had a surplus of 300 Billion, Japan had a surplus of 175 Billion and China had a surplus of 160 Billion

The US had a deficicit of 460 Billion.

Trumps tariffs will reduce the deficit. More good paying American jobs will be created while very few American jobs will be lost.

It happens that Germany, Japan and China have stiff tariffs against many American products. It's time to level the playing field.

The wall will be built and tariffs could help pay for it.

 

Below OUR production costs???. . . . Maybe when you figure in our exorbitant CEO and upper management salaries, wasteful practices, and excessive overhead costs.

Actually, from my own personal experiences, I have found that foreign refineries produce higher quality metals. Competitive pricing is not our biggest issue.

You want a free market, but by eliminating foreign competition, a captive market is being created, which only hurts American consumers.

Considering that we, with only 5% of the world's population, control 35% of its wealth, we already have the advantage, and only stand to lose by trying to further our own interests by trade restrictions.

 

And the hollowing out of the U.S. economy was just fine with you? Doing nothing was just fine with you? And frankly there is nothing Trump could do that would make you happy other than resign so our increasingly corrupt, insular and incompetent government can continue business as usual

 

Typical Trump, he is acting like a real jerk. He thinks threatening our friendly trading partners is fun.

Bloomberg reports, "President Donald Trump hasn’t decided whether to extend relief for allied nations from U.S. steel and aluminum tariffs, creating uncertainty in global metals markets with temporary exemptions set to expire in less than 24 hours.

“The president has not made any decision yet,” Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin told Fox Business Network in an interview that aired Monday, when asked about extending exemptions to trading partners.

“We’ve been having lots of discussions internally, we’ve been having lots of discussions with our counterparts,” he said, adding: “We’re addressing these issues real time.”

"Mnuchin’s comments were similar to those of Commerce Secretary Wilbur Ross, who said late Saturday that the White House will announce its decision on tariffs right before the May 1 deadline."

What an a**hole. He still thinks he is the host of a reality television show. For all this, the brainless wonders in Washington Township, MI, cheered him madly. For what? They haven't a clue.

Trump has done this before. He says he is going to do something super stupid, rejected by all, even his own party. Then, at the last minute, he backs down.

I predict he will allow the exemptions of our key trading partners today.

I predict on May 11 he will back down on his threat to tear up the Iran nuclear deal.

I predict he will realize the futility of talking to Kim personally, a fact everyone else knows, and he will back down in late May.

That is his pattern, his dumbass management style.

 

So,just a note; In our local Sunday paper ( April 29th,201,Nevada Appeal,Carson City,Nevada there was an announcement that the cost of the paper was going up by 32% due to the U.S. Government's tariff's on Canada where we get some of our newsprint---actions have consequences, trump-----

 

Kim wouldn't kill Seoul with a nuke. You didn't know? He has his artillery and missile batteries sighted in on Seoul and it's port. In a matter of hours Kim could wipe out millions of people.

But you seem to think Trump's preemptive war if he doesn't get his way is a very real possibility because next you say:

No, you are wrong. Kim now has the capacity launch against U.S. soil. He is not worried about Trump's preemptive war. All he wants to do is sit down and chat with the American President, one on one, one nuclear power to another. It is why he invited Trump. Trump, always wanting to be the center of attention, even if that requires him being an idiot, accepted Kim's invitation.

Kim will win a diplomatic victory that has been sought by the Kim regime since 1953. He will say anything to get Trump to sit down with him. That is what is motivating Kim, and Trump handed the victory over to Kim on a silver platter. Kim has given up nothing to sit down with the American President.

 

There still is no word from Washington regarding the exemptions. I just checked. Maybe Trump forgot about the May1 deadline. He's got a lot on his mind. He creates so many problems, it is probably hard to keep track of them all.

 

The European Union and the United States have the largest bilateral trade and investment relationship and enjoy the most integrated economic relationship in the world.

• Total US investment in the EU is three times higher than in all of Asia.
• EU investment in the US is around eight times the amount of EU investment in India and China together.
• EU and US investments are the real driver of the transatlantic relationship, contributing to growth and jobs on both sides of the Atlantic.

http://ec.europa.eu/trade/policy/countries-and-regions/countries/united-states/

You are willing to risk all of that? I am not sure Trump is. What you said makes no sense unless you wish to weaken the American economy for some reason.

Is there such a reason?

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Wrong. Tariffs restrict trade. They cause rising prices and higher prices cause less demand and less jobs.

Trump's stated purpose for the steel and aluminum tariffs was to protect the steel and aluminum industry. The problem is there are about 150,000 jobs available in that industry. There are about 6.5 million jobs in industries that use steel and aluminum, like car manufacturing. Those jobs are threatened by Trump's tariffs.

Trump apparently didn't know that when he imposed the tariffs.

 

First, nations don't respond well to threats. When the threats become real, nations have this nasty habit of retaliating instead of cooperating. That is something Trump didn't know, either.

I am not talking about China. Nor am I talking about South Korea. I am talking about Canada, Mexico, Australia, Argentina, Brazil, and the member countries of the EU. Those exemptions end April 30.

 

We buy so little aluminum or steel from China, it won't amount to the dot on the i in imports.