61 dead Palestinians.... why did Trump do this?

Only one way to get 2A protection, immigrate legally to the good ol' US of A and become a citizen.

 

Give Palestinians the right to keep and bear arms? ABSOLUTELY! The Gazan's might have a chance to fight off their oppressive,
piece of sh*t, tyrannical Hamas government! Unfortunately, they don't have a chance currently. You think this sh*t would be able to be carried out by the US government? I don't think so somehow.

 

Sorry, is this Israel's fault?

Which other two?

How was this a low point for Hamas?

Are you saying that Hamas was content with all of this? Being totally removed from power?

By doing what exactly?

 

Netanyahu stated many times that he was absolutely opposed to a unity government headed by West Bank and Abbas. The only other alternative is that Gaza continue with their elected Hamas government.

Look it up.

He took economic and military action against Gaza to make a united government unattainable.

The ethnic cleansing is in West Bank, where Israel has carried out a program of stealing land, bulldozing the homes of the residents, building walls preventing Palestinians from reaching their orchards, denying water rights along the Jordan River, etc.

Israel has ignored international law from its very inception.

The UN represents most nations on earth and must proceed in accordance. Putting a bad actor in a leadership position is a well known tactic of forcing that bad actor to move in a positive direction. The UN is not set up such that the head of the human rights council can force the council to ignore human rights.

 

Israel is one of the two parties. They have been at war with Gaza for over a decade, still refusing to negotiate.

Fault doesn't dial into this. It is a situation that Israel alone controls and that is absolutely unacceptable.

There is the government of Gaza. There is a militant group that operates in Gaza and the region. And, there is (or has been) a group that is based in Turkey (as I remember) that doesn't communicate with the other two in any way.

The period leading up to the Abbas unity government proposal was notable in the lower level of actual attacks by Israel and the assessment by Abbas as well as Hamas that the people of Gaza were seeing the Hamas approach as less likely to work than would a unity government solution tying Palestine more closely to the negotiation direction promoted by Abbas. Hamas viewed itself as politically vulnerable.

The government of Gaza isn't crazy. They have stated multiple times that their direction is one of living in peace beside the state of Israel - which they see as illegitimate, but a permanent fact of life that must be accepted.

I'm not going to give you a day by day account of Netanyahu's actions against the unity government. They have involved economic moves, military moves and threats of severe action against Palestine.

 

Ok. Control over insulting their religious beliefs by making a show over moving the Embassy to Jerusalem and later having a Gloating Party.

The U.N. had control enough to create the State of Israel, for example. The U.S. didn't veto it, even though it had the power.

 

Sure...

https://unispal.un.org/DPA/DPR/unispal.nsf/0/7F0AF2BD897689B785256C330061D253

Absolutely not the case. Jerusalem is an Internationalized City. UN considers it "corpus separatum." It belongs to no single nation.

No idea.

If they made a complete circus of it, with gloating party, I would feel exactly the same way.

 

You said that it was "explicit." Where is it "explicit" in that?

Of course, but this doesn't mean that Jerusalem can't be recognised as the capital of Israel. Jerusalem as the capital has LIMITED RECOGNITION but your claim that it is "explicit" in "International law" is pure nonsense, unless you can show how it is explicit.

But if they did it quietly you would still have a problem with it?

 

I took the time to look up the link. Not going to do all the work for you. You'll have to read it.

That is exactly what it means.

Yes. It would be illegal.

 

Yeah, the word "capital" appears only once in the entire publication and that was related to money! So how can can whether or not Jerusalem is the capital be part of it?

You realise though that many countries recognise it as the capital? Are you saying that these countries are deliberately flouting international law?

 

So Trump had control over his actions? Of course he did, but how is this having control over Hamas or the Palestinians living in Gaza?

 

Did he say why?

So they always "proceed in accordance" completely consistently? How likely is it that Israel has actually committed hundreds more human rights violations than a country such as Saudi Arabia?

And has it ever worked?

Of course not, but its still a sick joke to put them in those leadership positions.

 

So you're saying that this:

...is a "situation that Israel alone controls?"

But Gaza hasn't remained in a state of war against Israel? Aren't they simply at war with eachother?

The "militant group" is the military WING of Hamas! You make it sound like it is independent when they are one and the same! Were you unaware of this?

Okay, so what does any of the above have to do with Netanyahu? You've been making it sound as if Abbas and Hamas are willing to form a unity government and they have it all figured out, the only problem that big old mean Netanyahu won't let them! The above is contracting yourself!

And the recent protests which resulted in all of those deaths is somehow "living in peace beside the state of Israel? You're not being serious here are you? "The government of Gaza isn't crazy?" Yeah, right!

 

Ok. Let me clarify. The document is how International Law stands right now. Jerusalem doesn't belong to anybody. Rather, it officially belongs to the United Nations. So nobody could legally place their capital there. However, a two-state solution is more likely not possible without dividing Jerusalem. Once Jerusalem is divided, both Palestine and Israel could place their capital in their side of the city, if they want (I guess.... that would depend on the agreement). but not right now because it doesn't belong to either of them.

This is why Jerusalem is not the capital of Israel

https://www.rferl.org/a/un-votes-reject-us-jerusalem-recognition-capital/28931789.html

As far as I know, at this point only the United States recognizes Jerusalem as the capital. And we are in violation of International law.

I believe Guatemala was about to become a rogue nation too. Not sure if that went through already.

 

This isn't a supportable position. Look at the death toll. Notice that Israel has consistently refused to negotiate an end. Remember that it is Israel that is taking wildly disproportionate action against Gaza in constant air raids, in blockade (which is an act of war), in refusal to allow travel (making Gazans captives), refusing to allow them to even export their goods.

Suggesting there is something Gaza could do to end the war is ludicrous.

They have separate leadership. The elected government has little control over what the militant wing chooses to do.

I don't see a contradiction here - please explain.

Netanyahu's reaction to the unity government are well known and available to all to read.

I think you're missing that there IS a war going on - a war that has been waged by Israel for at least ten years running.

It's not rational to expect one side to do nothing while the other side is waging war.

Do you know of ANY case in history where your concept has been put in place?

 

It produces an expected response.

 

I'm sorry, but THAT'S not control! That is a decision which leads to consequences!

 

Show me somewhere that it states that "Jerusalem officially belongs to the United Nations". What an outrageous assertion!

 

What is the significance of the death toll?

And this is without provocation?

They could stop attacking perhaps? That would help wouldn't it?

Well we have Abbas, Hamas and Netanyahu. These are the three parties right? You seemed to be implying that Abbas and Hamas are ready to form a unity government at any moment but Netanyahu is stopping them - Netanyahu is the ONLY party preventing a unity government. Can you confirm if this is what you are saying?

If so, a contradiction appears to occur in your post below, where you are talking about some issues between Abbas and Hamas coming to agreement:

So I was wondering what any of the above has to do with Netanyahu.

You said that "Hamas viewed itself as politically vulnerable." What did you mean?

How was it waged by Israel? Are you saying that they fired the first shot?
Also, hasn't the war been going on since 1964? What is the event that you are referring to 10 years ago?

Is Israel "waging war" right now, even though they are still simply responding to attacks? What if there was no conflict for a week. Did that week go by with Israel "waging war?"

What do you think my concept is?

Also, just making sure that you saw this one: http://www.politicalforum.com/index...-trump-do-this.532781/page-35#post-1069138800

 

Sounds to me like a plausible definition of "control".. But I have wasted way too much time on a trivial matter that was irrelevant to my point since the beginning anyway.

 

Last time I do your legwork

"The City of Jerusalem shall be established as a corpus separatum under a special international regime and shall be administered by the United Nations. The Trusteeship Council shall be designated to discharge the responsibilities of the Administering Authority on behalf of the United Nations."​

 

Israel can name ANY city they want to as their Capitol. Other countries have to honor that. If fools commit terrorist acts against Israel, they should know by now it will not be ignored. IMO Israel should carpet bomb any area that fires rockets into their country.

 

I'm sorry, but you're going to have to explain how that means that it "officially BELONGS to the United Nations."

 

The UN should create a Deylicate of Palestine, to ensure Order over Chaos.

 

Deylicate?