Defining 'Religion'

Yep, not a single mention of the word religion. The belief in the existence of gods is related to religion only through the definition of religion. If the definition of religion is called into question, then that logic falls.

 

Earlier I gave an example of a 25 ingredient hamburger, if you only use 24 then you no longer fit the definition of that particular hamburger. What makes a definition universal is if #1 main entry includes all versions of known religions, since so many people to too illiterate to properly read a dictionary as we see out here time and time again.

Elements in the definition is religion is identical to ingredients in the definition of a recipe for burgers.

It would be impossible for anyone to correctly claim another does not know what they are talking about if what they are saying is not understood.

I have done no such thing, there is no 'obvious' definition, there are several elements that certain people want to ignore and pretend does not apply to them in your antiquated out of date political so called 'obvious definition'.

Of course knowledge should be universal, it absolute does not affect anyones ability to change the discussion.

No, its a poor solution, as you noted it totally confuses people unless they are willing to read a mountain of philosophy books and sort all that **** out to scratch the surface of what is really being said.

 

yes this has long been settled. Atheism is by definition, not a religion.

 

stomping your feet doesn't change the simple fact that by definition, atheism is not a religion. Sorry.

 

Atheism is by definition, not a religion. Not by the definition of atheism, or the definition of religion.

 

Political logic usually fails. Its been previously articulated in extreme detail, and smith had one post that was stellar, that took everyone step by step through the logical proofs and established with certainty that there is no material difference between disbelief of, belief not, lack of, and all cute buzz words people toss around out here but can never support in a formal argument.

 

I'm not sure I follow. I don't mind people talking about a specific burger, the question is about whether the word is universal.

 

but rahl has already proven that no where in the definition of atheism does it say that its not a religion, I understand threads deviate to make points but that is not the purpose of this thread.

Once again the purpose of this thread is to construct a best fit universal definition for the word religion not argue 5million pages of unsupported denial, so can we get back to the focus of the thread please?

 

That makes no sense.

I would not have made this thread if I thought the main definition was universal. Presently the definition in the number one spot is the sky pilot version which represents only theist version of religion not nontheist.

Its like defining that hamburger that has 25 ingredients by pretending it only contains 'ground beef' and omitting the other 24 ingredients.

It certainly can be universal, universal only means best bell curve fit for all religions today and have known throughout time. The standing 'main' definition as I see only need have a few already existing sub elements brought up to 1) from what I can see, now that philosophy and the courts and ourselves have fleshed out more elements over the years that apply.

 

The definition of atheism, precludes it from being a religion.

Once you lumped in atheism as a religion, you opened yourself up to have that claim, once again, debunked.

 

No where in this thread have I claimed the definition of religion includes 'atheism', or lumped it with anything, you are posting some figment of imagination as I have proven when I dumbed it down proving you wrong, that the definition of atheism does not say it is or is not a religion. I went no further.

I did ask the question if atheism is nontheist to which no one responded.

Again this thread is about determining and constructing a universal definition for religion so please focus on the topic.

 

I responded, and called you out for claiming non theist (atheist) is a religion. it is not.

 

Oh so you think this is a gun fight?

I made no such claim, I said the courts made the claim, then you gave us the definition of atheism to prove its not a religion and no one but you can find anything about religion in the definition.

The word religion isnt even in there FFS! So please can we get back to the thread now?

 

no, it's more like shooting fish in a barrel. Atheism, by definition, is not a religion.

 

Im going to ask you one last time to please stop spamming the thread.

 

I think I need clarification on some points here.

What do you mean by universal? You say "universal only means best bell curve fit for all religions". I'm not really sure what you mean by bell curve fit, it seems to me to imply some measurable, or some analogue to some measurable. In my book, universal means something along the lines of "applicable everywhere or in all cases; general:affecting, concerning, or involving all" (source), "existing everywhere or involving everyone" (source), i.e. a definition which applies in all cases, a definition which others would have to adhere to (i.e. having it imposed on them).

What is it you're referring to as the "main" definition? Also I don't understand what you mean by "brought up to 1)". How are you determining elements "that apply"?

I have never heard of this "sky pilot" which you say is so prevalent. A search on this websites reveals quotes only from you and people who directly quote you. A quick googling indicates that "sky pilot" often refers to military chaplains rather than God.

I'll get back to you on the hamburger thing in a response to another post.

 

I think what you're trying to say is that the conditions specified in a definition are necessary conditions for a word to apply to something, is that right?

Not sure what you mean by "#1 main entry".

Ough, this is a tough sentence to parse. Am I right in interpreting this as "if you can't understand what someone says, how can you claim it's wrong?"?

I think it was pretty obvious what interpretation of the word he was referring to. If you think there is any confusion, you can always ask for clarification.

I don't see why there needs to be a mountain of philosophy books. I can specify what I mean with most words in one, maybe two or three lines.

 

It it's not a religion "by the definition of atheism, or the definition of religion", then by what definition isn't it?

 

Is this a more recent one that you pointed out in a previous thread? I seem to recall having disagreements with that too.

 

greater than a 95% fit would be a nice target.

The greatest usage is #1)

Philosophically, courts.

same as spaghetti monster.

well they are attributes. to be a religion requires several just like the ingredients of a cake.

In other words I understood him and said he was wrong.

He was wrong, that is not a universal definition of religion.

Because they actually pull this apart in a reasonable manner without all the heckling we see here. So its the best place to start not here.

We determined the disagreement was the result of an error in grammar.

 

Did you leave off " faith and worship" for some particular reason? It is part of the definition you posted.

 

Judt for curiosity's sake why are you trying to come up with a definition of religion when you started by posting a perfectly good one from the Oxford Dictionary? Perhaps an attempt to bastardize the definition enough so you can actually claim that athiesm is a religion.

 

Oh? news to me, how or what do you think you see that is not already there? The courts said nontheist is a religion already I have no need to try to get this to apply to atheists they did it, argue with them. The purpose here is merely to account for all the philosophical and legal changes made in one definition that is easily comprehensible rather than piece meal since most people cant read past the first line.

 

yeh good point.

Religion: The personal or social practice of value and faith based beliefs, morals, commitments, self-knowledge, a world view, which may also include worship and a supernatural being or agency.

Admittedly a bit difficult to get in one sentence but that might cut it, see anything else we are missing?

 

huh? By both the definition of atheism, and religion, atheism is not a religion. Where are you getting lost?