"The North Koreans were just messing around, not serious about moving forward"

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by Durandal, Jul 11, 2018.

  1. Iriemon

    Iriemon Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You shouldn't make assertions about things you know nothing about. I have admitted errors plenty of times.

    Why are you wasting my time with this nonsense? Do you have a point?

    No. I asked you what the effect was. The only thing you said was a question to me about when the last nuke test was. To which responded with asking when they started dismantling the nukes.

    I still don't know what you claim is this big effect.
     
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  2. guavaball

    guavaball Well-Known Member

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    Let's see because you've already done it here.

    So much for claiming you admit your errors.

    You pretended only denuclearization is considered progress by your question. I gave you real world progress other than that and what a shocker, you couldn't admit it. Hell, you didn't even know it was going on. Typical.
     
  3. Day of the Candor

    Day of the Candor Well-Known Member

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    Bullshit, Trump didn't give the North Korea anything. Nothing, except an invitation to escape being blown all to hell if they don't give up the nukes. Mark my words, the same "offer" will be given to Iran, and it is "an offer they can't refuse". Kim can play nice and be treated like a rich king for life, or he live in a deep bunker like a roach until we send in a Marine recon team to finish him off. The choice is his. But to date Kim has been given nothing by Trump.
     
  4. Iriemon

    Iriemon Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You ever wonder how that Benghazi "stand down" order bullshit we heard repeated by our RW media and friends a quadrillion times got started?
     
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  5. guavaball

    guavaball Well-Known Member

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    Yes we are safer. No more nuke or missile tests. That's progress. Only a fool wouldn't admit it.
     
  6. PARTIZAN1

    PARTIZAN1 Well-Known Member

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    Not a surprise since even Kim Dung Un plays chess and Trump plays checkers well no dominoes and he knocked them all down the goof. KGB Putin plays chess the three dimensional kind while Trump plays go fish.
     
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  7. PARTIZAN1

    PARTIZAN1 Well-Known Member

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    no I do not recall how but of course know full well that it was just as you said - bullshit.
     
  8. Marcotic

    Marcotic Well-Known Member

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    This is a bummer. I think that Trump was right to meet with Un, but sadly he wasn't able to get anything that sticks. What a shame.

    Hopefully he'll unleash both barrels on NK.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2018
  9. Iriemon

    Iriemon Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    sure.

    Your communication problems are not my errors.

    I'm still waiting for you to identify this great effect.
     
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  10. mdrobster

    mdrobster Well-Known Member

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    i guess the cancellation of military exercises with south korea was unnecessary. once again trump uses his mouth and cant follow up on it.
     
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  11. Durandal

    Durandal Well-Known Member Donor

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    Trump plays the bluff and bluster and intimidation game.
     
  12. Iriemon

    Iriemon Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Grok's little CNN image reminded me of it. But while Grok's image is utter bullshit, this one is true.

    It's off-topic, but an interesting look into how the RW propaganda media creates "scandals" that go on for years.

    This post is a little dated, and I haven't updated my research, but I post i here if you are interested.

    +++

    Fox News Fabrication of "Stand down" story.

    As I noted in my earlier post on page one of this thread, Fox News' original report on the Benghazi "stand down" order contained a huge factual error. It reported that both Woods and Doherty were a mile away when the fighting at the consulate broke out, when in fact Doherty was 600 miles away, in Tripoli.

    I had previously pointed out that Fox's story, based on unnamed "sources," had been changed to delete Doherty, in posts such as this one: http://www.politicalforum.com/curre...i-desperate-gop-attack-26.html#post1062631107

    I went back and compared the original Fox report on the Benghazi "stand down" story with how it was later changed and currently appeared. The changes to the story were far more extensive than I realized.

    You can find the current, changed version of the Fox story on the Fox website, here: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...help-during-benghazi-attack-sources-say.html#

    However, before it was changed, several websites had already picked up and copied their original version. See for example:

    http://hotair.com/archives/2012/10/...ghazi-consulate-during-attack/comment-page-6/
    https://pjmedia.com/blog/report-cia-requested-help-during-benghazi-battle-were-denied-three-times
    https://www.powerlineblog.com/archi...tedly-denied-requests-for-benghazi-relief.php
    http://specialoperationsspeaks.com/articles/cia-denied-requests-for-help-in-benghazi

    Here is how Fox changed their original story. Deletions are in [brackets], and additions are in bold:

    ===

    Fox News has learned from sources who were on the ground in Benghazi that [three] an urgent request[s from the CIA annex for military back-up during the attack on the U.S. Consulate and subsequent attack nearly seven hours later were denied by officials in the CIA chain of command — who also told the CIA operators [twice] to “stand down” rather than help the ambassador’s team when shots were heard at approximately 9:40 p.m. in Benghazi on Sept. 11.

    Former Navy SEAL[s ] Tyrone Woods was [and Glen Doherty were] part of a small team who was [were] at the CIA annex about a mile from the U.S. Consulate where Ambassador Chris Stevens and his team came under attack. When he [they] and others heard the shots fired, they [radioed to inform] informed their higher-ups to tell them what they were hearing and requested permission to go to the consulate and help out. They were told to “stand down,” according to sources familiar with the exchange. [An hour later, they called again to headquarters and ] Soon afterwards, they were again told to “stand down.”

    Woods [, Doherty] and at least two others ignored those orders and made their way to the [Consulate] consulate which at that point was on fire. Shots were exchanged. The [quick reaction force] rescue team from the CIA annex evacuated those who remained at the consulate [Consulate] and Sean Smith, who had been killed in the initial attack. They could not find the ambassador and returned to the CIA annex at about midnight.

    ...

    A Special Operations team, or CIF which stands for Commanders in Extremis Force, operating in Central Europe had been moved to Sigonella, Italy, but they were never told to deploy [too were told to stand down.] A second force that specializes in counterterrorism rescues was on hand at Sigonella, according to senior military and intelligence sources. According to those sources, they could have flown to Benghazi in less than two hours. They were the same distance to Benghazi as those that were sent from Tripoli. Specter gunships are commonly used by the Special Operations community to provide close air support.

    ===

    As you can see, Fox made major changes to the story from when it was first released. However, there is no indication on Fox's website with the changed facts that the facts of the story were ever changed.

    Fox simply changed their report on their website, with no notice that their original version was wrong or had been changed.

    Why would Fox do such a dishonest, misleading thing?

    Because Fox knew that they had a major bombshell by reporting that the Obama administration and/or Clinton told US forces to "stand down" and let people die. And Fox and other RW propaganda media blasted the news cycles with this story over and over again. A google search of "stand down" and Benghazi shows 185,000 articles.

    This explosive accusation provided the impetus for the numerous investigations that led to several Congressional and military investigations and hearings. Which eventually led to the discovery that Clinton used a private email server.

    Fox knew that if they indicated on their website that their unnamed "source" had provided numerous, significant factual errors, it would undermine the credibility of their story, and thus undermine the effectiveness of their fabricated bombshell.

    Of course, the entire "stand down" was a fabrication and lie. Every major bi-partisan investigation has acknowledged that, including *both* the bipartisan (which means that the report that included the Republicans, as well) Senate Select Committee on Intelligence Benghazi Report and the Republican controlled House Permanent Committee on Intelligence Benghazi Report declared emphatically there was no "stand down" order given by the administration.

    Republican controlled House Permanent Committee on Intelligence Benghazi Report
    :

    Finding #6: Appropriate personnel on the ground in Benghazi made the decision to send CIA officers to rescue the State Department officers at the TMF.

    Finding #7: Prior to the CIA security team departing for the TMF, the Annex leadership deliberated thoughtfully, reasonably, and quickly about whether further security could be provided to the team. Although some security officers voiced a greater urgency to depart for the TMF, no officer at CIA was ever told to stand down.

    Finding #8: The decision to send CIA officers from Tripoli to Benghazi to rescue the Ambassador and bolster security of the U.S. personnel in Benghazi was a tactical decision appropriately made by the senior officers on the ground.

    Finding #10: The CIA received all military support that was available. Neither the CIA nor DOD denied requests for air support. One CIA security officer requested a Spectre gunship that he believed was available, but his commanding officer did not relay the request because he correctly knew the gunship was not available.

    http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2014/images/11/21/benghazi.report.pdf

    Senate Select Committee on Intelligence Benghazi bipartisan report:

    The Committee explored claims that there was a "stand down" order given to the security team at the Annex. Although some members of the security team expressed frustration that they were unable to respond more quickly to the Mission compound, 12 the Committee found no evidence of intentional delay or obstruction by the Chief of Base or any other party. ... The Committee has reviewed the allegations that U.S. personnel, including in the IC (Intelligence Community) or DoD, prevented the mounting of any military relief effort during the attacks, but the Committee has not found any of these allegations to be substantiated.

    http://www.intelligence.senate.gov/sites/default/files/press/benghazi.pdf

    Even Fox News had to eventually report there was no "stand down" order, two years after the fabricated story first was published by Fox:

    http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/11/2...ssteps-in-benghazi-attack-gop-controlled.html

    But by then the damage had been done. Their falsified report had provided the meat to support the years of Congressional investigations by the Republican controlled House (which never even asked about "stand down" during the hearings).

    +++

    And to this day, I see lots of conservative who will swear up and down that the Obama administration gave a "stand down" order.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2018
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  13. Dispondent

    Dispondent Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Its early days, its been how long since we had any type of diplomatic relations with North Korea? I guess we know what liberals would do, just send a 'reset' button, spelled wrong of course, because we know that fixes everything, right Russia???
     
  14. LogicalParty

    LogicalParty Well-Known Member

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    They arent going to be "blown all to hell" unless they carry out an act of aggression first. No way in hell the US would launch a full on assault first and not face severe consequences, to think otherwise is foolish.

    Also on the whole nuke thing in general, while I do understand why we want to keep them away from rogue nations or terrorists, it is quite ironic to me how strong armed the United States is when it comes to OTHER countries having nukes when we are literally the only country on this planet that have actively used Nuclear Weapons against another country resulting in potentially up to 200,000 civilian deaths. We didnt just do it once either, we set off TWO nuclear weapons.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2018
  15. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

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    Tragic? He just gave it a shot. I didn't think it would work but I give him credit for trying.
     
  16. Iriemon

    Iriemon Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Oh, thanks. I feel so warm and fuzzy now.
     
  17. LogicalParty

    LogicalParty Well-Known Member

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    Ya and TRUMP wants to talk about a witch hunt investigation. I think Hillary is Number One on the Witch Hunt Agenda
     
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  18. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Oh look another "I hope NK peace fails!" thread.

    Just another thing we'll be laughing over when he proves you wrong, yet again.
     
  19. AKS

    AKS Banned

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    Only a fool would think that just because there hasn't been any recent tests that there won't be any future ones.
     
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  20. LogicalParty

    LogicalParty Well-Known Member

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    Or that they dont need to test anymore?
     
  21. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    When it comes to nukes, we should probably dial down the partisan stupidity and evaluate where we are based on the evidence.

    The evidence is as the OP.

    Ignoring that is somewhere on beyond stupid.
     
  22. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That's not evidence, and every time theres a frown or a bad word, leftists jump on it with glee cackling about how it's failed.

    You know it's true.
     
  23. guavaball

    guavaball Well-Known Member

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    Don't worry, I knew you couldn't admit it.
     
  24. guavaball

    guavaball Well-Known Member

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    How is it my communication problem? Go ahead, quote me where you can back that BS up.

    I already have. Multiple times. No more nuke or missile tests.

    Are you having reading comprehension problems again or just can't muster up the courage to admit that's a good thing?
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2018
  25. Iriemon

    Iriemon Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Sorry. But I cannot admit that the fact that NK has not flown any missiles in the last 6 months makes me feel more confident in donald's statement that "There is no longer a Nuclear Threat from North Korea." It would be dishonest for me to do so.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2018

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