Jews And Feminists

Discussion in 'Women's Rights' started by ibshambat, Aug 5, 2018.

  1. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    What is s brand of feminism? Feminism is a belief in. Equal rights for women..period, nothing more. We don’t have to act a certain way
     
  2. ibshambat

    ibshambat Banned

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    I am speaking especially about 1990s Third Wave feminism, in which men lost jobs for looking at a woman the wrong way, innocent men died in prison for false accusations of rape, liking beauty in women was seen as objectifying, and passionate love was denigrated as obsession or narcissism. I was at quite a vulnerable age at the time, and all this crap stayed in my head, requiring me later to refute it, which has not been an an easy thing to do.
     
  3. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    Men lost jobs for just looking at women the wrong way? Or do you mean masturbating in front of them, drugging them and groping them. .
    Innocent men died in prison for false rape accusations? When one in six women have been raped, and it is one of the hardest crimes to prosecute,you can be sure these aren’t innocents . Who kills them? I
    As I say in my prejudice course, you learn more about a person by the side of the argument they defend. You defend sexual predators and rapists
    Passionate love is narcissism? So you even know what the word means? Sounds like you were deeply hurt by women
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2018
  4. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    You’re cute when you get so emotional that you have to sink to such childish name calling. Well, I did get to you.....especially when you have to speak for others “we” can conclude. That’s what the insecure bullies do.
    You really shouldn’t let me know how much I shook you up. Put me on ignore just because you’re not bright enough to get my arguments isn’t my fault. Ciao!
     
  5. Ritter

    Ritter Well-Known Member

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    Oh mah Gawd, that is so extremist. Wow!

    Don't flatter yourself

    I am telling you, you have never made one single argument.
     
  6. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    I have made arguments repeatedly but don’t blame me if they go over your head.
    It at least you’re learning to control your emotions
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2018
  7. ibshambat

    ibshambat Banned

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    I am sure there were both.

    There was a case in Texas in which a man went to jail for rape and died in prison, then someone else confessed to the crime.

    I also supported my former wife in a very important effort to fight domestic violence.

    I am not saying that passionate love is narcissism, I am saying that some in feminism are saying that.
    We all get hurt in our way, both by women and by men.
     
  8. ibshambat

    ibshambat Banned

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    I am against demonization, and I am against witch hunts. That is the case even when we are dealing with bad people. The biggest problem with the treatment of sex criminals is that they are branded as evil and only capable of being evil. People say that they will never change and will keep re-offending, which is completely wrong, as people change all the time. People have choice and will, and whatever urges they get they are capable of controlling them. The sex offenders are denied the ability to do so, meaning that they are being de-humanized. They are not being treated as people; they are being treated as beasts. So that while I have no intention of committing any kind of a sex crime, I am not going to support an extermination campaign, and I will remind people as to the meaning of Constitution and what rights people have under it, including the sex offenders.
     
  9. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    So because there was one mistaken case, you feel that rapists are an anomaly? There are cases of people mistakingly imprisoned for killing does that mean we shouldn’t jail killers?
    I’m glad you supported your former wife against domestic violence. No one is saying that passionate love is narcissistic.i have never met anyone who said anything that stupid. But the fact that you blame feminists makes you misogynistic
     
  10. ibshambat

    ibshambat Banned

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    Renee, a misogynist is someone who hates women. I do not hate women at all. I do not like all women, but then again neither do you.

    Certainly rape should be seen as a crime. However it should be strictly defined and definition kept to. Is a man a rapist when he has sex with a woman at a hotel room who was there by willing consent, as apparently happened to Bill Clinton? And what about situation, as was the case in my example, when the accusation is wrong?
     
  11. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    I apologize...you are not a misogynist but I do think you are sexist.
    If a man rapes a woman because she is in his hotel room...IT IS RAPE! Remember mike Tyson? No man has a right to rape a woman...period! Stop justifying it
     
  12. ibshambat

    ibshambat Banned

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    All right. Once again, I want it to be defined strictly and definition kept to, so that there can be no confusion on the subject.

    Regarding being sexist, I think that there are some differences between men and women that are natural and others that are socially transmitted. A man cannot bear children. A woman finds it harder to have upper-body strength than does man. When I was a kid I hated taking baths and did not care what I looked like; my daughter loves taking baths and was a fashion princess since she was 3. I know I made no demands of her in that direction.

    It may be undesirable to socialize all boys the same way and all girls the same way. There will always be tomboyish females and effeminate males, and there will always be women who want a more dominating or at least equal position. I think that they should have the right to that; but so should the people who want a traditional role. Some women I know hated female socialization, others were comfortable with it. I say that both should have a right to their choice.
     
  13. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    Of course men and women are different. But the word equal does not mean same.....2 nickels are different from one dime, but they both equal ten cents.
    Most kids don’t like baths....nothing to do with gender. As they get older, they become socialized and we discourage a boy who wants to do what girls do. A boy might like to take a bubble bath with pretty smelling salts but he can’t because of socialization. Boys might like to color their nails bright colors...but they can’t. I think today girls have it better. They can do what boys do and they can do what girls do traditionally.
    Why do the women you know hate female socialization? They obviously have low self esteem
     
  14. ibshambat

    ibshambat Banned

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    Some hate female socialization, others do not. I was once with a woman who had been a tomboy as a child and was unattractive as a teenager; then she became very womanly. She continued to hate the coercion toward an ideal that she wanted nothing to do with and of course she disliked the culture that saw her in a low light. She was a brilliant woman, and she taught me a lot.
    There were other women with whom I have been who were classically beautiful. They did not take objection to female socialization, where they parted ways with the crowd was when the crowd had no value for their art.
     
  15. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    Hardly a post goes by when you don’t focus on how pretty a woman is....that’s sexist and you don’t even realize it.
    Please tell me what female socialization is that women you know don’t like? What is male socialization? Do all men like it
     
  16. ibshambat

    ibshambat Banned

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    The woman in question disliked the way in which women were being raised. She particularly disliked the social fronts that people were wearing.
    Male socialization is hateful to many men as well. I did not like it when I was growing up either. I am not the football type, and many people thought that I was a sissie. However at this age I am in better shape than most men my age, including ones who had been jocks.
     
  17. ibshambat

    ibshambat Banned

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    No, I don't realize it. Would you be sexist if you found Johnny Depp to be handsome?
    I enjoy it when people think that I am physically attractive. I do not feel "objectified" by it. I see no reason why woman, especially a woman who puts lots of effort into looking good, would dislike being appreciated for her appearance.
     
  18. DarkDaimon

    DarkDaimon Well-Known Member

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    Nothing like strawmen and gross generalizations.
     
  19. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    This is exactly what feminism is about...breaking the gender roles. Interesting men were sissies and looked down upon, but Tom boys were cool
     
  20. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    We are t talking about Johnny debb . We are talking about women’s roles in society and you keep mentioning her looks. We don’t do that with men
     
  21. ibshambat

    ibshambat Banned

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    Sure, but women do tend to like muscled men more than weak men. And I say this as someone who has been both in good shape and in bad shape, and who was much more appealing to women when I was in good shape than when I was not.
     
  22. ibshambat

    ibshambat Banned

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    All right, there is merit to that. However I would like to caution against seeing all differences between men and women as being a result of socialization. There are natural differences between men and women, and in a number of ways they are in women's favor.
     
  23. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    Such as?
     
  24. ibshambat

    ibshambat Banned

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    Well, for one thing, you can bear children and we can't.
     
  25. Renee

    Renee Well-Known Member

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    And you can pee standing up.
     
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