Sweden is Not a Socialist Success

Discussion in 'Budget & Taxes' started by Hoosier8, Mar 7, 2019.

  1. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    I'm not talking about fighting for your life, I'm talking about working for your life. Domestic animals, while sometimes limited by the conditions of their servitude, STILL try to 'work' all day, every day. Whether it's dogs guarding the family or herding sheep, cats sitting in windows watching for prey to kill, or horses attempting to spend all their waking hours grazing. They retain their 'work ethic' in full.
     
  2. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    You also missed the point, entirely.
     
  3. bringiton

    bringiton Well-Known Member

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    Nonsense. They just do what instinct, training, and the conditions of the moment tell them to do. They have no work ethic. Big cats in zoos have to be exercised, or they'll just sit around lazing between meals.
     
  4. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    all countries have their problems, in 1929 people prob pointed to us as an example of a capitalist society

    personally I think it is corporatism that will be our downfall
     
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  5. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    o_O
     
  6. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    You do understand that instinct is always for survival, yes? "Work ethic" is simply the phrase we use to describe the same thing in humans.

    This isn't about the benefits of safety and modern medicine (no one is arguing that both aren't advantageous to lifespan - in humans AND animals), this is about the loss of the instinct to 'work'. The drivers to hunt/graze etc. As you put it .. keep feeding those big cats and they'll lie around getting fat.
     
  7. Distraff

    Distraff Well-Known Member

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    Its funny how conservatives like to cherry pick the bad things about other countries to feel better about ourselves.
     
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  8. bringiton

    bringiton Well-Known Member

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    No, instinct is only statistically for survival, and in the context it evolved in. It may lead to death in other circumstances, such as when fish instinctively try to eat bait.
    No, the work ethic is not instinctive.
    Exactly. We do need to think about the conditions that will lead people to thrive, not just survive.
     
  9. bringiton

    bringiton Well-Known Member

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    Corporations are just a vehicle. It is privilege that is the real danger.
     
  10. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Corporations are becoming as powerful as governments, and they only care about profits, not the people or the employees, they have no patriotism
     
  11. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    1) you are wrong, sorry. all animal instinct is predicated on survival. the occassional negative outcome is not relevant .. no system is perfect.

    2) yes, it's very instinctive, because in all contexts bar modern First World human life, it's survival.

    3) no we bloody well don't. we need ONLY consider survival - of humans/earth/animals. it's the seeking always more (the great vanity of the First Worlder) that led us to this state in the first place.
     
  12. bringiton

    bringiton Well-Known Member

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    But they only have power because of privilege.
     
  13. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    And what 'privilege' is that? Magical luck pixies?
     
  14. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    because the privileged are profiting from them

    the problem with corporations is they are not able to just be profitable, they have to be more profitable every year

    a family owned business is just happy being profitable

    so corps have to outsource jobs overseas or whatever they can do
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2019
  15. JakeStarkey

    JakeStarkey Well-Known Member

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    The 'work ethic' is a manifestation of the 'survival instinct.'

    Most humans will only work as hard as they need in order to survive
     
  16. bringiton

    bringiton Well-Known Member

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    No, I am indisputably correct as a matter of objective physical fact, sorry, and I will thank you to remember it.
    Wrong. It's simply something that worked in the past. It may or may not work now. Evolution is like that.
    The system isn't a system. It's just whatever survived. It's totally contingent. There's no plan behind it. You're just wrong.
    Wrong again. Whether it's survival or not depends on context. If resources are abundant, reproduction has priority. If resources are scarce, parsimonious use has priority. It's just whatever works in the context.
    Yes we bloody well do, because that's how human society works.
    Wrong. We have to think about how the context will change.
    Nonsense. That's ultimately just evolution, too.
     
  17. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    Exactly my point.
     
  18. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    Oh you'll thank me, will you?

    Meantime ... you just keep getting wronger. Evolution is nowhere NEAR expunging the survival instinct. When/if it ever does, we'll be dead within a year.

    You seem wholly incapable of factoring human/animal nature into any of your machinations. Your theories end up fantastical and nonsensical as a result.
     
  19. bringiton

    bringiton Well-Known Member

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    No, corporations are just a vehicle for owning privilege.
    Wrong.
    LOL! Wrong.
    Outsourcing jobs only makes sense because privilege has made employing workers uneconomic. When each worker has to be paid enough to support the overclass of rich, greedy, privileged parasites as well as himself, his family, and the government, it's harder for his productivity to justify his wages.
     
  20. bringiton

    bringiton Well-Known Member

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    Privilege is a legal entitlement to benefit from the abrogation of others' rights without making just compensation, like a taxi medallion, a slave deed, a land title, a patent or copyright, a bank license, a private utility monopoly, etc.
     
  21. bringiton

    bringiton Well-Known Member

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    Yep. Not that I expect to have occasion to...
    Uh-oh. I think I smell some more absurd and disingenuous garbage coming....
    Ah, I was right: a complete non sequitur.
    Another statement that, inevitably, bears no relation to anything I have said.
    Another claim with no basis in anything I have said. I have identified the relevant facts of both human and animal nature, facts that you ignore and hope will go away.
    There is nothing fantastical or nonsensical about liberty, justice, and truth.
     
  22. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    we will have to agree to disagree then, as greedy corporatism is hurting this country
     
  23. JakeStarkey

    JakeStarkey Well-Known Member

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    Excellent comments, FreshAir.
     
  24. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    what manner of 'corporatism' would you prefer? give us the lowdown on your alternative :)
     
  25. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    You offer NO SOLUTION WHATSOEVER, you just keep bleating Freedom! Liberty! Justice! It's the equivalent of walking around shouting "I'm hungry!", in the hope someone will torque that feeling into a sandwich. Do all the thinking for you, then do all the work for you. And you're not even that clear, since hunger is the same thing to all people.
     

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