Humans Will Never Colonize Mars

Discussion in 'Science' started by Lil Mike, Aug 1, 2019.

  1. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    We have a world of unrest...there are any number of possible scenarios in which we have major wars...what resources will it take to mitigate global climate change issues...how precarious is the US and other's economies...we have a burgeoning population with it's problems...everyone top to bottom including the government is deep in debt...and many people are too stupid to understand and support space exploration. These and many others not mentioned are why I have no problem 'projecting'...
     
  2. Dayton3

    Dayton3 Well-Known Member

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    current problems are neither unprecedented.

    nor unsolvable
     
  3. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Well, when it comes down to it that isn't the real issue.

    We can come up with methods of solving engineering problems when the cost matches the value of the solution when compared to other problems.

    As yet, I don't see a valid reason for human visits to Mars, the Moon or to asteroids.

    We have robots to do what needs to be done, and at a far lower cost. In fact, the budget process is likley to cause cutbacks in science related to Earth as the expense of engineering men in space is so extreme - a tradeoff that I do NOT see as justified by any measure of value.

    And, we are now over the trillion dollar marke in deficit THIS YEAR, while failing to improve our infrastructure, failing to ensure citizens get healthcare, failing to take action related to our changing climate, failing to address the extreme cost of education that is tied so closely to continued economic competitiveness, failing to protect our own democracy, etc., etc.
     
  4. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    I think that full-on colonisation of Mars will not be done by governments but by private enterprise and will take place in 300-500 years. Given air and oceans Mars will be very pleasant place, and will probably be a resort, sort of a giant Hamptons in Space. It could make an interesting TV show, combining elements of 90210 with Space 1999.

    Anybody wanna help me pitch it?:p
     
  5. tecoyah

    tecoyah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Heres your promo video.
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2019
  6. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    Zach, a settler and farmboy from Helles Plantia, moves with his parents to Tempe Terra, the ritizest zip code on Mars. Trying to fit in with cool kids at Viking Lander High proves to be a struggle, but then he meets popular girl Xenon, and decides she's a gas...
     
  7. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    If people ever have to go to Mars to find a pleasant environment we SERIOUSLY screwed up Earth!
     
  8. politicalcenter

    politicalcenter Well-Known Member

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    The Earth needs to be managed better and every community should be responsible for its own environment. But this will take the sacrifice of some freedom and some short term profit. And we must understand what we are willing sacrifice to attain that goal. We need to find alternatives.
     
  9. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    This is where I run into serious disagreement with environmentalists. Done right, environmentalism should MAKE money and give us BETTER lives. It shouldn't really involve sacrifice at all
     
  10. Aleksander Ulyanov

    Aleksander Ulyanov Well-Known Member

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    Yes and no. Mars has much less gravity than Earth and would be a rather large and totally pristine environment. Given air and water some parts could be very nice. OTOH it would probably be a serious crime to pluck a flower and dust storms making Australia's worst seem a clear day would be commonplace
     
  11. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    I disagree...IMO humans collectively have reached their potential. Sure we have some smart people who can solve most all problems, and we have emerging technologies, but as a stupid society we don't have the will or ability to solve today's complex issues...
     
  12. Dayton3

    Dayton3 Well-Known Member

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    What makes you think that?
     
  13. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    Simple observations of my interactions with people all day, watching reports of society, how government functions, etc. and the basic fact that today we are not solving problems. It's as if humans have reached a plateau and that's it! Collectively, we are incapable of clearly and concisely defining the actual problems/issues, and IMO if we can't define the problems, we can't solve the problems. Things like religion, politics, economic status, personal greed, etc. etc. prevent us from unbiased open-minded dialogue. You can observe this in every thread here on PF...
     
  14. Dayton3

    Dayton3 Well-Known Member

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    Political Forum threads are hardly emblematic of the world as a whole. Or even of the internet as a whole
     
  15. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    PF is a perfect example of people from all walks of life discussing singular issues yet finding zero consensus...without unbiased open dialogue and the ability to find consensus we are doomed...
     
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  16. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    I doubt you on that.

    Much of our leadership today sees science as a subversive enemy of the state.

    It's not just people on PF who see our own government as the enemy.

    We show NO interest in holding our leadership to the truth on ANY subject.

    Racism and jingoism are well established in our government. The latest move to kill children by sending them to countries that can't keep them alive is just one such case. The idea of taking children away from families with NO plan to EVER return them is what we expect out of tiny, cheap, dictatorships - yet WE do that!

    Our direction is so totally "me first" that we can't even work with allies.

    And, significant operators in our own governments are actually working to deny democracy to those they hate.

    I would suggest that PF is BETTER that one heck of a lot of our nation as a whole!
     
  17. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

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    It would be cheaper to inhabit caves on Earth.
     
  18. RoccoR

    RoccoR Well-Known Member Donor

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    RE: Humans Will Never Colonize Mars
    ⁜→ Lil Mike, raytri, Robert Urbanek, et al,

    I agree with the bottom line presented by "raytri" and "Robert Urbanek." Not in our lifetime.

    (COMMENT)

    Extraordinary accomplishments are generally induced by extraordinary events and inspired people.

    Breaking open Antartica would only require the discovery of a significant deposit of an incentive and motive (example: Oil, Rhodium Rh Z•45, Painite, Tritium (Radioactive Hydrogen), and Taaffeite) to name a few. Oil is relatively cheap (lowest potential of return) in comparison to the other examples. Another attraction would be the discovery of an ore containing a very high concentration of Niobium Nb Z•41 the key here is that it has a high Transition temperature Tc(K) 9.26º = -443ºF (magnetic energy, magnetic propulsion, and electric power generation and transmission). (Hint: The temperature in the void between planets, the void between star systems and galaxies, the temperature in space is generally considered to be 2.725 Kelvin which is -454.72°F (-270.4°C). That means that superconductive systems can operate in open/exposed space; ie → Cold Power Generation). (The military would love it for energy weapons systems.)

    But, in terms of space exploration, there is an exponential use for superconduction material in the cold dead of space.

    The surface of Mars is covered in all iron oxide and Basalt.

    Anyway, these are just a few of my thoughts.

    ........ •  Smaller then Smallest.png
    Most Respectfully,
    R
     
  19. KAMALAYKA

    KAMALAYKA Banned

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    Have you ever been on a fast-spinning amusement park ride? These same laws would have to be utilized but on a grand scale. It would take years of R&D to figure it out.
     
  20. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    I totally get how centrifugal force can be used to simulate gravity in space. I just don't get how you do that on a planetary surface. If there is an actual proposal for this, I would like to see it but the idea itself seems nonsensical.
     
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  21. politicalcenter

    politicalcenter Well-Known Member

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    I would consider weights like ankle weights . And also lifting weights. Squats and stuff.... bench press.
     
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  22. RoccoR

    RoccoR Well-Known Member Donor

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    RE: Humans Will Never Colonize Mars
    ⁜→ Lil Mike, et al,

    "Lil Mike" has the right Idea. You make a "Neutral Weight Chart" just like when I put diving weights on to compensate for the fact that I am want to be neutrally buoyant between15 to 30 feet. It is not a big deal. Drivers that want to dive deeper will adjust their weights accordingly.

    Take an Earth Bathroom Scale to Mars. Step on it. Keep adding weights until it reads your Earth Weight.

    I don't recommend putting the weights on your ankles unless you talk to your physical therapist first.

    ........ •  Smaller then Smallest.png
    Most Respectfully,
    R
     
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2019
  23. OldManOnFire

    OldManOnFire Well-Known Member

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    I'm thinking plants, animals and humans who have evolved in Earth's 1G of gravity will not do well on other planets with significantly greater or lower gravities. If this is true, and artificial gravity cannot be created, what can we do? Maybe genetic engineering can be used? Maybe some types of physiological adjustments can be made to the human once they arrive in a foreign gravity? Maybe we let evolution do it's job and correct the problem after a few hundred/thousand/million years?

    I remain a proponent of building gigantic space ships, with all the amenities of Earth, and having humans remain in artificial space until they can find the perfect place to colonize...
     
  24. Daggdag

    Daggdag Well-Known Member

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    One problem. This guy really has no idea what he's talkng about. He is lists things that "Could happen" as if it's a sure thing that they will. They have ever done zero g or low g tests on fetuses or pregnant women, so there is no way to know exactly how they would react.
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2019
  25. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    It was one of my disappointments of the International Space Station that it wasn't designed to rotate to provide artificial gravity. Studying the effects of centrifugal force on human bodies is job one to even thinking of building any sort of long term space habitat.
     

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