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As Climate Worsens, a Cascade of Tipping Points Looms

Discussion in 'Environment & Conservation' started by skepticalmike, Dec 15, 2019.

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  1. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Surface temperature data series are useless in a quantitative sense. They are corrupted by urban heat islands and land utilization factors. Additionally they include sea surface temperatures which have nothing to do with atmospheric reradiation.
     
    AFM, Dec 22, 2019
    #401
  2. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Oh! Bunkum!

    upload_2019-12-23_0-56-41.jpeg
    https://skepticalscience.com/urban-heat-island-effect.htm
    https://climate.nasa.gov/faq/44/can-you-explain-the-urban-heat-island-effect/
    https://rmets.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1002/qj.2642

    Soooooo, the hypothesis is that scientists are totally unaware of the Urban Heat Island effect, have no idea how to review the data in relation to this..........

    Is that what you are suggesting?
     
    Bowerbird, Dec 22, 2019
    #402
  3. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Because none of the factors that caused the previous warming’s are happening now

    And if people are refusing to read your references it is usually because either you are not giving specific enough instructions I.e. chapter and page or your references are rubbish with less valid information than the back of a cereal box
     
    Bowerbird, Dec 22, 2019
    #403
  4. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Hmmmmm and some of that trend are things like genetic modification etc but that won’t save agriculture from droughts and flooding rains that come in the wrong season etc
     
    Bowerbird, Dec 22, 2019
    #404
  5. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That’s exactly what I and many others are saying. I’ve given you the references on this.
     
    AFM, Dec 22, 2019
    #405
  6. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Solar and oceanic cycles are not happening now ??? I’ve you a free book which you refuse to read which details all of this.
     
    AFM, Dec 22, 2019
    #406
  7. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Droughts and floods are weather events. There is no evidence that frequency of those is increasing. Agriculture will continue to increase in magnitude and yield as the climate warms and CO2 increases.
     
    AFM, Dec 22, 2019
    #407
  8. Shook

    Shook Well-Known Member

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    Shook, Dec 22, 2019
    #408
  9. Shook

    Shook Well-Known Member

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    They've been studying the effect to which you refer going back at least to the late '70s. Whether they're aware of what they've been doing all this time is frankly anyone's guess.
     
    Shook, Dec 22, 2019
    #409
  10. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It took an alleged denier to point out how it was affecting the records. In many cases it still has not been corrected.
     
    Hoosier8, Dec 22, 2019
    #410
  11. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    And as a development engineer if data is corrupted it must be thrown out and not “adjusted”.

    Also in many cases the raw data has been lost forever. It was deleted after being “massaged” by Dr. Phil.
     
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2019
    AFM, Dec 22, 2019
    #411
    Hoosier8 likes this.
  12. skepticalmike

    skepticalmike Well-Known Member

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    "the majority of cases global warmings have occurred with no increase in CO2" - that is false. All interglacial periods coincided with a rise in CO2 and this was a very significant effect.
    Methane and nitrous oxide generally track CO2 and also contributed to warming. It is impossible to account for the positive or negative swings in temperature without taking into acount
    the radiative forcing of carbon dioxide.

    Both graphs are from Wikipedia.

    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2019
    skepticalmike, Dec 22, 2019
    #412
  13. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    In your charts warming precedes CO2 increases. That’s been pointed out in this same thread.
     
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2019
    AFM, Dec 22, 2019
    #413
  14. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Yes McIntyre found a handful of unadjusted sites some 10-20 years ago which have since been reviewed and where necessary adjusted since then he has run a website trying to find more. Now we are talking a handful of sites, mostly USA out of tens of thousands worldwide. Added to that is that those temperature gauges, which are affected, so they show a higher reading than the unaffected gauges are showing the same upward trends
     
    Bowerbird, Dec 22, 2019
    #414
  15. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Yes and there is an explanation for that and we have provided those references in the past
     
    Bowerbird, Dec 22, 2019
    #415
  16. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Dr Phil? The TV presenter? Did he adjust data? How many? Where? When? Was it in all sites across the world or just a handful?

    Really old chap you are talking about a 20 year old storm in a teacup
     
    Bowerbird, Dec 22, 2019
    #416
  17. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    You mean anyone who has not bothered to google “urban heat island effect” and been swamped by published scientific papers?
     
    Bowerbird, Dec 22, 2019
    #417
  18. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Why do you reference McIntyre ???
     
    AFM, Dec 22, 2019
    #418
  19. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    No idea what this has to do with my post about vacations and money saving, sorry.
     
    crank, Dec 22, 2019
    #419
  20. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Of course there is an explanation. As the climate warms more CO2 is released into the atmosphere.
     
    AFM, Dec 22, 2019
    #420
  21. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Phil Jones. Heard of him ???
     
    AFM, Dec 22, 2019
    #421
  22. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Bowerbird, Dec 22, 2019
    #422
  23. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    AFM, Dec 22, 2019
    #423
  24. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    If by 'warm' you mean 110 degrees, then yes.
     
    crank, Dec 22, 2019
    #424
  25. AFM

    AFM Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Corrupted measurements must be thrown out. That’s basic scientific ethics.
     
    AFM, Dec 22, 2019
    #425
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