Biden says no tax increases for incomes under $400k- It's not true.

Discussion in 'Elections & Campaigns' started by DentalFloss, Oct 13, 2020.

  1. DentalFloss

    DentalFloss Well-Known Member

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    Absolute codswallop. Please justify this crap if you can.

    Fact 1: Biden wants to repeal Trump's "tax cuts for billionaires". Or millionaires. Or just rich people, depending on what day of the week he brings it up.

    Fact 2a: The above tax cuts applied to ALL people who pay federal income taxes, including the working poor, middle class, and yes, the rich, millionaires, and billionaires.

    Fact 2b: Said tax cuts did not apply to only those who made $400k or above.

    Conclusion: Biden intends to increase taxes on ALL taxpayers, not just those at the magic $400k threshold and above.

    Several things to note: The facts outlined are simply that: FACTS. They are not opinions, and are not subject to dispute or debate. It is simply math. Therefore, the conclusion MUST be true because the facts AND the statement of limiting future tax increases to only those above $400k CANNOT both be true. Once again, it's just math.

    So your move, Biden backers. Tell me how he manages to repeal the tax cuts without also raising taxes on virtually every American (except those who don't make enough to pay income taxes AT ALL), and limits tax increases to only those at $400k in income and above.

    And.... GO!!!!

    This outta be good...
     
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  2. Horhey

    Horhey Well-Known Member

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    The Dems aren't going to raise taxes at all because their donors don't want it.
     
  3. HonestJoe

    HonestJoe Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Not a Biden supporter (or American) and don't know the details of any of the policies involved but wouldn't the obvious answer to your question be for him to repeal Trumps tax cuts and replace them with a different set of tax cuts that only apply to incomes below $400K?

    Of course, it all seems a bit odd and overly simplistic since income tax is minimal for the very wealthy due to various avoidance/evasion schemes and either addressing those schemes or targeting capital gains tax would be more effective in changing the actual tax they pay in either direction.
     
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  4. StarFox

    StarFox Banned

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    Trump lies, Trump lies, Trump lies............well has anyone on the left taken a glance at Harris or Biden, they never lie, huh? I am waiting for the day one of those two actually tell the truth,.........nah, never gonna happen.
     
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  5. DentalFloss

    DentalFloss Well-Known Member

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    Wait, wut??? You're suggesting that the (D)s aren't going to raise taxes?? That's the funniest thing I've heard all week, (D)s have never met a tax increase they didn't love, except maybe the ones that affect the working poor and others whose votes they need to buy.
     
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  6. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    Is your goal in raising rates to get the highest earners to give up a higher percentage of the their income to somehow make it even or something or to bring in the most revenue?
     
  7. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    Well they in fact want to give the rich BACK a tax break Trump took from them.
     
  8. wgabrie

    wgabrie Well-Known Member Donor

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    I think that your conclusion is correct. Tax increases all around! I can accept those facts.

    What? You were expecting a gymnastics show?
     
  9. gringo

    gringo Well-Known Member Donor

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    if the choice is a crazy lunatic as president or higher taxes..

    I will happily pay
     
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  10. PPark66

    PPark66 Well-Known Member

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    That would be a worth while trade-off if and only if Trumper’s existed in a reality-based world, what are the odds?

    “Repeal the TCJA’s individual tax cuts for tax payers with incomes above $400,000.”

    The plain text.
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2020
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  11. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    Trump gave 85% of his tax cuts to people making more than $400,000 per year.
    So, he won't raise taxes on people making less than $400,000 per year.
    See above. He can claw back at least 85% of the tax cut without raising taxes on people making less than $400,000 per year.
    It doesn't follow.
    This doesn't make sense.
    All he has to do is restore the taxes on those making $400,000 and he gets about 85% of the Trump tax cut back.

    Trump lied about not cutting taxes for rich people. He said he wouldn't, got himself elected, then he screwed Joe and Jane American.
     
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  12. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    The goal is to make the rich, and only the rich, pay more to fund social programs like free tertiary education, universal healthcare, and a GND.

    (I'm not sure whether the rich CAN fund ALL those things simultaneously...)

    Because inequality is soaring, in the face of entrenched poverty and flat-lining median wages growth for the bottom 50%.

    I have a better scheme, which AOC can inform you about...

    To wit:

    "Money doesn't grow on rich people": Stephanie Kelton.

    "The Deficit Myth", by the same author.

    However, in the meantime, Gates and Buffett want to pay more tax to support government spending, given the egregious developing inequality noted above.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2020
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  13. Horhey

    Horhey Well-Known Member

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    Right-wing misinformation.

    RIP: The Bush Tax Cuts; They Have Become The Obama Tax Cuts - Business Insider

    Revealed: super-rich donate to Cuomo as he rejects tax hikes for billionaires

    Call for NY to raise taxes on ultra-rich instead of cutting Medicaid during coronavirus

    “In a strange way,” Biden said in November 1980, “the election of Ronald Reagan is more consistent with the budgetary thrust that a guy like me . . . has been going for the past few years.”

    Joe Biden Has a Long History of Giving Republicans Exactly What They Want

    Joe Biden's Budget-Cutting Dogma Is a Threat to Public Health
     
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  14. HonestJoe

    HonestJoe Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    My only intention was to address the logical mistake/misrepresentation in the OPs argument. It was about what Biden (or any other leader for that matter) could do, not what they should do.
     
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  15. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    The funny thing is Trump, against RW orthodoxy, is now prepared to let government debt boom, with unfunded tax cuts for the rich (but not for Dem. policy choices, of course) ...even Rush Limbaugh has said "no-one thinks balanced (government) budgets are necessary now".

    So why raise taxes, when government debt doesn't matter....?
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2020
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  16. cd8ed

    cd8ed Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The tax increases for people making under $400,000.00 would be less than 1% after the second year and has already been reviewed by The American Enterprise Institute, a right-of-center think tank
    https://www.aei.org/research-produc...joe-bidens-tax-proposals-october-2020-update/
    https://nymag.com/intelligencer/202...nk-tank-rich-middle-class-economy-growth.html
    https://thehill.com/policy/finance/...s-would-cut-taxes-for-most-households-in-2021

    We must see an increase in taxes and a decrease in spending to get our ignored fiscal house in order after being trashed by two Republicans that did nothing during their terms but spend more money each year (spending under Obama declined every year but two). And everyone needs to have skin in the game — including “billionaires” that are paying $750.00 per year.

    Fiscal conservatives should vote Biden it seems.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2020
  17. Horhey

    Horhey Well-Known Member

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    So now the Democrats once again have an excuse to institute austerity for their corporate donors. Congressional Dems already said they're not going to repeal Trump's tax cuts. That means cuts to entitlements like Obama and Clinton did. Left untouched will be increases in the military budget and subsidies for corporations.

    http://politicalforum.com/index.php...e-oil-drilling-while-americans-suffer.579696/

    You're believing this just for the sake of being a good Democrat. And in the middle of a depression no less. Look into Modern Monetary theory. You're being duped.

     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2020
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  18. cd8ed

    cd8ed Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I am far from a Democrat but closer than I am to Republican I guess.
    As to your comments I would rather have a new leader that is promising to do something vs one that isn’t doing anything but exacerbating the issue.

    As to your nearly 35 minute video, I am not watching it — if you have a point to make from it or a specific portion feel free to post it.
     
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  19. Horhey

    Horhey Well-Known Member

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    Summed up by Alan Greenspan to Paul Ryan explaining why Social Security doesn't need to be privatized for it to be solvent.

     
  20. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    the Trump tax cuts expire on their own for the working class

    they are only permanent for the corps, did you forget they were temporary for the working class?

    if dems have the votes they can pass a perm tax cuts for those making used 400k
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2020
  21. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    So you believe the purpose of the tax system in our free society is to equalize incomesby taking from some and giving it to others? Can you point me to a country that has done this and had better outcomes for citizens? And Gates and Buffett are free to donate all the money the money they want to the United States government.
     
  22. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

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    What do you mean by "equalize"? (I suspect a strawman argument...(


    [
    Virtually every country has a degree of tax transference, and no other 1st world country displays the hyper-partisanship, political dysfunction and degree of inequality - wealth alongside entrenched poverty - as the US.


    [
    Government ought not depend on charity.
     
  23. Spim

    Spim Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Realistically it would be a hybrid keeping <400k stable, repealing SALT, and a pretend punishment for the rich due to above workarounds. Closing some loopholes doesn't seem to be in the cards.

    I doubt there would be changes to Capitol gains but I would like that and raising the ss cap as well.
     
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  24. Professor Peabody

    Professor Peabody Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Last edited: Oct 15, 2020
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  25. Tahuyaman

    Tahuyaman Well-Known Member

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    Biden has promised to repeal “the Trump tax cuts”. He didn’t promise to cut only parts of the tax cuts.

    The Trump tax cuts gave millions of middle and working class Americans, people earning far less than 400k a year a cut in their federal income tax. Repealing those tax cuts would mean those people will realize an increase in their federal income tax rate.

    Either Biden is lying about his tax plan, or he doesn’t know the facts of the most recent tax reforms.
     
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