Wasn't the Democratic Hoax supposed to go away after the election?

Official CDC number is 222,190 of deaths involved coronavirus as of 11/12/2020
that is it.
Since coronavirus / rhinoviruss and other common cold viruses were killing people in the past we have to identify how many people were killed specifically by COVID-19.

 

not running back to Hitler at all. In fact, nazism has been falsely reported as "right wing"

Do you understand what it means to be right wing? It means individual liberty above oppressive government

Leftists love control of the individual

 

much like the flu and the common cold. And, there are "flu shots" but guess what, people die each year due to complications of the flu just like people will die due to complications from covid. And, the super majority of deaths are those with co-morbidities, again, just like with the flu.

Locking down and masking up has turned into control by govt, not good practice.

Lines in hospitals and people dying in the hallways. That sure makes a good fiction novel but is not reality

 

Yes, people die every year of complications from the flu.

But it doesn't overload the healthcare system. And it doesn't do it mostly worldwide at the same time.

And your last sentence shows your lack of reading comprehension skills. No one said: Lines in hospitals and people dying in the hallways.

 

Uh-huh, rriiggghttt, we hears ya

I guess you'll eventually be like the guy I was arguing with last year, trying to say Mussolini wasn't a fascist.

 

Most importantly the flu doesn't kill people in 4 percent of cases. It does so in like .4 percent of cases (4 tenths of one percent)

 

your own post, #42 in this thread

below are your words

There are some folks who will never understand, that social distancing and limiting gatherings is to slow down spread. NOT STOP IT.

So the healthcare system doesn't over load and people die in the aisle ways at hospitals.
So the healthcare workers stay as safe as possible and not have so many out sick they can't staff hospitals.

 

From the Enc. Britannica website; 'Right, portion of the political spectrum associated with conservative political thought. The term derives from the seating arrangement of the French revolutionary parliament (c. 1790s) in which the conservative representatives sat to the presiding officer’s right. In the 19th century the term applied to conservatives who supported authority, tradition, and property. In the 20th century a divergent, radical form developed that was associated with fascism. '

No mention of personal freedom or liberty there.

And exactly how much did the 20th century right-wing, regimes of Chile, Brazil and Argentina for example love liberty and individual rights?

You seem to have your own personal definition of 'right wing'. Which is fine but its not something you can then impose on the real world.

Liberty and freedom may be what you perceive to be the core values of right wing politics in America (we'll overlook McCarthy for a minute) but they are not values you can claim exclusively for the right - there democratic left wing governments operating successfully today (Northern Europe comes to mind) and they place high regard on personal liberty. Read up on your history, its rife with examples of governments who supported right wing political agendas via oppressive means.

 

Firstly there are simple, highly accurate tests that readily differentiate between COVID and other types of viral infection. Cause of death is not listed as COVID if the virus is not or has not been present in their system shortly before they died.

Secondly persons undergoing treatment for COVID especially in hospital are monitored by medical staff. Those Doctors and nurses observe and document the deteriorating condition of those patients in real time as the disease progresses. Those records are kept and are subject/open to review.

Thirdly the virus leaves certain identifiable traces in the bodies of many of those with severe reactions including certain distinct inflammatory and clotting reactions that can be observed post death.

So the ugly truth is that, like it or not the vast majority of deaths listed as 'COVID' are COVID. Even allowing as I noted before that the frail,elderly and those with underlying conditions can be killed by those conditions COVID is what pushed their systems to breaking point. In most cases.

So the figure stays where it is, around the 230,000 mark. Some small margin for error? perhaps, but not enough to make a real difference in how grim the total is.

 

You might find this interesting from the 2017-18 flu season.

https://www.statnews.com/2018/01/15/flu-hospital-pandemics/

Pull quote:

 

Correct. I didn't say the hospitals are overloaded with people or dying in aisleways.
Thx for proving I did not.

 

From your link:

But if something as foreseeable as a flu season — albeit one that is pretty severe — is stretching health care to its limits, what does that tell us about the ability of hospitals to handle the next flu pandemic?

That question worries experts in the field of emergency preparedness, who warn that funding cuts for programs that help hospitals and public health departments plan for outbreaks and other large-scale events have eroded the very infrastructure society will need to help it weather these types of crises.

And guess what. We got caught underfunded and unprepared.

 

Yep. As I said in another thread today, we deserved this Darwin Award.

 

In the absence of COVID-19 the same people would be killed by some kind of COVID-18 or 17 or whatever the most aggressive is identified at that particular time. Sometimes it is flue, sometimes it is common cold that has mutated unexpectedly.
We have to isolate real excess of deaths caused by COVID-19 subtracting possible deaths that would happen without COVID-19. Also in March, April and May doctors had no idea what COVID-19 was so they were issued diagnosis COVID-19 willy nilly anticipating special compensation from the government.

 

So what do you think caused the death in excess of 250,000 people from all causes if not Covid?

 

The point is NONE of those things have happened. There is no COVID - 17,18 (insert our lucky number here). There is only COVID 19. The flu season this year has been a mild one with far fewer deaths recorded than in previous 'bad' years. And, if you were unlucky enough to get both a cold and COIVID 19 at the same time and you are in one of the susceptible sub-groups (the sick, elderly etc). Having a cold, makes no difference, its the COVID that kills you not the cold, simply because it places far, far more stress on the body in such cases.

Your talking hypotheticals and 'what if's' not reality.

Really? And who is going to do that? You? Are you a trained medical statistician? As for the early figures. Even suggesting that indicates you are NOT trained in statistics. You are talking about arbitrarily removing early deaths from the curve. But here is the point - they WERE early in the curve. Far fewer people died from COVID in March, April and even May 2020 in the US than have died since. Go back and look up the numbers of deaths attributed to COVID from day 1 of its appearance in the US through to day 90. Then look at the total number of persons who have died since. Its not a liner progression, not even close.

So none of your statistical 'theories' change anything. And all your doing in the end is desperately hunting for a reason to believe the virus is not as serious as it actually is.

 

That is looks like appeal to authority fallacy.
Viruses play major role in exacerbating human health. People are dying from complications caused by viruses.every year in a big numbers, either from common cold or more often from the flu.
Apparently COVID-19 has more complications then other common cold viruses, but it does not mean that without COVID-19 we had zero deaths from common cold complications.
I do not have to be a doctor or statistician to understand that, and I am not falling for political propaganda.

 

You keep ignoring the reason for the 250,000 excess deaths this year compared to previous years. Were there less deaths from "common cold complications" or flu in previous years compared to this year?

 

No reason has been provided, that is a main issue.
I suspect they are comparing data only for the last year.
And also they conveniently ignored January from their table.

 

Data is compared to the average over the previous 5 years. And if compared to the highest number of deaths in any of those 5 years there is still in excess of over 250,000 deaths this year. The reason has been provided; where do you get the idea that it hasn't?

 

Where did you get that information?
Five years is statistically insignificant number, it should be at least 30 years.

 

You want to compare to a year when there were 80 million less people in the US?

 

So, today, worse than ever:

https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/12/heal...gq0McZosxGRBTkaPtszBW2WAr&bt_ts=1605266309982

The pandemic is growing more alarming by the day. Covid-19 cases and hospitalizations are piling up at record rates, and experts fear that daily deaths may soon follow. An influential Covid-19 model projected nearly 439,000 people could die of the virus by March 1. CNN's Dr. Sanjay Gupta called the crisis a "humanitarian disaster." Chicago issued a stay-at-home advisory, urging residents to leave only for essential needs and warning against Thanksgiving travel.

But sure, the Democratic Hoax has just magically disappeared on November 4th, right?

 

No, the flu kills people in one tenth of one percent. 0.1%
I can't believe that right now, there are still people who think that Covid-19 is just like the flu.

 

It's refreshing to read someone here, saying several correct things about this. It is rare.