Where is the answer to this mess?

1) You have it backwards. When we dismantle our tribes, we become nothing BUT ego. Every man for himself, no one to trust enough to care for or about, but the self. It's the tribe which brings out the best in us ... the willingness to self-sacrifice for our fellows. To be as good as we can be, we must have a circle of trust. Remove that circle of trust, and you will get nothing that isn't forced at gunpoint. Star Trek-esque fantasies about evolving beyond brute survival instincts are probably fun, but when the majority of humanity still can't even be sure they'll eat tomorrow, we're light years away from anything even remotely like that - assuming that kind of safety didn't result in wholesale nihilism (which it probably would).

2) The 'old ideology' is the one which touts the idea that we can be islands - without consequence. The very particularly mid 20thC hubris arising out of a generation or two of safety and plenty. The abandonment of survival structures .. particularly those so very important to the lowest orders.

 

What you are suggesting is called Marxism by the new right. Little do they notice that while they are terrified that Marxist ideology has swept in and is choking America, the exact opposite has happened in the past 50 years. Since then, a larger and larger share of wealth has been usurped by corporate executives and bank swindlers who are not Marxists but ultra capitalists. Meanwhile the workers have been left to struggle over what those buzzards can’t get their greedy mitts on.

I grew up in a time when people could raise a family on one income and buy a house, two cars and take a three week vacation every year. Their kids could go to UCLA and graduate while working at a grocery store and have NO DEBT when they got their degree and get advanced degrees while working. It is not creeping Marxism that has emerged here in America but full blown ultra Capitalism supported by both parties who are owned by the super wealthy. Unions which built the great American middle class have been demonized and destroyed by right wing capitalist ideology exponentially since 1981. It cracks me up when all these Trumpers are squealing about Marxism or Communism. They are truly a clueless bunch.

 

This is probably way to much to ask but we need to go back to the constitution. Limit the federal government they way it was intended to. There is absolutely no way a federal government can govern this diverse of a nation. The states need to have their powers restored to the original intent of the constitution.

 

Seth, what you say, as usual makes sense. However with the recent actions of some of these State legislators in closely contested States like Arizona, Georgia, Pennsylvania, Michigan and Wisconsin where total crackpots in these legislatures are hard at work trying to set up rigged elections. I am a bit queasy about them taking over the power to preside over national elections. Democrats have stupidly ignored mid term elections and down ballot voting over the years which has allowed Republicans to win with a bare minimum of votes especially after many of these districts have been manipulated and gerrymandered over the years. In a perfect world there would be much higher participation by all eligible voters but at this time I think the scales are tipped in favor of the minority.

 

And yet it's the Left who wants the middle class powerless.

 

The middle class was at its height when union membership was at its peak. It was not leftists who demonized and attacked unions. Higher pay, better benefits and cheaper medical costs are the solution to a stronger middle class. I don’t care whether the left, the right or the middle proposes action to promote these things. All I see from these so called “conservatives” these days are endless attempts to block any bills that would help the middle class.

 

1) There is no justice - if someone doing an entry level job is paid the same as someone who studied and worked harder to gain additional skills. And why shouldn't individuals make money - whether it's via the direct labor of their hands or not? "Transfer of Energy" isn't a nullity .. it's an exchange. People work their asses off for years to be able to make money indirectly .. none of it happens by magic unless they're one of the rare lucky ones who inherit.

2) Humanity already has the desire to help those around them. Every tribe/village/community does it, and has always done it - at least up until the 21stC. We wouldn't have survived as a species unless we had that. But we also know that when an opportunity to gain more (IOW more survival), we must take it. We're never going to take just what we need in a single moment, because we're obliged to cover our future needs, and the needs of our tribe. Only those with absolute certainty in their position of privilege, are going to think strictly in terms of today/now. Those who aren't so lucky MUST think ahead. That's what social responsibility looks like. That's how you raise up those around you. You can't do it by abandoning the only driver of social responsibility that we possess - our pack animal instincts.

 

Two things.

1: In order to fix a problem you must first identify what the problem is. Specifically. Then and only then can you come up with ideas to fix it.

2: There has NEVER been integrity to politics. So you may as well scrap that "restoring" concept.

 

Let's be honest here. How many people even know the name of their Representative or Senator in their state legislatures? Honestly, the answer is "not many." Perhaps if those state legislators were the ones who selected the Senators to the U.S. Senate from their state, voters would take more of an interest in their state races.

Yeah, I understand that gerrymandering goes on, but it goes on both ways. What I know about my own state (Oregon) is the the legislature pretty fairly represents the complexion of the electorate which is majority Democrat. In my opinion, we need to keep the two issues separate. Let's look at the benefits of having the state legislature select the U.S. Senators as one issue and gerrymandering as another issue to be tackled.

 

You are right about how few people know who their state assemblyman or state Senator are. I will agree that anything which will make more people engage politically is good for America. That said, I think the chances of turning over election of US Senators back to state legislatures has about as much chance as abolishing the electoral college which I think would be a good move. Passing an amendment to the constitution would be a 1000-1 long shot at this time.

 

Yes it would. The entrenched powers would fight it all the way.

 

Practically, I would limit immigration a little and boost incentives to limit off-shoring of American labour. If anything I would push South.

The US is facing an existential crisis and simply needs a bit of time to cool off. Throwing other people/factors to the mix probably won't help.

 

I don’t think we have evolved as a species enough to get enough reasonable, intelligent people to all pull together and move forward at a rapid pace at this time. Until then we will stumble into the future haphazardly and keep taking two steps forward and a step or two back.

That said, I think we have done pretty well with the present system in the big picture. At my age, 67 I don’t expect many radical changes in my lifetime but I also don’t think there will be any horrible disasters either. One good thing that has been a positive sign is that our leaders have not taken their best kill shot since back in 1945 before I was born. I do remember when nuclear annihilation was a realistic possibility.

Our species had gone thousands of years from the days of beating each other with rocks, to swords, to bows and arrows, to rifles, to machine guns and artillery, to poison gas, to bombs then to nuclear weapons....Its been over 70 years since we took our best shot now....Divine intervention is a possibility...I am happy and grateful to be alive at this time and to have lived in these interesting and exciting times. I am optimistic about the future of this beautiful planet and it’s diverse cultures and people. The possibilities are infinite. I hope you enjoy the rest of your days hunting, fishing, drinking a few and living it up.

 

Thank you. I'm 66, so I remember the same things you remember. I too remain optimistic. I see this present phase of our history as unfortunate but not the end of the story. Cheers!

 

So society pays them while they learn additional skills. And individuals can make money. an equal exchange for the amount of additional energy expended. The cost of schooling can be worked into that figure, and sure, a little more for management can be thrown in, as management makes the expenditure of energy more efficient. But, not nearly on the level of difference we see between CEOs and workers today. That kind of wealth is only possible when the workers are not awarded in potential energy (money) equal to their efforts, but are instead given subsistence wages, with the remainder of the energy they expended going directly to the CEO, manager, boss, whatever. This energy is then thrown into the magical loan/debt/investment game, a game where energy (money) magically makes more energy through compound interest. Except none of that game is actually real, resulting in the wealthy to become artificially far more wealthy than everybody else. That gives that 1% of the population an artificially massive chunk of the actual REAL energy that is produced by society. It's a similar system to what we see in the movie "the Matrix", where humanity is just batteries, funneling their energies into the machine, and getting nothing in return except the bare minimum needed for survival.

SOME of humanity has the desire to help those around them. That some are not our politicians and corporate elite. Our society and economic system is set up to reward personal greed and profit at the expense of others. You are right, we ARE obliged to cover our future needs, but it must be done as a SOCIETY, not as individuals, if we are going to fix this world. Individuals will screw another part of the planet, and deplete its resources with no thought of the welfare of the people living there. When we rise above the egoic mind, the animal survival instinct that is no longer needed, we will see that there is plenty of resources for all if we would just stop hoarding them and raise up humanity as a whole. We need to look at others, and instead of seeing someone else, see ourselves in that person.

At the moment, we might throw money at charity, but when we pass those experiencing misfortune, we do not really care about them. Mostly we want to get away from them, get back to our luxurious homes cut off from the squalor of the rest of the world where we can shut the door, write a check to charity, and pretend that we care while we spend more money in a month than they see in a year. We don't really care. We just pretend.

At least some pretend. Like I said, humanity is finally evolving to a new level of consciousness that is going to solve these problems. But there will be growing pains, as we can plainly see. Old ideas based on greed and ideology (communism and capitalism) will be thrown down. Both ideologies are doomed to failure because of the egoic animal mind that always wants to hoard more. In communism, a small class of elites controls all of the resources, and common man owns nothing, even though he is supposed to own the means of production. In capitalism, Power becomes concentrated in the hands of the very few, while the vast majority live on subsistence wages not equal to the energy invested in their work, because of the magic of debts and interest and similar concepts.

The human animalistic ego will wreck any system it comes in contact with as it looks for ways to exploit it for personal gain. As I have been harping on in my other posts, it is a fundamental shift in human consciousness, the way we look at people around us, that will make things work out for the benefit of all.

 

I'm not optimistic at all. It's like trying to fight a forest fire. Harry Reid started the mess, the MSM have been biased from day one, and social media has taken care of the rest. The solution is both simple and impossible.

The media have always been biased to the left but it seems like around the Bill Clinton presidency, Americans got sick and tired of the biased media pulling our strings so right wing media came about and began flourishing to argue the "other side". That would have never happened if the MSM hadn't been so biased in the first place. So, we had both left and right media and pretty much no one in the middle.

Then Harry Reid got tired of not getting his way and he taught Republicans about nuclear capabilities which, in turn led to Republicans trying the nuclear option. (To his credit, Mitch McConnell has refused to end the filibuster when he had the chance but now Democrats are talking about it again).

During these times social media has exploded, further separating Americans.

So, the solution is both simple and impossible:

1. Force all media to be unbiased and fair

2. Get rid of all nuclear options in the Senate and return it to where it was, keeping the filibuster. At he same time we need to use the same Senate rules in the House, not allowing anything to pass with just a simple majority, only supermajorities.

3. Social media must be subject to my rule # 1 - Force all media to be unbiased and fair

 

I can agree that is a major issue that distorts reality in the public perception.... Propaganda.

Now- how can you put that in place? What mechanism could do that?

By the way, the concept of super-majorities has been discussed many times in our group, and would be a necessary tool.

 

Maybe I misunderstood you. I thought you were asking about realistic solutions and not fantasies. There are no realistic options I know of - only fantasies that would never come to be. Of course we can talk about fantasies but fantasies are just fantasies.

 

All the things that have never been done before are fantasies, until they are done the first time. We're not talking about a problem we ever faced before, and the solution will certainly be something we have not had to do before. We're trying to figure out how to change this. The first step is top understand what and where the keystone to the overall issues is. The second step is making a plan to change that, and the third step is establishing a way to execute that plan.

I own a company that manufactures products that are mostly my inventions. I'm used to coming up with solutions, and I've been told many times I couldn't do something I'd already done.
Independent thinker? That's the kind of person who can solve problems. When your mind is in the common box, many things are impossible. Outside that are the people who make impossible things happen.
Start with the first step. Find the keystone that can impact all the rest.

 

1) There must ALWAYS be minimum wage jobs, because that's all many people want - as evidenced by the fact that people remain in them voluntarily! If individuals want to be paid more, they find a way to make that happen. That's how democracy works. We're all free to choose how we'll approach our work life. As for the rich .. what's your definition of 'artificial' wealth? Seems to me you've simply elected to call any ostensibly passive income 'artificial'. The primative farmer can still breed a few extra cows each year without adding much labor - is that artificial wealth in your view?

2) All humanity is prepared to care about those around them. Like I said, had we not been powerfully driven to protect and preserve those in our circles of trust, we would not have survived as a species. We have just started losing that driver for the first time in human history - because we have abandoned circles of trust! We're actually going the OTHER WAY, and become less caring over time as a result. The longer it is since our last memory of tribalism, the less we care. It's simply not possible to care about strangers in the way you seem to think it is. We don't have the wiring for it - nor does any social mammal. We cannot 'evolve' beyond that most fundamental wiring, any more than we can evolve beyond our fight/flight instincts. And the very worst thing we can do is ask Govt to 'secure' our lives for us. That's what lead to the abandonment of our tribes in the first place. The abandonment which lead to us moving to an every-man-for-himself inability to care for those around us. To be clear ... when I say 'care for those around us', I'm talking about those within our circles of trust. Our tribes. If we all returned to tribalism, there would be no one falling through the cracks - because there would be no cracks. The cracks are created by thinking it's safe to abandon our tribes.

3) When we pass someone suffering 'misfortune', we're passing someone who was abandoned by their tribe and/or abandoned that tribe themselves. If you can't see the connection, I'm not sure we're ever likely to reach understanding. Furthermore, some of us care very deeply upon passing such people - we care because we can see exactly why it's happening (and it's happening more and more, not less and less .... so much for our 'evolution'), and know that it will never be fixed. Because too many people - like yourself - cannot see their own role in it, and keep pushing for more of what created the problem in the first place.

4) We are changing, that's true. Definitely not for the better though .. unless you enivision a future in which you're a number in a dormitory and family/friends/community etc are things of the ancient past.

 

The Progressive Elites don't want a middle class empowered by property, for example. Private property emancipates people to a large extent, and emancipated peoples cannot be easily controlled. They're too independent - psychically speaking. It's these Elites driving the trope 'you will own nothing, and you will be happy'.That's NOT coming from conservatives (who are committed champions of private property .. precisely because they champion independence).

 

The people elect those 8-yr olds. Sometimes for most of their adult life. Huge Money in politics has a way of getting incumbents re-elected.

 

Excellent !

Add in term Limits

 

Conservative and their policies promote private land ownership of a few elites. Their Union busting and low wage policies prevent most people from owning land.

 

IMO, the system, where the incumbents have most all the money and all the power is a major problem. Any newbie going to DC to make change will have to quickly fall in line or be banished to their dungeon and then the money will get them booted come next election.

The 2 party system has a stranglehold on America.
If they get the people pointing fingers, and they've succeeded, they win and contain the power.

As long as the party loyal voters are willing to call their fellow Americans of the other party the enemy, it will remain the same.

At the end of the day, all most want is food, shelter, clothing, and to be wanted. All else is fluff.