Colin Powell, military leader and first Black US secretary of state, dies from COVID-19 complication

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by Egoboy, Oct 18, 2021.

  1. CenterField

    CenterField Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Well, it's no secret, Pollycy. Colin Powell had multiple myeloma, which is a serious cancer of plasma cells and it completely knocks down the person's immune system. Plasma cells are the antibody factories. Cancerous plasma cells do not produce antibodies. Colin Powell was immuno-compromised. You can give as many doses of vaccine as you want to someone like this including a booster, and you won't obtain a good response. His death is not the fault of the vaccine. It's the fault of the combination of multiple myeloma with Covid-19, plus his age. People who are blaming the vaccine for his death are being incredibly ignorant. Vaccines don't work well for people with multiple myeloma. We still try but the results are meager. Some people respond but others don't respond at all.

    Here, this is a simple explanation of multiple myeloma for the lay public, done by the excellent Mayo Clinic:

    https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/multiple-myeloma/symptoms-causes/syc-20353378

    Observe this:

    "Healthy plasma cells help you fight infections by making antibodies that recognize and attack germs.

    In multiple myeloma, cancerous plasma cells accumulate in the bone marrow and crowd out healthy blood cells. Rather than produce helpful antibodies, the cancer cells produce abnormal proteins that can cause complications."

    Vaccines can't accomplish miracles in the presence of multiple myeloma.

    Not to forget, treatment for multiple myeloma includes steroids and chemotherapy that further depress the immune system. Options such as cyclophosphamide and doxorubicin or vincristine can wipe out white blood cells which includes the cells that the body uses for immune response. They are also cardio-toxic which is already a problem for people with Covid-19 which causes heart inflammation.

    While I don't know if Colin Powell was taking these drugs, the multiple myeloma in itself already made him immuno-compromised, and if he was on chemotherapy, even more so.

    Don't blame the vaccines for his death!
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2021
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  2. Rampart

    Rampart Banned

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    is he? are you saying that smallpox or polio vaccine is unnecessary because of our "innate immune system?"
     
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  3. CenterField

    CenterField Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    @Pollycy I just confirmed that indeed, Colin Powell was being treated for his multiple myeloma (although the information does not specify which drugs but most options are bad for the immune system), so, the treatment itself has likely resulted in further compromise of his immune system.

    Some people with initial disease that is still mild may respond to the vaccine, a good third or a bit more. The other third will have just partial response (that's why we still give the vaccine), and another third or a bit less, nothing at all, especially the older patients with more serious cases. That's just for the myeloma itself. Treatment for it, like I said, further damages the immune response.

    ----------------

    Present company excluded (you were simply asking questions) I find that anti-vaxxers using the death of this great American (who had the very kind of cancer that knocks down antibody production) to bash the vaccines is extremely disgraceful.

    R.I.P. Colin Powell. Your legacy of honorable and dignified service to our nation won't be forgotten.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2021
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  4. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    and what would republicans do? toss them in the street?

    "The Trump Administration’s Deregulation of Nursing Homes Leaves Seniors and Disabled at Higher Risk for COVID-19"

    https://www.americanprogress.org/is...leaves-seniors-disabled-higher-risk-covid-19/

    "Why are nursing homes being hit so hard by the outbreak? One reason is that they are a target of the Trump administration’s aggressive deregulation agenda."

    "In response, the nursing home lobby again advocated for less oversight, and in July 2019, the Trump administration proposed new rules relaxing the requirements tied to infection control. It suggested that consultants could be used, instead of requiring infection specialists to be employed at the site, at minimum, on a part-time basis. This meant that there was no longer a requirement for a full-time, hands-on expert in infection contamination on-site."

    the reality is, Nursing Homes should have separated infected people, they failed to do this, hospitals could not give up a bed for everyone that showed no symptoms and tested positive, not enough beds
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2021
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  5. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Powell's immune system was compromised by cancer and the treatments

    I do think they should look into monoclonal antibody treatments for those with cancer though

    Joe had monoclonal antibody treatment, anything else he did is not really as significant imo

    Joe was healthy, had he trained him immune system, he may not of needed the monoclonal antibody treatment - Lesson learned from Joe
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2021
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  6. drluggit

    drluggit Well-Known Member

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    Was the context of the comment really that hard or did you just purposefully squirrel to derail the conversation?
     
  7. drluggit

    drluggit Well-Known Member

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    And yet they don't. Folks who are vaccinated against Polio, for example, aren't F'in dying from polio. Try not starting with such an obvious lie.
     
  8. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I could say the same of you
     
  9. drluggit

    drluggit Well-Known Member

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    Very true. So why do you suppose CNN called this a COVID death then?
     
  10. Egoboy

    Egoboy Well-Known Member Donor

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    They don't seem to be dying from polio (my bad - substitute "get" for "die"), but many vaccinated against polio are still catching it...

    https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsa...ut-polio-was-going-really-well-until-it-wasnt

    Diseases are always ahead of humans...
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2021
  11. Tahuyaman

    Tahuyaman Well-Known Member

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    Because COVID is also a political issue. It’s used to justify more federal government control.
     
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  12. Tahuyaman

    Tahuyaman Well-Known Member

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    We have a true vaccine for polio, smallpox and several other diseases. You get that vaccine and you are protected. You won’t contract polio or smallpox.


    The COVID inoculations are not true vaccines. They just provide your immune system with a boost. They don’t provide absolute protection.
     
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  13. Egoboy

    Egoboy Well-Known Member Donor

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    CNN didn't call this a COVID death... they reported what Powell's family reported, which was:

    "General Colin L. Powell, former U.S. Secretary of State and Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, passed away this morning due to complications from Covid 19," the Powell family wrote on Facebook, noting he was fully vaccinated.

    Now if you want to question the motives of the Powell family, you just strap in and fire away....
     
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  14. Pro_Line_FL

    Pro_Line_FL Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Polio required 4 shots and it took 25 years of vaccine mandates for kids to get rid of it. We have been vaccinating people for Covid for 6 months, and people are refusing it, so it does not quire compare

    [​IMG]
     
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  15. drluggit

    drluggit Well-Known Member

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    I don't suppose that it actually occurred to you to actually read your citation did it? Because it certainly doesn't create a story that fully vaccinated folks of polio are actually contracting it. You would have known that had you actually read it. next.
     
  16. drluggit

    drluggit Well-Known Member

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    I think you're entirely missing the point. The COVID shot isn't a vaccination. It's a mild anti viral experiment. It doesn't deliver a live strain from which your body develops immunity. It creates a synthesized protein inhibitor that is "supposed" to keep virus replication from happening. Not the same in any way. And as we're now seeing from the actual data, not nearly as effective. Hence why folks who are fully vaccinated continue to die from the virus.
     
  17. Pro_Line_FL

    Pro_Line_FL Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    95% effective it pretty close to Polio effectiveness, which required 4 shots. Of course Polio was nowhere near as contagious as Covid (polio requires fecal-oral transmission), and didn't kill anywhere near as many people as Covid (it killed 3000 during when it was at its worst). It was not just the shots which eradicated it, but also clean water.

    Having said that, I don't care if people refuse the vaccine or not.
     
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  18. Quantum Nerd

    Quantum Nerd Well-Known Member

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    Except that earlier polio vaccines didn't have 100% efficiency.

    https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/6605215/

    Because of that, polio is not eradicated, and just recently a new vaccine was developed to address mutations (variants).

    Other research predicts that Srs-Cov2 is somewhere in-between polio and smallox with respect to eradicability.

    https://gh.bmj.com/content/bmjgh/6/8/e006810.full.pdf

    That's probably good news. Once the virus has picked the low hanging fruit with mutations that increase transmissability and evade vaccine immunity, mutation rate will hopefully get slower, allowing us to catch up with vaccines against the variants. It's going to be a long battle that won't be won within a year or two.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2021
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  19. Pollycy

    Pollycy Well-Known Member

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    Please don't misunderstand me, Dr. Center -- all I wanted was someone with an in-depth understanding of these matters to comment on them... and now you have. Once again, and not for the first time, thank you.

    As far as my personal view on COVID vaccinations goes, I'll be getting my Pfizer booster in about three more weeks, as planned. :thumbsup:
     
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  20. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    RIP indeed

    America just lost a great man - he was flawed as are we all but a great man nonetheless
     
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  21. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Good for you! :couple_inlove::couple_inlove:
     
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  22. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    They could also lead to a version that is less harmful

    But that “news” does not sell
     
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  23. Bowerbird

    Bowerbird Well-Known Member

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    Powell was eighty, had Parkinson’s and Cancer so was immune compromised
     
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  24. Bearack

    Bearack Well-Known Member

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    Exactly. The common rhino virus could have just as easily have been the deathblow.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2021
  25. edna kawabata

    edna kawabata Well-Known Member

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    “Wonderful to see Colin Powell, who made big mistakes on Iraq and famously, so-called weapons of mass destruction, be treated in death so beautifully by the Fake News Media,” Trump wrote in a statement released Tuesday through his Save America PAC. “Hope that happens to me someday. He was a classic RINO, if even that, always being the first to attack other Republicans. He made plenty of mistakes, but anyway, may he rest in peace!”
     

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