Where is the answer to this mess?

We're not discussing 'the system', we're discussing the freely made choices of individuals.

Meantime, I cannot fathom how you've managed to convince yourself that poor people can afford to pay out a million dollars on rents over a lifetime (and which they have to keep paying til the day they die), yet can't afford to pay $50k for a property. You realise that's a total absurdity, don't you? Like calling night day, because it suits some wholly irrational but cherished belief.

 

First, people on welfare do not have jobs. Second, if they're a SUPPORT system, you should be able to live with them and thus cut costs for all.

 

True.
In the typical mindset of those in poverty, there is a need to ease the discomforts with things that they would have if they lived at a higher standard. For example, you often see very low income people with expensive cell phones. These are symbolic signs that help a person avoid facing the challenge of improving life, much as alcohol and drugs help people avoid certain realities in their lives. I'm a relatively high income person; I don't need to be frugal, but I generally am. My cell phone cost me $150 and it's more than adequate.

You simply cannot give people independence and self-respect by providing the means to avoid earning it. I believe that self-esteem, or self-respect, is the most valuable characteristic you can possess and a prime component of independence- but it can only be earned from yourself. There are no shortcuts, it can't be gifted from anyone in anyway. The path out of poverty is a combination of the right attitudes and a sound financial plan. The latter can be given, but is worthless without the former.

 

A major issue today is the rejection of responsibility in politics. They not only reject responsibility- they reject words that imply it, words that legitimately characterize issues they should be addressing, reject recognizing anything that they can't bend to personal advantage, including recognizing the accomplishments of other or the failures of themselves.

Harry Truman was a democrat; a much different kind of democrat than those of today. He had this sign on his desk in the oval office:



IF Biden had a desk sign today....

 

Its not.

 

Yes they do.

 

People who work jobs where the pay is lower than the cost of living absolutely do get various forms of support.

A support system includes more people than one could possibly expect to live together. Plus, it includes transportation, proximity to services, and other features that don't move with an individual.

 

If you have something to say, then say it.

 

I will point out that while perhaps you are not avoiding hurt feelings you are in fact avoiding the fact that

 

I'd agree.

But, I'd also point out that we've had major destruction of collective bargaining, with the result being freedom for corporations to drop wages well below a living wage - as well as hours, benefits and working conditions losses.

 

Right, which in EVERY other iteration is considered a sense of entitlement - and necessarily therefore objectionable. When you add in the fact that they're using the hard earned dollars of working stiffs (who likely DIDN'T have that sense of entitlement) to do it, it makes it infinitely more objectionable.

And yet these are the very people our Progressive Lefty friends want to protect and fete.

 

Irrelevant. People pull themselves out of poverty (and even way up into the stratosphere) every day, despite these 'systemic barriers'. IOW, that means they're not actually barriers. If they were, no one would ever escape poverty.

 

Yes we have. And the sensible people have ADAPTED to that shift, and thus kept ahead of the game.

 

I'm talking about people on WELFARE. In other words, not working. They can live anywhere. So can people who work from home, incidentally - which is a lot of people these days.

Support systems like services etc exist in every larger town and smaller city. As long as there are in excess of about 30,000 residents - you'll get everything you need. And a personal support system isn't very freaking supportive, if it can't or won't house you.

 

Unemployed people have jobs? Okay.

 

People on welfare have jobs.

 

Absolutely wrong

 

You're saying you think a POOR person can afford a million dollars, but not $50k?

There are either halucinogenic drugs involved in that belief, or you've bought every lie told by those who need you to believe night is day.

I challenge you to explain your math.

 

If there are actual barriers, how are people able to escape poverty with such regularity? Explain how they're able to circumvent those barriers, while others cannot. What are those poor and powerless people doing DIFFERENTLY?

 

Welfare is unemployment and sickness benefits - both of which preclude employment, obviously. There's no other kind where I live.

 

So this poor person is paying a million a month in rent?

 

That's just plain silly.

 

Obviously you don't understand that other people are different from you and have different circumstances.

 

Yes - you don't know how support works in the USA.

 

Had friends who were on welfare and had jobs.