Why should people be forced to get the vaccine in order to protect others who choose not to get it?

You have no argument against what you consider to be "libertarian tosh!"

 

What NEGATIVE thing did I say about it?

 

Their abortion mandate, did you forget? Mandating rape victims risk their lives to have their rapists babies

 

good deal, me too

I do not support mandates, but glad the right is seeing this happen to them, this is the slippery slope of mandates like the one is Texas

 

Risk their lives? Are you aware that abortions are still allowed should the doctor decided that the fetus or mother's health are at risk?

 

doctors are avail if the vaccine threaten ones life too, so does that make that mandate ok?

your thinking only works when it's already a risk, not before to prevent it from ever being a risk

 

There's an exception to save the woman's life. So why do you mention the death risk?

 

after her life is at risk....

there are actions they can take if a vaccine causes issues too, so do you support that mandate?

the choice needs to come before the risk is happening, not after

 

Sure. There was some in the previous pull quote from the Qatar study.

Also the fact that in the US we are only recording mainly symptomatic breakthrough infections (because we don’t test asymptomatics at near the rate Qatar does) and come up with about a 1% breakthrough infection rate while Qatar is coming up with over 30% shows most breakthrough are actually asymptomatic. This would actually lead to more likely transmission because asymptomatics would not be identified and isolated from society like a symptomatic case would be.

 

There are all sorts of "studies" both here in the US and around the world that do NOT count as clinical tests that US medicine would accept. The difference in the Qatar thing that you DON't cite is only one of the possible differences with whatever was done in Qatar.

Besides, a high "breakthrough" rate certainly does not form a justification for failing to get vaccinated.

 

That’s funny. The CDC cites studies from foreign sources all the time. I’m sorry a study that actually tests for asymptomatic breakthrough cases upsets your unsubstantiated opinions again.

I remember when I first started advising people they could decrease their chances of infection and of killing their family members by utilizing masks in the home I used a study out of China as evidence. People told me it was irrelevant. Months later the CDC issued advice to households with high risk members and multigenerational components to consider mask usage in the home. Want to guess which study they cited for evidence? Yep. The same one I had been citing as evidence for home mask usage for months.

You are going to deny any science that conflicts with authority you appeal to no matter what. I get it. But it’s still your and their unsubstantiated opinions against my posts based on actual evidence. I have no interest in your approach. Now or ever. Sorry.

What specifically about the Qatar study doesn’t apply to the subject at hand? Quote the parts about “whatever was done” you think disqualifies this study from consideration. Come on man, cite something concrete. We are all weary of your unsubstantiated opinions.

Not much interested in the strawman of your second paragraph either.

 

Yes, but it DOES form a justification for being against vaccine mandates. Again, the vaccinated are spreading. You don't seem to be able to grasp this. Also, unvaccinated people who get quite sick but not hospitalised, will be forced to stay home to recover, which means they won't spread!

 

Can you quote the part from the study which says that over 30% shows most breakthrough are actually asymptomatic?

 

You make it sound that vaccine mandates only target people on the right! You seem to think that nobody on the
left is against getting vaccinated! I guess all of those black New Yorkers who are against it are all right wingers!

 

i never said that, do you think that?

it's just that most antivaxers here are Trump supporters

 

You referred to "the right", not Trump supporters on here.

 

Trump supporters are on the right

 

In the US the CDC is only keeping track of hospitalizations and deaths of vaccinated from Covid. Other studies they use from states have been showing around a 1% breakthrough infection rate because it’s only counting severe cases and mostly people who get tested because they have symptoms. Here is a summary of data from one study from Washington State the CDC uses as evidence.

The Qatar study includes all discovered cases—severe, mild, and asymptomatic. In Qatar they are still doing large scale testing of the general population, doing more contact tracing testing, using random survey testing of healthy people and counting every positive test as a breakthrough infection. Here is a breakdown of symptomatic vs asymptomatic in their data.

Because Qatar is testing the general population regularly and more randomly and we aren’t, they are reporting much higher rates of breakthrough infections—a rate much closer to reality. Our rate only includes severe cases (and sometimes symptomatic cases in state data) so is nowhere near the actual total rate of breakthrough. The difference between their rate:

…and our reported rates, this source John Hopkins based on Washington State (incomplete) data.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ho...ctions-coronavirus-after-vaccination?amp=true

The simplest way to look at this is in the US we are defining breakthrough infections as (sometimes) symptomatic and (usually) hospitalizations. In the Qatar study it’s defined as the rate of asymptomatic and all other types of infection in the general population. Because we under-report actual rates here the rate of transmission from breakthrough infections is severely underestimated as well.

This is why you can’t just take the word of bureaucratic organizations. They can outright lie or present lies of omission. The result is the same. The populations they serve end up misinformed and disinformed.

 

You just hear about the “right wing” ones from media and politicians.

https://www.wweek.com/news/2021/09/...the-nations-leading-advocates-for-ivermectin/

This is the guy that has influenced Joe Rogan quite a bit on vaccines and ivermectin.

And the biggest fish in the ant vax sea:
https://www.mcgill.ca/oss/article/c...e/anti-vaccine-propaganda-robert-f-kennedy-jr

Isn’t it ironic the demographic concerned about disinformation campaigns involving vaccination are themselves the victims of a disinformation campaign concealing key players in the vaccine disinformation campaign?

 

You referred to "the right", nothing specific to anyone on here.

 

not sure what you're saying?

 

The point you are missing is that the vaccine significantly reduces communication of the disease.

Your last sentence makes NO sense. Being treated in a hospital is OBVIOUSLY less likely to cause disease transmission than is sending the sick home to be dealt with by family, friends, in-home help and the public should the individual venture out.

 

You referred to "the right" did you not?

 

The inventor of the Pfizer fraud vax says natural immunity is much better than the fraud vax....

 

You STILL haven't supported this!