Succinct explanation. So often people think there is no compassion or mercy for human foibles in Islam.
Thank you for your answers. I have another question. What do devout but non "radicalized" Muslim's think of things like tearing down of an embassies flag and hoisting up a black flag of Al Qaeda on sovereign US property as was done in Cairo? We don't hear much in the way of condemnation from "regular" Muslims of what appears "uncivilized" behavior by others claiming the same faith. Why not?
You're welcome. That is more of a politics thing. You must remember, the US was Mubarak greatest supporter, and Mubarak was brutal to the Egyptians. Most of the hatred or dislike towards the US in the Middle East is political rather than religious. Islam is used more as a motivator by some people. In this case the protests were about that movie Innocence of Muslims, and al-Qaida was known to have been participating in the protests. In fact, some Egyptians were paid to protests violently. I think Egypt did apologize for what happened. There were many Muslims condemning all the violent protests around the Middle East because of the video though.
If a muslim man became a Christian and then began to preach to muslims and lead them to Christianity, would that be enough to kill him?
that's a cold question. And yu have it on the money on how to expose a lack of what some call 'freedom'. i call false witness 'f'king lying' and hate it but some actually believe they have a right to lie, in most any matters. Now in islam. Anyone can talk about the good of any belief but as soon as it conflicts with what is already considered hashed out and true regarding 'god'. Then you have a problem with who has the last word . Muhammad - thru to caliph or the idiots telling people, 'pray to jesus, he will save you from being dragged thru th streets for lying, beeeecuz yoo'r 4given' if you just say the creed".... The culture of islam, is tougher on personal responsibility than in the western appeal. IN the west anyone can say what they want and preach as long as it dont cause physical harm. in islam, lying is a harm, in torah it's against god and to christians, well they'r all forgiven, you can be any demonination, corrupt, a lying sob, a politician and no matter what, you'r forgiven, by god So to address the reasoning, see it in the sense of like covering their women, the elder wisdom is they knew 'we' are weak human beings and over kill the oppression to subdue the people to what they believe 'god' wants. it's pretty sad but as a culture of people, muslims are closer to buddhist/hindu in just people that want to do good and follow the rules versus the western appeal is who can build the most wealth, then legally by god or man, control what of will/choice. I personally like everything about the people as far as humility. I just hate the rituals and oppression of mind. dirt kissing disgusts me in every sense of the concept. it almost as stupid as tithing and not eating bacon.
I understand the interplay of politics and religion. I am Catholic, and I can relate to some of the same sort of pre-conceived ideas. That makes sense. My question is, however, what about the "every-day Muslim" --are they condemning this? and if not, why not? I know that as a Catholic, I condemn without reservation the pedophilia committed by some Catholic priests--while at the same time, I try to explain how that is the sin of an individual and by the constructs that may work to suppress the information--while at the same time defending the basis of my faith and drawing attention to what we teach concerning the nature of sin. This perspective is "out there" in Catholic Christian publications, by Catholics who speak publicly on this stuff, and by lay-persons like myself. Where is the same "defense" of mainstream Islam, and condemnation of the radicalized Muslim sects? There are a few...granted...there are not many and the condemnation has very little strength as far as I see. Please show me where I can find this if it is more mainstream than I am aware. Or, contrarily, please explain why there is little condemnation. Can you link me to some exploration of this?
Felicity, most of the condemnation wasn't particularly reported as much. Partly due to the fact it was through social media (twitter, Facebook, etc). In Libya, there were counter protests against the killing of the 4 Americans diplomats. The Libyans also made arrests and the people stormed on the al-Qaida affiliated groups headquarters. I found this, http://al-shorfa.com/en_GB/articles/meii/features/2012/09/13/feature-01 I hope the above clears everything up. If not, I am sure I can find more articles. The problem here is, Muslims do condemn violence, but you are not given this information. What I mean is, the media would rather show you the Muslims committing the violence. That's what gets people's attention, and them money in the end.
Arent you bisexual? Dont you support abortion? Dont you support same sex marriage? Dont you fight against religous freedom every chance you get? So let me get this straight, you are a muslim? So you condemn christians for telling you that your homosexual behavior is a sin, but you actually subscribe to a "religion" that will kill you over it. Sounds intelligent enough...
No one has to abide by all teachings in the Bible or Quran. If we did that, we'd be mass murderers! People are free to make their own choices in life, it doesn't make them any less special, or any less religious, does it?
Considering there are missionary groups working in the Middle East and North Africa, and they are not being killed, I don't see why this would be worth killing somebody over. Then again it depends where you are. In some places, you can get arrested for doing this. In others, nothing will happen to you. I looked for Hadith or Quran verses which discuss this, but didn't find much in my searches.
What's the point of stating you're Muslim or Christian, if you pick and choose what to believe and follow? ...it's something like the latest fashion statement to some, I suspect.
That is between the person and God. Say, "O My servants who have transgressed against themselves [by sinning], do not despair of the mercy of Allah . Indeed, Allah forgives all sins. Indeed, it is He who is the Forgiving, the Merciful."
I want to see you say it.... Makkede, are you a muslim, yes or no? If yes..... "We also sent Lut: He said to his people: Do ye ommit lewdness such as no people in creation (ever) committed before you? For ye practice your lusts on men in preference to women: ye are indeed a people transgressing beyond bounds. And his people gave no answer but this: they said, "Drive them out of your city: these are indeed men who want to be clean and pure!"" (Qur'an 7:80-82) "Of all the creatures in the world, will ye approach males, And leave those whom Allah has created for you to be your mates? Nay, ye are a people transgressing (all limits)! They said: "If thou desist not, O Lut! thou wilt assuredly be cast out!" He said: "I do detest your doings:" "O my Lord! deliver me and my family from such things as they do!" So We delivered him and his family,-all Except an old woman who lingered behind. But the rest We destroyed utterly. We rained down on them a shower (of brimstone): and evil was the shower on those who were admonished (but heeded not)! Verily in this is a Sign: but most of them do not believe. And verily thy Lord is He, the Exalted in Might, Most Merciful." (Qur'an 26:165-175) "Would ye really approach men in your lusts rather than women? Nay, ye are a people (grossly) ignorant! But his people gave no other answer but this: They said, "Drive out the followers of Lut from your city: these are indeed men who want to be clean and pure!" But We saved him and his family, except his wife; her We destined to be of those who lagged behind. And We rained down on them a shower (of brimstone): and evil was the shower on those who were admonished (but heeded not)!" (Qur'an 27:55-5 "And (remember) Lut: behold, he said to his people: "Ye do commit lewdness, such as no people in Creation (ever) committed before you. Do ye indeed approach men, and cut off the highway? - and practise wickedness (even) in your councils?" But his people gave no answer but this: they said: "Bring us the Wrath of Allah if thou tellest the truth." (Qur'an 29:28-29) "If any of your women are guilty of lewdness, Take the evidence of four (Reliable) witnesses from amongst you against them; and if they testify, confine them to houses until death do claim them, or Allah ordain for them some (other) way. If two men among you are guilty of lewdness, punish them both. If they repent and amend, Leave them alone; for Allah is Oft-returning, Most Merciful." (Qur'an 4:15-16) Do you repent of your sinful ways?
I respect Islam a lot, as I respect all religions (within reason). But as an American, and a westerner, I've heard many rumors about Islam and have questions and I would like to get a Muslim's view on them. What does your faith say in regards to women? Do they lose any rights under Islam or sharia law? What does Islam say in regards to apostasy? Is there a punishment? What does Islam say in regards to killing non-believers? Are there any attempts by people of Islam to peacefully convert others? (I like seeing that from faiths) How should a person who insults Islam be handled according to Islam?
Holding Lot up as a paragon of virtue may not be the smartest thing to do. The guy was a creep. He was perfectly willing to toss his daughters out into the street to be gang raped because he didn't want to give up some strangers. When he left town he took all of the wine he could get his hands on. After his wife croaked he holed up in a cave with his skanky daughters, got blind drunk for days, and knocked both of them up in a drunken sex orgy. Rats have better morals.
In Islam women have the right of divorce, child custody, alimoney.. They have the right to write their marriage contract... to refuse a suitor... They hve property and inheritance rights. They have rights to sexual satisfaction in marriage. Not to claim that this is true for all Muslim women.. just according to the Koran. Unbelievers means those who don't believe in God.. or pagans... and all are to be left in peace unless they make mischief in the land. Apostasy is understood as treason.. betraying the community and the faith.... associated with capital crime or making mischief in the land. Does that help?
Today, one of the Muslim kids said something less than nice about Jesus (Biblical version). I gave the little (*)(*)(*)(*)er a rare old roasting. I promote peace and understanding, not racist/bigoted bollocks and he soon found that one out. Not happening in my classroom. Some forum members here are little better than a daft kid, influenced by some other daft (*)(*)(*)(*).
was the kid setting some idiot straight that not even jesus can save the liars? tell us what that kid said. and the same comes back 10 fold jesus aint god what racist/bigotted comment did the kid say? I know of a comment a little 14yr old said, that was one hell of an eye opener and I thank him each time i repeat his comment: If Jesus died for our sins, whay happens now; He didnt stay dead?!?!? was there anything bigotted or racists there? perhaps that influence was from a weakminded teacher/preacher that dont not realize, them children will someday be their judges. the wolf in sheeps clothing are the worst of the worst!
was the kid setting some idiot straight that not even jesus can save the liars? tell us what that kid said. and the same comes back 10 fold jesus aint god what racist/bigotted comment did the kid say? I know of a comment a little 14yr old said, that was one hell of an eye opener and I thank him each time i repeat his comment: If Jesus died for our sins, what happens now; He didnt stay dead?!?!? was there anything bigotted or racists there? perhaps that influence was from a weakminded teacher/preacher that dont not realize, them children will someday be their judges. the wolf in sheeps clothing are the worst of the worst!
Old laws sometimes stay on the books even if superseded or contradicted by newer laws. Most of these antiquated laws thus can be legally ignored and disobeyed, they exist only because nobody bothers to go through the process of removing them. Again, if your examples were enforced or supported by the people, youd have a point. But they are not.
As Margot already said, women have many rights according to Islam. I recommend looking through here, http://www.islamswomen.com/ If you have any specific's please feel free to ask. The punishment comes from God, and only God, in the afterlife. I think this verse sums it up: Allah does not forbid you from those who do not fight you because of religion and do not expel you from your homes - from being righteous toward them and acting justly toward them. Indeed, Allah loves those who act justly. That is the only way you can convert somebody in Islam: And had your Lord willed, those on earth would have believed - all of them entirely. Then, [O Muhammad], would you compel the people in order that they become believers? That is just one of many verses on the subject. Invite to the way of your Lord with wisdom and good instruction, and argue with them in a way that is best. Indeed, your Lord is most knowing of who has strayed from His way, and He is most knowing of who is [rightly] guided. The Quran says, And it has already come down to you in the Book that when you hear the verses of Allah [recited], they are denied [by them] and ridiculed; so do not sit with them until they enter into another conversation. Indeed, you would then be like them. Indeed Allah will gather the hypocrites and disbelievers in Hell all together - There is no punishment prescribed for blasphemy. The Prophet himself didn't order people killed for blasphemy. Even the woman who poisoned him was not killed. Hope these answered your questions.
