Could God make a rock that even He could not move?

I posted this response in another thread but one member thought that this would make a great thread. I thought about it and I agree, therefore, Could He make a rock big enough that even He could not move?

Just to let everyone know, I am certainly not a religious person, however I did convert to Catholic to marry my Puerto Rican wife in 2005. Have not been to church since that day. This does not say that I am a non-believer though.

Rickity Plumber

 

If god existed and actually was omnipotent, then by definition he could not create something that defied his power.

 

Are you postulating that the rock would have been created on earth? Or as a free floating object drifting through space?

Given that a catholic might agree that the Catholic God created both the heavens and the earth then I could only surmise that God could make do anything that would suit his intent.

And I would agree with that conclusion irregardless of someone's catholicism, or any religious reference or lack thereof.

 

If its free floating in space then it is already in motion as there is no stop in space. Your position is relative to things around you which are all in motion. If its on earth then its already in motion. Therefore the only logical answer is no he cannot. (assuming he is real) I suppose he could if he changed the laws of universe we live in.

 

The opposite is also true. If god cant make something that defies his power then he cannot be omnipotent. If God cannot create that then his powers are limited.

 

good point!

whichever way you turn, their story collapses

 

Could an omnipotent god choose to be less powerful? If not why, and how could god still then be omnipotent if there is something it cannot do?

The argument is flawed by the concept of absolute omnipotence.

 

The Bible never says that God is omnipotent. It, in fact, says there is something God cannot do.

 

Well, actually the rock is God so what ever the rock does is by an action of God. If it moves then God moves it, if it does not move then it remains an opportunity.

To question the existence of God is to question the existence of the rock

 

make croquembouche?

 

In the village there is a barber

The Barber is a man, and he shaves every man in the village who does not shave himself

Does the barber shave himself?.

That is a restatement of the question in mundane terms. Nobody questions that barbers, men, villages or shaving doesn't exist as a result.

It's an non-answerable question, the semantic equivalent of dividing by zero. If he does he doesn't and if he doesn't he does. It has no bearing whatsoever on the Existence of God or His Omnipotence. Whitehead, the early 20th century equivalent of Richard Dawkins, dealt with this

 

Yes, of course He could. There are no limits to the capabilities of a God that transcends the natural laws of matter and energy, cause and effect. Such a God has no requirement to adhere to rules of logic. With the existence of such a God, truth and reality are merely arbitrary concepts. Such a God could stop time on a mere whim. You don't need to understand how such a God could create a rock so large that He could not, himself, move it. If God says that it is true -- then it is true.

 

God is "limited" in His power....according to the Bible and even by traditional Christian belief.

For instance, He cannot "un-make" a soul after it has been created.

Ergo, speaking metaphysically, He is NOT the "Supreme Being", since a Being more powerful than Him could be conceived of. He's the "Best We Can Manage" Being.

 

"Truth," is the only "rock" that God makes and he can not change.

"I am the Truth, and the way and the life." (John 14:6)

 

Cute "line"...but who made the planet Earth, CD?

 

Not logical.

Unlimited power means unlimited. given that, there is nothing that can resist that power. His powers are supposedly not limited and that is precisely why he cannot create something that can withstand that power.

 

so his power is limited then which means he cant be a god. A gods power is limitless.

 

and what would that be?

 

I guess you could read the Bible or google the answer, but I think one of the things is taken out of context, involving iron chariots.....

 

Well, I attempted to look it up, and could only find religious mumbo jumbo.

do you have any specific things that are not within god's power to do?

 

No, you attempt circular logic. Unlimited power is precisely that. Unlimited therefore there is nothing god can create that he cannot uncreate if he so chose.


BTW - Lots of gods had limited power prior to the schizoid "yah/jehovah/jesus/holyghost/allah" god being invented and thematically developed.

 

Theoretically being omnipotent means also to be able to limit one's omnipotence [or one's omniscience, btw], so yes. God can create a rock which He is not able to move [because He decides not to be able to move it].

 

duhhh!!! The circular logic was the point. What can you tell me about when a circular reference occurs? What does that tell you?

 

That answers the question then, doesn't it?

God would have the power to choose whether or not to be able to move the rock. The rock has no power in the matter.

 

I think the question was could it be so big he couldn't move it, not uncreate it. But if it was to big for him/her to move, then uncreating it would solve the issue that he/she couldn't move it. But it doesn't answer the question, unless that answer is yes. Because he/she had to uncreate it.