Theists- Would you commit an evil act if God ordered you to?

You ask things that are regarded as evil from a western morals perspective.

Morals of the west come from Christianity. (with some variation, catholics dislike people who are greedy and protestants see it as a gift of god)

Now. Telling that torturing or killing is wrong really depend of who you are asking that.

Communists will tell you that killing bankers and bourgeois is fine in a revolutionary state
Male muslims will tell you that their spouse is their belonging and that she has the duty to satisfy them when they ask so ( AKA Harem for Califs) Same for prisonners taken from Jihad. (I can back this up with religious texts)
Torture is seen as fine (Goal justify the means ) in various countries. Either communist ( China, Vietnam) Ultranationalist ( Imperial Japan ) or could even be acceptable under some degree for our countries, ( ect.. a bomb planter, without doing permanent harm)


For now as a traditional catholics, i never had face a situation where a immoral thing has been asked by God. On the contrary, Sins are done when i leave the way of the Christ, and it's a ever struggle to stay in the light.

Feel free to ask .

 

Yeah, this thread, a whole two of us bothered to answer the question. Which resulted in the usual responses and backpedaling of questions, along with you claiming people said things they clearly didn't say. While one of you was asking why more theists weren't participating.

And you're really going to use this statement as a defense for all the fibbing you've done in this thread ?!

It's not ironic at all.... you are definitely a liar.

 

A lot of people claim that Judaism, Christianity, and Islam worship the same God. So if that's true then the muslim fanatics are perfectly correct in waging war against non-muslims because that's what God told them to do in the Koran. So since God told them to do that why should Jews and Christians complain when they're being killed?

 

Loving and worshiping God is taught and rightly so! God gives just as much as he takes, the joys of parenthood, sunsets, heck every breath you take is a gift of Gods. But see the thing is that a lot of this boils down to questioning God and demanding evidence of his existence. That is something you do not do and you do not have to because of faith. That concept of faith is the binding glue of all of this. If you have it then it all makes sense. If you dont then none of this is logical and it makes not sense. You ask why should you love a neutral God? Because of my faith I say how can you not?

 

First that has nothing to do with the topic. Second if they get all their ideas from one book and kill because of it then they should probably read more books. Third God did not order them to kill they decided to do that on their own.

 

You get zero points for that comment. Of course the Koran tells them to kill and since it's the word of God they are obligated to obey or else they will go to hell. You can Google the applicable passages or read the entire thing at your leisure. Everyone else here knows what it says so please get up to speed if you want to joust.

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/quran/

 

Ref. Post #1: The Bible itself gives a definitive answer to that question. Basically people are supposed to have enough sense to know the difference between good and evil and not to do evil. That was the whole point of Adam & Eve eating from the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

As it says in Ezekiel 20:23-26 (CEB) =
[SUP]23 [/SUP]And I swore yet another solemn pledge in the desert, that I would disperse them among the nations and scatter them throughout the earth, [SUP]24 [/SUP]because they didn’t observe my case laws, they rejected my regulations, and they degraded my sabbaths while they kept looking to their parents’ idols. [SUP]25 [/SUP]I also issued regulations that were not good and case laws by which they could not live. [SUP]26 [/SUP]I defiled them with their very gifts when they offered up all their oldest children. They were supposed to be so horrified that they would acknowledge that I am the Lord.

 

The book may say that but no one is obligating them to do what it says. A book is not God so the Koran, Talmud, or Bible is not God. Holy books give insight but they are not people or deities and cannot give orders. But that is a discussion for another thread unless you can some how convince us all that a Book looked one of us in the eye and said "hey their brother I am God go kill some one."

 

Why would you believe or do anything in the book unless you think that God said it? So if you believe even one thing why not believe all of it?

 

The Bible was written by men, divinely inspired but still by men. The Bible is the preeminent scriptures for the Church, but you also need to include the Church Fathers and their scholarship, and Church Tradition. You are speaking of Sola Scriptura which has been rejected by the Orthodox Church.

 

To me, and the dictionary, divinely inspired means they are God's words, given to the authors.

 

actually, it would be weakness to obey. unless you feel that saving your own skin (and risking that golden ticket to immortality) is more important than the life of the person god has asked you to extinguish. to use your own example, a child. it would be a weak man or woman indeed, who chose to kill a child rather than risk their own - already adult and with considerable life lived - skin.

 

So you get to keep the parts that you like but make up stuff to replace the parts that you don't like. That's wonderful.

In Islam you have to accept it all or reject it all.

 

Allow me to illustrate this question in the form of a mathematical problem. This is the way that anti-theists look when they pose this question:

What if 1+1=3. I know it doesn't, but let's say it did! What would the answer to 1+2=X be?

These "If God did evil" topics are more revealing of the incompetence of the asker than anything else. The answer isn't if we would do it or not. The answer is: "You don't understand God".

 

If I begin to hear God speaking to me, let alone telling me what to do, I hope I'd have enough left of my faculties to seek some professional help. If I don't then there's the chance that I'd follow orders. But I think that if I had a decent attorney, (s)he'd be able to make a case for 'diminished capacity' or 'temporary insanity'.

 

Of course not, you should probably study the way the Church operates outside of the protestant denominations.

 

Crawdadr,

The ISIS guys believe that God (Allah) is telling them to behead civilians and that God (Allah) considers that a "good thing".

You yourself have said God is "neither good nor evil"....so can you judge that the ISIS guys are "wrong" in their theological beliefs? Outside of obvious human morality, I mean....the kind even atheists would agree to.

 

Proof or the usual hyperbole ?

 

You think ISIS doesn't consider what they're doing to be "holy" and "approved by God"????????

 

I asked if you had proof, or even knowledge, of what these guys are thinking.

But you answered... everything is based on what you "think".

 

That wouldn't make sense to me since their behaviors are unIslamic.. The Koran is very specific in that women, children and non-combatants are not to be harmed.

Sounds more to me like anything goes... "for God and country"..

But, hasn't raving nationalism always been ruthless and extreme? Religious fervor provides a cover.

 

But that doesn't serve Gorn well with his erroneous claims and accusations.

How he can claim killing women and children is "approved by God" in their religion is ridiculous.

I asked for proof, which obviously doesn't exist, but he'd rather argue.

 

Now see that is changing everything, in your hypothetical that started this, God came down and is actually telling me to do something. The ISIS guys are interpreting their scriptures (erroneously in my opinion) and use that to justify their actions. It would be like me reading the Bible and then going out and stoning an adulteress (which would also be misinterpreting scripture) Now since God has not come down from on high to give orders (as far as I know) we now have to use our moral compesses and logic to decide if what they are doing is right or wrong. ISIS is not doing that or they are using their religion for their own purposes.

 

If I knew to an accuracy of 100% that 'he' 'it' etc was God, which is impossible to know due to the human condition and limitations, yes I would nuke the world or myself, or whatever, ANYTHING ....or I like to think I would~

reva

 

seriously?

wow