Shooter is a Canadian, "self radicalized", Michael Joseph Hall.

You did not give me a ratio.
You said the KKK, McVeigh, BAU.

You are moving the goalposts.

We do not live in the dark ages. We have computers and space ships and (*)(*)(*)(*).

 

Canada's homegrown terrorist.

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2014/1...sible-mental-illness-knew-homegrown-jihadist/

 

I did not move the goal posts. I accept that these days, the ratio is not equal. I'm saying that if you look at the relative age of those 3 religions, Islam is where Christianity was during the dark ages.

And if you see the living conditions of the majority of these people, you would realize that it's still the dark ages for a lot of them. A lot of them live in dusty hovels with intermittent electricity, lack of indoor plumbing, plus the threat of violence and war constantly going back and forth over their heads.

I just don't understand these guys who live in a place like Canada or the US who convert, as they are living in the lap of luxury compared to a large portion of the world.

Look, I accept that the world and Islam is at a loggerhead, and a lot of violence is going to occur before it gets better. I just don't like to see All Muslims painted with the same brush, as some are good friends of mine, who hate what is being done to their religion.

 

You still did not give me a ratio.

Were it conditional to less evolved social environments it would exist only in less evolved social environments. You are ignoring, quite dishonestly, that the common denominator is not environment but the religion and its texts and Imams. You are absolutely moving the goalposts and using weak correlation to do it. Other religions exist in dark age conditions in the modern world, and this is not a unified issue. Your position lay smote. Now give me a ratio.

 

Every story I have read that referenced it said he had no social media accounts. No idea what you are talking about his "ISIS friends". I have read one report that one of his friends said that he expressed no radical views to him but that he had suspected he was becoming mentally ill because of erratic behavior recently. Every one on TV I have seen discussing him have painted him as a "lone wolf" so I doubt he had ISIS friends. Either way, he was planning to die.

 

There is no such thing as "self radicalized". islamoism raticalizees all that follow it to hell.

he has never said that though,, has he?? He could say that he loves Jesus a million times without hurting his ties to islam because lying is a weapon of islam. He can do or say whatever he wants at this point but when he held his hands over his crotch during the national anthem he lost all pretence of allegiance to this country. 0bama hate you, he hates your boss and he hates the Black people who voted for him.

You and the liberal horde know dam well that the Republicans were ready to stand another Black man against 0bama in the last election but the left wing media distorted him as they have never done to a any dem Black.

 

I don't have a ratio to give you. I have already conceded that if one such exists, that it would be lopsided against Islam. Not sure what else I can say to this point.

Finding the root cause of extremist ideals isn't quantifiable by something so simplistic as 'religion'. If that were the case then we would be dealing with over a billion terrorists, rather then the obviously much lesser amount that exist now. (trying to count how many are extremist isn't exactly a science. This guy does an interesting job of it though)

http://www.danielpipes.org/comments/65537

 

In context his guess would make them the second largest military in the world, just behind China, embedded in just about every country on Earth.

I think it warrants addressing without bringing up the KKK.

Call me crazy.

 

From what I recall, it's terrorism if it's aimed at civilians and has a political purpose behind it usually.

 

Very true, and yet
http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2013/apr/17/four-decades-us-terror-attacks-listed-since-1970

So if we take the world wide number (104K) and assume (wrongly) that every single one is Islamic fueled, that's only 0.0065% of the population. As we know that not every terrorist attack is Islam fueled, that number will be even smaller.

 

I am curious to learn why , in this day and age, and given a HEIGHTENED terror alert, Canadian SOLDIERS carry unloaded service ("ceremonial"" rifles .

The SGT at ARMS is a hero. I wonder if his pistol was " allowed" in his office.

Memo to gun control zealots: had the SOA NOT had his gun? We could be talking about a slew of dead Canuck legislators.

I am headed to Canada hunting soon. I noticed last time the Customs officer wearing a cumbersome and heavy bulletproof vest. I further noticed she was UNarmed.

I said: " So. You are prepared for INcoming fire but not to return it? "

She said they had guns in the back.

Smart.

 

I have to wonder how well Congress and the rest of the important folks in DC are protected, if someone tried to do something stupid like that here.

 

Yawn, more race card tossing drivel...we get it.

 

im not sure which is a worse, if these two attacks are coordinated, or two random cases of self-radicalized Muslim converts acting out murderous violence in the same week

 

I think most of the confusion regarding Islam and Muslims comes from people not clearly understanding the reasons for their hatred of the western cultured democracies. It seems to always get dressed up as oil and warfare in the various regions. Personally, I don't buy into that as the problematic root core issue across the entire spectrum of jihadists extremists, hardliners and moderates.

All of them in my opinion, whether they live in our western cultured societies or not...have fundamental distain/hatred for our secularism, and do not ever really want to integrate fully into our societies, hence why the moderates don't even seem to be moderates. At root, they don't like that aspect of our nations, despite fleeing to us in a lot of cases.

We, the west are poisoning their youth to their religious culture. The radicals want to do something about it violently, but the moderates are seemingly silent (for the most part), as they hold the same underlying contempt for our societies.

 

It is interesting to reflect on the fact at their best, the Nazis (the German ones) never could claim more than 43.9% of the total number of German voters, in the last free election in which all German political parties could participate. Of this number it is estimated that fewer than half were actually active, participating Nazi Party members.

Now, what percent of Muslims support radical Islam? No one can say for sure, but whether you like this news or not, at least please glance over the recorded support for radical Islam in the world recently:
http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Peace/2014/09/04/myth-tiny-radical-minority
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/pages/opinion-polls.htm
http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Are_the_Overwhelming_Majority_of_Muslims_Peaceful_Moderates

It can easily be understood that even Germans who secretly disapproved of Hitler loved the prosperity and success that the Nazis brought to a Germany that was thoroughly humiliated and subjected to illegal reparations payments by the Allies after World War One. Could it be as easily accepted by the so-called "peaceful" Muslims if radical, violent Islam was victorious over the "infidels" and established Sharia Law over everyone? Where and who are these "peaceful" Muslims who deplore violence, sabotage, and murder committed by their Allah-worshipping brothers and sisters? Where are their voices? Where are their faces? They remind me of non-Nazi Germans who grew fat and happy during the glory-years of Hitler's Third Reich....

"Birds of a feather flock together."

 

First of all . . .it DOES matter what we call it. The FBI defines domestic terrorism as:

"Domestic terrorism" means activities with the following three characteristics:

Involve acts dangerous to human life that violate federal or state law;
Appear intended
(i) to intimidate or coerce a civilian population;
(ii) to influence the policy of a government by intimidation or coercion; or
(iii) to affect the conduct of a government by mass destruction, assassination. or kidnapping; and
Occur primarily within the territorial jurisdiction of the U.S.

Workplace violence by someone shouting Allah Ak Akbar (or whatever the correct phrase is) by some traitor is NOT workplace violence. It is an act of terror laid out by definition from the FBI.

It is interesting to note that the FBI also includes in their statutes that terrorism such as the Fort Hood attack and the recent Canadian attack as;


Is a violation of one of several listed statutes relating to killing or attempted killing during an attack on a federal facility with a dangerous weapon); relating to killing or attempted killing of officers and employees of the U.S.

Read; TERROR, not workplace hanky panky.

 

it was an act of lone-wolf terrorism.

so far.

but we may find out he had connections to terror groups.

 

". . . Multiple media outlets identified the man as Michael Zehaf-Bibeau, who had been known as Michael Joseph Hall before converting.

Here’s what we know about Bibeau:



. . . After Bibeau’s name was released, this picture, widely reported to be Michael Zehaf-Bibeau, was circulated on Twitter by the account [MENTION=52072]break[/MENTION]ing3Zero.

Military Studies told Heavy.com Martin Couture-Rouleau followed the same Canadian-based pro-ISIS Twitter account. On October 20, Rouleau killed a Canadian soldier by hitting him with his car. Rouleau was a recent convert to Islam and told a 911 operator that he performed the act in the name of Allah."

. . . Dave Bathurst said that Bibeau knew Canadian terror suspect Hasibullah Yusufzai. He’s still at-large after leaving Canada to fight in Syria. CTV reports that emails from Bibeau appeared in the account of another Canadian terror suspect. . . .

. . . According to the BBC, Bibeau’s father, Bulgasem Zehaf, was originally from Libya and at one point ran a cafe named the Tripoli Cafe in Montreal. The shooter’s mother, Susan Bibeau, worked on Canada’s Immigration and Refugee Board, reports The Globe and Mail. The couple divorced in 1999.

According to the Globe and Mail piece, Bulgasem Zehaf fought in Libya in 2011. The article doesn’t state if he fought with a pro or anti-Gaddafi faction. . .

. . . The soldier killed by Bibeau was named as Cpl. Nathan Cirillo. He was a military reservist. Cirillo was from Hamilton in Ontario, Canada. He was just 24 years old. Commissioner Paulson said that Cirillo was shot twice when he had his back to Bibeau. . . ​

RIP Nathan Cirillo

http://heavy.com/news/2014/10/michael-zehaf-bibeau-ottawa-parliament-shooting-terro-attack/

 

Can we all agree that lone " wolf" is too honorable ?

How about lone " coyote" ?

or lone " rat" ?

 

I believe The Right Honourable Stephen Harper said it best today. http://http://www.torontosun.com/2014/10/23/parts-of-ottawa-still-on-lockdown-parliament-hill-closed-after-shooting

Ultimately, my point is that despite the terrorism that has struck Canada. We stand like raised fists to those that would see us lay down in fear. Some of us even extend a digit on those fists.

To quote Harper again...

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/ottawa-shooting-a-day-of-chaos-leaves-soldier-gunman-dead-1.2808710

 

Great. I dislike the man's politics, but his speech sums up what we ALL think; whether left or right. These (*)(*)(*)(*)s WILL NOT and CANNOT disrupt or tear down democracy.

 

Partisanship is irrelevant in these situations. When in situations like these governments need to put aside their political views, and do what is necessary for their country.

 

I question the power of the government however, and remain highly suspect of their motives... they typically function to increase their power. Liberals used to question state power but now they seem to worship it. I agree we need to have a practical and realistic balance between security and freedom, but remember that terrorism - like murder - will always exist. We need to recognise the limitations of governmental power - NO law can prevent ideology.