Is atheism a religion?

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by Teenageblogger, Oct 29, 2014.

  1. Teenageblogger

    Teenageblogger New Member

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    So today in a Model UN meet, the topic of atheism was brought up. People thought that in accordance to the constitution of my country (Iceland for those who want to know) the wording (don't hate for not exact wording) "Those who belittle religious teachings or the belief in God will be charged with..." does not protect atheists. The argument was that atheists do not believe in a higher power (I had to correct someone who mistook atheism for just non existence of God), so therefore in an indirect way, that was in fact a religious teaching. I contended that atheism is not a religion, it can be more classified as a belief system.

    My point being, is atheism considered a religion today, even though a definition could be classified as "absence of religion"? I believe it is more of a belief system, and therefore not a religion but more of a way of thinking.
     
  2. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

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    Is atheism a religion?

    NO
     
  3. Teenageblogger

    Teenageblogger New Member

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    hmmmm. interesting point.
     
  4. Colonel K

    Colonel K Well-Known Member

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    Definitely no.
     
  5. RiaRaeb

    RiaRaeb Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Atheism is the lack of a belief in god.

    It is not a religion, a belief system or even a movement.
     
  6. Teenageblogger

    Teenageblogger New Member

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    I would like to refute your point by extending it. It is the belief that there is no higher power. Whether that be God, the Greek Gods, or the Buddha. Another would be the lack of faith of in higher powers. But the lack of doesn't necessarily mean you don't believe. The disbelief is the belief.
     
  7. RiaRaeb

    RiaRaeb Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Any God, do you disbelieve in cheese sandwiches orbiting the moon? No you simple have a lack of belief in cheese sandwiches orbiting the moon. Lack of belief is the opposite of belief.
     
  8. Teenageblogger

    Teenageblogger New Member

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    The same could be said for disbelief.
     
  9. Swensson

    Swensson Devil's advocate

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    Well, the problem is that there isn't a general definition of religion. We don't know what buttons a concept needs to press in order to be a religion. This means that until we have a working definition of religion, we can't tell if atheism is one or not (this means we have to be careful, sometimes, we need our logic to make sense regardless of whether atheism is a religion, and sometimes it means certain pieces of logic have to be false because it could conceivably tell the difference between two things that aren't actually different).

    In a perfect world, freedom of religion and other protections religions enjoy should actually be a subset of a more general set of protections which then should include atheism. Atheism shouldn't be protected _because_ it is a religion (since it being a religion would merely be semantics, and ideally, philosophy should not depend on semantics), atheism should be protected because all world views (or whatever you might call it) should be protected. However, a wording that would include atheism would often include lots of other silly things, which is why it hasn't made its way into most legislation (corrections to the US first amendment being a notable exception).

    That being said, I'm quite in favour of calling atheism a religion. Mostly for practical reasons, it is hard to think of what to describe atheism as (it's not really a world view, not really a set of statements on the nature of reality, there are many things which it is not), so it'd be useful if one defined religion is such a way that it included atheism for descriptive purposes. It also complements the normal religions nicely, making answers to questions like "what religion are you?" less ambiguous. I also like that it brings attention to the fact that something qualifying as a religion is not what makes (some) religions bad, it is specifics about those religions. Sometimes, they are common specifics, but that does not make them general.
     
  10. RiaRaeb

    RiaRaeb Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    No, I have a lack of belief in God, its not worth forming a belief one way or another it is completely irrelevant.
    For instance I do not require a belief in god to show the Christian God does not exist.
     
  11. NightSwimmer

    NightSwimmer New Member

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    Atheism isn't a "belief system". If anything, it is a "disbelief system".
     
  12. RiaRaeb

    RiaRaeb Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    First you need to come up with an agreed definition of God.
    Is money a God if materialism is a religion?
    What about agnosticism is that a religion?
     
  13. NightSwimmer

    NightSwimmer New Member

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    Why do you presume that it is necessary for everyone to have a religion to which you can affix a label?
     
  14. Teenageblogger

    Teenageblogger New Member

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    No but it requires a consistent disbelief to show the non existence. You have to disbelieve in something to prove it doesn't exist. A lack of belief doesn't implies disbelief. I disbelieve in unicorns. I have a lack of belief in unicorns. Just because you change the "disbelief" into "lack of belief" doesn't change the overall meaning.
     
  15. Swensson

    Swensson Devil's advocate

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    I don't, the practical categorisation I mention is certainly not a be-all end-all solution to labelling people's beliefs, just a simplification.

    Or actually, maybe I do. The necessity of everyone having a religion would not be imposed by making statements about those religions or the beliefs that go into them. The meaning of the word religion is malleable enough that grouping everyone who don't fall into another category into a category of their own is perfectly acceptable. In other words, why do you presume that my use of the word religion is one in which affixing a label to someone's religion is in any way problematic?
     
  16. doniston

    doniston New Member Past Donor

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    ctually you are partially right Dis-belief "IS" the opposite of belief, Lack of belief or non-belief is the middle non-committal ground.

    s9milar to like----don't like-----dislike.

    BTY, My Atheism IS "MY" religion so it can be a religion. It is similar to Christianity, but without the TRINITY underpinnings
     
  17. RiaRaeb

    RiaRaeb Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Who said anything about non existence?
    If you wish to discuss the non existence of a Christian God fine. But I lack a belief of god, whether it exists or not is irrelevant.
     
  18. Swensson

    Swensson Devil's advocate

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    And what about things like Buddhism, who don't attribute godhood either to that which they worship, nor to creators or power the way westerners do?

    As my main point says, there is no agreed upon definition. Breaking the lack of definitions into smaller pieces does not change that. My decision to call support calling atheism a religion is not philosophically necessary, but neither is it practically unfounded. It could be that there are other practical reasons which I have not considered which makes it more practical to not call it a religion, but we know that there is no absolute answer, since that would require an absolute definition.
     
  19. One Mind

    One Mind Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    A religion seems to be an organized group of people who believe in a being that is the Creator of the universe, and they tend to anthropomorphize the image their brains create about this THING, or at least much of the religious scripture does it. Modern humans then use these ancient descriptions of these gods, which were anthropomorphized when those ancient books were written. And so these gods have human like personalities, as we impose ourselves upon those images the brain imagines.

    Atheism doesn't have an intelligent creator, but relies upon whatever they can glean from science in order to replace the need for a god. In fact, atheists have no place at all for intelligence being involved in the manifestation of reality, or the universe, and they have great faith in their beliefs about the utter non necessity of an intelligence involved in the manifestation of the universe and life itself starting with the big bang.

    But you know scientific materialism, that way of looking and comprehending the material universe started out with an assumption as its foundation. That assumption is of course that there is not a reality outside of matter, that matter is the ground of reality, and there is no spirit, no intelligence that is involved at all. So a materialist is by necessity an atheist. For his manner of looking at reality through materialism negates a god, an intelligence from the get go. There is no place in a materialistic understanding for a god, or a higher intelligence.

    At the end of the day, to use an old worn out phrase, the truth of the matter is no one actually can say that they know whether a creator, an intelligence exists outside of time, space and matter. And so since it is impossible to know, both atheists and theists share a commonality, of claiming to know something that is in truth unknowable. You could call both religions from that standpoint and be accurate.
     
  20. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    in order for atheism to 'qualify' as a religion in the commonly understood sense of the word (ie, not the tortured philosophical posturing sense) it would need to have some sort of godhead or figurehead, or group of gods/figureheads, some sort of dogma, some sort of ritualistic worship, and wouldn't have to pay taxes. there would also most likely be regular or semi-regular meetings of 'believers' (in this case non-belief believers), with wisdoms and insights handed down from a hierarchy of 'preachers'.
     
  21. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

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    Please show proof that atheists have a "need for god" they have to replace...what utter bunk...quit projecting your needs on others.


    An atheist is a person who doesn't believe in a god....they have NOTHING else in common.
     
  22. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    what is WITH your obsession with the idea that religion must be 'replaced' by something?

    religion is just a weird hobby ... like growing the largest begonia, or collecting beer cans. if you don't feel the tug of it yourself, you don't miss it if it's not there. do YOU feel a distinct void in your life due to lack of begonias? or lack of a beer can collection? or failure to collect stamps? must you replace these very specific and weird hobbies with something in order to fill that void? and do you NEED to grow large begonias or collect beer cans? exactly.

    Surely you're able to see how absurd it is to think everyone in the world feels the same tug as you? Do begonia growers think that beer can collectors are just trying replace begonias with beer cans?
     
  23. FoxHastings

    FoxHastings Well-Known Member

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    :woot: :worship: Thanks for the laugh, great post and true.....
     
  24. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    my pleasure!

    the multiple typos were provided at no extra charge :p
     
  25. GrayMan

    GrayMan Well-Known Member

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    Science is god.
    The scientists are the ritualistic groups who worship their god. The science nerds are the most devout believers.
     

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