Seriously….. What would it take for a GOD to prove itself? (Part 2)

Problems? What problems? You mean learning/growing opportunities?

 

Well...yes.

One of the things I always tell my buddies over cautious and smothering to her children wife is..."You have to allow them to FALL DOWN ONCE IN A WHILE!"

Because that's how a kid learns.

Encountering a PROBLEM.....and then figuring out a way to solve it.

AboveAlpha

 

It's similar and I have no problems using a modern version of a first cause cosmological argument called the KCA to lend evidence for my beliefs.

Design in nature or reality is to be expected. However, our universe has important but exclusive items that point to something unnatural is tweaking the system. Penrose mentioned several. Behe also, as do many modern Christian apologists, and many non-secular scientists are now emerging from the fear of being ridiculed or worse blacklisted and ruined by their secular atheist fellows. Also code is never seen in nature, it must have a designer or creator. Patterns occur naturally – no help required from a ‘designer’. Many patterns occur in nature without the help of a designer. All manner of patterns ie hurricanes ice crystals geometric rock structures, waves in the ocean or a lake all emerge in nature as a result of the laws of chaos and fractals.

The (above) said one thing that exists in nature, but does not occur without input from an ’intelligent designer’ are codes. Some examples of both man made and natural symbolic code is music, building plans, computer code as in computer programs, and, brace yourself DNA. DNA is not just a molecule with a double helix pattern, its a code and its also a language with an information storage system. The clincher is that all codes we know of are created by a conscious mind. So in consideration of the above its obvious DNA was designed by a mind far greater than ours. So if a being entity or _____ can create DNA etc it has the attributes of God and therefore for all intensive purposes is God. Maybe not a specific God, that is why I have been claiming for a decade specificity of the divine is not important. That a powerful creator of unimaginable intelligence exists is.

And that precisely is the reason science should not be considered truth. I know via the scientific methodology science does not fancy itself a purveyor of truth. However the SE (Scientific Establishment) certainly implies that it is the exclusive wielder of truth and the definer of reality. It uses that bully pulpit to demean and ridicule other systems including religion and metaphysics that in the opinion of billions more clearly describes and defines reality. Its that arrogance and that brutal exclusivity, our way or the high way that I don't care for. Everyone should be entitled to their own choice when choosing what they believe or want their children to beleive and or be taught. Today the public school system is ruled by nearly a police state mentality.

Well you are entitled to your beliefs and I respect them. But the way I understand the BB and everything that came after is that it nearly proves an ID exists! I beleive that the BB model of our universe origins lends empirical validity to the existence of an ID. Several examples are; The universe should be a white hot plasma instead of a cold and therefore life friendly system. The odds are astronomically high for an white hot universe to have been created in the BB, but we have the cold and expanding, life giving universe. Another is that the universe began. Why? The KCA gives evidence by the type of argument ie it uses a logical syllogism supported by its axioms to show that the existence of an ID is almost a given. Nothing begins without a cause to do so. So, according to science nothing existed before the BB, which means that time, space, none of the natural forces, matter, gravity, energy, ie NOTHING (physical) existed 'before' the big bang, the only 'thing' that could have existed that could have caused the BB to begin to 'bang' lol, is by logical default, God. That is because God is not a physical object, but a spiritual entity.

Thanks for your post CD
~reva ~

 

Yellow really?. Lol typo....now I forgot what I was going to say....reva

 

The whole issue here is to rationally describe a God as creator of the Universe.
ID seems retarded in the light of the First Cause argument.
The First Cause AXIOM is what all science people use as an Axiom, before they can start their Cause/Effect investigations.
(Remember, science people start with the argument against Magic, saying that all things can be explained by Cause/Effect.)

The science-centered people may not understand that Cause/Effect arguments require this Axiom, since there is no way or means or rational factual explanation for the cause of the Big Bang.
The absence of that First Cause immediately denies their claim against the magic of a Big Bang.

After that matter has been discussed, one might add that Niels Bohr founded the whole of Quantum Physics upon what is now called The Copenhagen Interpretation.
CI concerns how Observation of a particle in the Double Slit Experiment decides the consequences of the Wave/Particle effect.

Copenhagen Interpretation states that before a wave function can become part of Reality, it must be observed.
The observation "collapses" the wave function which then uses the information it carries to become "real," or exist.

Hence, CI is saying that before the Big Bang,... those Wave Functions with the information to become real must have had some "Observer."

That "Observer" had to pre-exist and be outside of what would become the Universe, in order to have collapsed the first waves.
This scientifically defines a Creator, one the Bible calls our "God."

 

You are making an assumption that DNA Complexity demands that a GOD designed it.

Now there is no evidence that a GOD designed DNA nor is their evidence a OD did not design DNA but this also depends upon what you believe GOD actually is.

DNA exists in both Life Forms and Non-Life.

DNA is simply a MOLECULE.....a very long and extensive Molecule but a Molecule none the less.

Human's have mapped Thousands upon Thousands of Genomes and their DNA in many plants and animals and Human's are animals.

The TWO most important thing that all this Genome Mapping has shown us is....

#1. All Life on Earth EVOLVED FROM A SINGLE CELLED ORGANISM.

#2. That Non-Living things such as a Virus which has DNA.....is not all that much different that LIVING THINGS.

As far as #1.....we KNOW this to be a fact because of this.....The Virus existed before Life and although a Virus is not alive....the two men who won the Nobel Prize in Virology won it in the CHEMISTRY CATEGORY not in the BIOLOGY CATEGORY as even though a Virus has DNA it is not a Living thing......we found that in all the Thousands upon thousands of Mapped Genomes of Life Forms every single one had out of the thousands of other Viral Infected Viral DNA Encoding into their Genomes......ONE VIRAL DNA ENCODING THAT WAS THE SAME!!

Now all Life Forms plant. animals, micro-organisms....all have thousands of different and many the same Viral DNA Encoding in their Genomes......BUT EVERY LIVING THINGS GENOME INCLUDING HUMANS HAVE ONE SINGLE ANCIENT VIRAL DNA ENCODING IN ALL OF THEM!!!

The ONLY way this could have happened id that the Original Single Celled Organism was infected by a Virus...and some survived as the reproduced thus split via mitosis and the one that survived carried with it the Ancient Original Viral DNA Encoding and through Evolution so does all life carry this one in the same Ancient Viral DNA Encoding in all Life Forms Genomes.

As far as #2.....this just shows us how QUANTUM EVOLUTION took place.

AboveAlpha

 

Yes…… a couple of years ago I was a bit shocked to read how those beings of light who meet people who have a brush with death view our mistakes and errors……. so very differently than theologians have taught us to think about our "sins????"

http://www.near-death.com/storm.html#a06

 

Yesterday it hit me………. I have another good answer to your opening post question that is right up there with my previous answer…….Karma…………..

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/irreplaceability

The case that can be presented for IRREPLACEABILITY…… is ultimately powerful evidence for some sort of higher dimensional intelligence…. force…. power…..
individual or group of individuals… that is/are so mature….. that this force or person or group…….. actually love us……. and have given us off the scale artistic
freedom to learn from our stupid mistakes………… and become better and better people…….. even in alternate lines of time!

Irreplaceability…… ties in with the case for non-linear time…….. which I have read you explain in a way that astonished me………. but…. I am convinced that there are
not an infinite number of AboveAlpha's out there yet……… but there certainly are other versions of you……. (I will get into this more over in this thread)…….

http://www.politicalforum.com/humor...2000-election-but-negates-global-dimming.html
In alternate time line Mr. Gore wins the 2000 election but negates Global Dimming....
I personally loved the film "An Inconvenient Truth." I have watched it four or five times at least. It played a huge role in my deciding to join a political party that takes climate change very seriously.

Largely due to his film I actually put in two submissions for The Virgin Earth Challenge.

I do have one criticism for his film though..... the diplomacy quotient was extremely low and America is more divided than ever partly because of the flavor of his film.

 

But……. I have read some intriguing evidence that some sort of power/ intelligence…… can modify DNA and improve it?!

Of course….. she could be lying……… but I have heard of this happening to other groups of people who are fundamentalist Christian….. whereas this woman is seriously into the New Age Movement. When two quite different group report something similar happening…… then I wonder if the hot vs cold principle is kicking into effect…….

As you can guess….. I am suspecting that this fits in with……

Isaiah 65:25

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=681577035303475&set=gm.421040958078111&type=1&theater

Revelation 3:15
"I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot."

The Creator wants us to have some chutzpah…… to make a choice………. New Agers in Findhorn reported growing huge cabbages and broccoli near the Arctic Circle…… Fundamentalist Christian farmers in Guatamela also reported growing huge veggies as they prayed for their crops?!?!

This DNA thing…. also seems to be happening…… from both extremes of the spirituality spectrum??????!

 

"Seriously….. What would it take for a GOD to prove itself?" When he gives the Pope the cure to cancer, then I'll believe. In the mean time, this supposedly all-loving, all-powerful invisible friend in the sky is too immoral and/or too unreal to do that, so of course I can't believe in him.

 

Pope Francis is in a powerful position to get the whole world looking at money in a different way.

Once we look at human life as having nearly infinite value to a deeply emotionally involved probable Creator/ Creators/ creator/ creators......… then....... we will be ready for something far better than Obama Care?!

Pope Francis impresses me as the type of person who would tend to support Dr. Stanislaw Burzynski over Big Pharma?!

http://burzynskimovie.com/


http://www.politicalforum.com/relig...most-emotional-being-universe-multiverse.html

Could God the Father be the most emotional being in the universe/ multiverse?



Which type of project will you tend to get more involve in?

A job that you invested fifty hours of your time in over one month or a labour of love where you exerted a great deal of effort for 50,000 hours over forty years?


http://www.near-death.com/experiences/reincarnation04.html#a05

 

The Pope is highly immoral, because he endorses Biblical-related nonsense (no condoms, apparently) over the lives of innocent Africans who die of AIDS, which could be prevented by condoms. A man with warped priorities.

 

The Pope is a voice they can hear, telling them the Truth for what they see now occurring.

AIDS could have been prevent without condoms had these people understood the consequences of the sexual promiscuity they decided to "enjoy."
They are living examples of what happens when a society is taught to promiscuous,and the children need watch the destruction of these evil behaving people and never act that way in the future.

 

There are over 7 Billion People on Earth.

Sex is a natural thing and Genetically imprinted into every Human Being.

AID's was a SIMEAN DISEASE caused by African's eating BUSH MEAT....thus they ate Gorillas, Chimps...etc....and it was something that attacked our Human Immune System.

People having sex is not something anything will curtail.

Taking precausions and developing a Genetic Cure for AID's is the way to go.

AboveAlpha

 

Dr. Leo Rebello's theory on reducing HIV for the cost of about one dollar per person per year……. seems to be less expensive than condoms?!


http://www.healthwisdom.org/aidsminera.htm
AIDS THE TRACE MINERALS FAMINE IMMUNE WEAKNESS
COMPILED AND EDITED BY DR. LEO REBELLO

…

The downside to this is that big pharma stock prices are keeping the stock market artificially high……… and a serious study on such a low cost way of helping humans……. could cause the stock market to fall worse than it did back in 2008.

 

Spooky…. who do you think gave Ms. Jessica Simpson her GEOMETRY…. her form…… G-d or Satan?

Not sure if this file will work….. when I attempted to add it as an image…. it said the file was too large but….. Wow!

https://clickmatizeblob.blob.core.windows.net/images/5efc3ab6-e50c-40d2-bbe9-961ed1a9755a.gif

With geometry like that……. I cannot imagine that that woman's great, great, great, great ^n…… grandmother ever had to crawl out of a swamp….. certainly not by pure random chance anyway…… ( of course some evil lustful rich white guy might have been trying to enslave her great great grandmother in some way I guess…. that would of course be different)????!

 

........ and.......

... (from a P. M.)

AboveAlpha....... now that you have mentioned this I finally for the first time understand some articles that I read over twenty years ago about how Stephen Hawking Ph. D. was not yet able to fit GRAVITY into a Grand Unified Theory?!

And to my thinking the implications of this imply the existence of both HUMOUR as well as intelligence at a level of energy that is either fundamental or nearly fundamental.......... To a degree this also fits with the evidence that seems to indicate some form of KARMA............. If..... the evidence that implies KARMA......... is actually indicating something along the line of a nearly infinite number of lines of time branching and branching off from day to day life here on earth.......... The HUMOUR in the whole thing.......... again...... implies the existence of off the scale intelligence...... We guys have all heard the saying that women ..... cannot be figured out or understood........ ever................ well....... it seems that this may well apply to the Divine Feminine/ G-d the Mother/ The Shekinah Glory of G-d of Jewish thought and/or the Holy Ghost/ Holy Spirit of Christian thought??????

 

Some of the basics for all this are right here..........


http://www.politicalforum.com/scien...ionary-theory-divine-feminine-god-mother.html
Theistic Evolutionary Theory and The Divine Feminine/God The Mother??!!
The masculine and feminine thought and behaviour patterns may have a basis in theoretical physics.

http://www.grandunifiedtheory.org.il/gender/g1.htm

http://www.grandunifiedtheory.org.il/book/life1.htm

.....This web page presents a powerful case that near death experience accounts may fit perfectly with String Theory??!!

http://www.near-death.com/experiences/research08.html

The NDE and Science
Kevin Williams' Research Conclusions


If Kevin Williams' theories are correct then the stage is set for a more theistic version of evolutionary theory to play a major role in breaking women out of near slavery like conditions in the developing world??!!

Christian Adreason reports that during his NDE he got the distinct impression that the person who Christians call the Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit is none other than God the Mother!!!???

http://www.allaboutchristian.com/spirituality/

 

Once Pope Francis gets his head fully around Unlimited Financing............... Infinite Money................. in some form..... he will be able to..............."answer all things"..... including cancer?!?!

"For laughter they make bread, and wine that the living may feast: and all things obey money."
Ecclesiastes 10:19
"A feast is made for laughter, and wine maketh merry: but money answereth all things."

http://www.politicalforum.com/humor...ut-we-assist-jews-get-rabbi-nachman-back.html
Dear Pope Francis...... how about we assist the Jews to get Rabbi Nachman back?

 

AboveAlpha...... over a decade ago I read a powerful case that the Roman Catholic church decided on a male and celibate priesthood, in order to attempt to stop women from completely taking over in the first and second and third Messianic Jewish and Messianic Gentile communities.

Church........ for some decades...... took place mostly in homes.......... and we guys all know that our wives rule over their home....... their nest...... with something pretty close to a "rod of iron."

Messianic Jewish women and Messianic Gentile women in the first and second and even third century Christian movement.......... had a huge amount of power....... because if the wife didn't want somebody in their home.......... we husbands know that that person who is not welcome............ would find it very difficult to get past the first lady of each home so......... in order to preserve the power and authority of us guys................. drastic measures were resorted to?!

After Emperor Constantine converted to Christianity........... the church overnight inherited a vast number of pagan temples.............. so the idols in the temples were mostly given new names........... most were not destroyed as Cephas - Peter might have decided to do, if he was still alive and regarded as the human head of the church?!?!

Over the previous centuries the guys had noticed how much power that women had....... when Sabbath and First Day of the week church meetings took place in homes............ (some meetings did take place on the first day of the week, if actual physical work would be involved)?!

1Corinthians 16:2
"Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come."

A church meeting centered around the distribution of aid for the poor in some form........ would not go over so well with the Messianic Jewish segment of that church at Corinth.

Anyway..... my primary point.......... was that the power of the Emperor/ Pope over the Messianic Jewish and Messianic Gentile movement ......... seemed to be decreased unless........ the majority of church meetings could be TAKEN OUT OF HOMES....... and taken to large pagan temples..... that were now the property of the Roman Christian church.

The political- theological decision to institute a supposedly celibate priesthood........ and a supposedly celibate group of women to back them up............. had a great deal to do with preserving the male domination of the new Christian movement.

 

I remember that one time you mentioned that you would like to believe that there was some truth to the idea of karma.

In this interview, three time near death experiencer Dannion Brinkley states that during the life review part of the NDE, we become.............. the people who we harmed...... but we also become.............. do something like a Vulcan Mind Meld..... with the people that we do good for and love.

I had read a little about this before but in this interview he really goes into this in a way that makes more sense out of this. I was impressed by this. And this is like another variation on the theme of Karma?!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZvD4pn2OTc8
Dannion Brinkley -The Near Death Experience & The Hereafter

 

I would love to believe in Karma but unfortunately their is too much death and suffering of innocents going on for me to actually believe in it.

AboveAlpha

 

Why don't they make cure?

 

This is a Virus that is constantly evolving and mutating.

Since HIV and thus AID's attacks the Human Immune System it is very difficult for the body to kill the Virus however some people have contracted HIV and AID's have had their own bodies immune system kill the Virus.

We have been working with such people and the best way to cure AID's is to develop a Genetic Cure that is delivered into the body via a Retro-Virus.

There is still a lot of work to be done but such a cure would also work for a host of other diseases such as Cancer and ALS...etc.

AboveAlpha

 

AboveAlpha..... You have just given an astonishing answer over in another discussion that to my thinking also relates to this question...............… The evidence for the Multiverse...… indicates some sort of intelligence existing in fundamental or nearly fundamental energy who................ has something along the line of SENTIMENTALITY and in a sense misses certain people and / or angels and / or aliens and/ or whatever other life form may have once existed that did not attain the higher level of consciousness that they could have during their span of time/ lifetime, so.......... after a gap of "time" in which these lifeforms can reevaluate their lifetime, another time line is initiated that could perhaps be done so that those life forms can attain a higher level of consciousness....... in this new time line??????

If......… no fundamental energy or nearly fundamental energy intelligence existed in the Multiverse, then.............. perhaps many aspects of the Multiverse would not be as they are?????!





http://www.politicalforum.com/showthread.php?t=400055&page=31&p=1065341007#post1065341007
Off the Chart Universal and Multiversal Models.

Ezekiel 37......… implies many time lines...… which implies some sort of logic for those time lines.......... which indicates a high level intelligence that seems to be "attached" to four dimensional life forms?????!



http://www.blueletterbible.org/Bible.cfm?b=Eze&c=37&t=KJV


Ezekiel 37:1

¶
The hand of the LORD was upon me, and carried me out in the spirit of the LORD, and set me down in the midst of the valley which was full of bones,
And caused me to pass by them round about: and, behold, there were very many in the open valley; and, lo, they were very dry.
And he said unto me, Son of man, can these bones live? And I answered, O Lord GOD, thou knowest.
Again he said unto me, Prophesy upon these bones, and say unto them, O ye dry bones, hear the word of the LORD.
Thus saith the Lord GOD unto these bones; Behold, I will cause breath to enter into you, and ye shall live:
And I will lay sinews upon you, and will bring up flesh upon you, and cover you with skin, and put breath in you, and ye shall live; and ye shall know that I am the LORD."

............. Every piece of evidence for non -linear time......… in a way..... indicates some sort of higher intelligence who has invested in us.......... gotten attached to us........ and as Ezekiel wrote as clearly as he could after he had been shown something pretty amazing....... we humans are being recreated/ resurrected, as new time lines are set in motion?!

One of the scary aspects of this is that fundamental energy intelligence......seems to be insisting that we learn to care much much much more for others than we have done in the past????!


http://www.near-death.com/experiences/notable/howard-storm.html#a04

If......… more leaders in industry, business, politics, government, banking and entertainment......… better understood the probable implications of the evidence for Multiverse.............. we would honestly be attempting to cure cancer and HIV and reform the world economy to make it much more beneficial for seven billion humans as well as the animals who assist us so much.