Switch to Sustainable Energy

I think it's clear that man-made climate change is a threat. Although many people disagree. There are plenty of threads where people argue about whether or not man-made climate change is real, or debate how dangerous it is. It seems that nobody even comes close to changing their mind after countless pages of arguing. As I said, I think it's clear that man-made climate change is a threat, but let's pretend that we know that the chance of man-made climate change becoming a serious problem is exactly 1%. Why not just switch to clean sustainable energy because of the fact that the energy we're using now wont last forever, and because of the fact that if the claims of climate science are true and we don't act on it, we are pretty much all screwed. I don't have much confidence that this thread won't turn into another debate over whether man-made climate change is real or not, but please attempt to stay on topic.

 

I agree, Nuclear is a viable, renewable source.

 

well my first question would be, who should pay for this? taxpayers, or costs passed along to consumers?

if you said taxpayers, the conversation is over with roughly 90% of people... if you said consumers, the conversation is over with roughly 90% of people...

haha I tricked you there...

so why is using renewable power so tough? it just comes down to the fact it costs more than other sources of power in implementation today, its that simple, it really is... who is hurt the most by this push for cleaner greener energy... the very poor people that the same liberals who push for this claim to fight for... so if the very poor people they want to help, are hurt most by high energy prices, why on earth would this ever make sense? you'd be harming those who can least afford it...

now lets say you develop a technology, thats equal to the cost of todays current energy... one of two things will happen... people will adopt it because its the same price, or energy companies will find ways to improve efficiency and slash costs of the energy they are selling, making it non-competitive once again... now lets say you develop a technology, thats below cost of todays current energy... one of two things will happen... like before energy companies will try to compete and become more efficient and deliver a cheaper product, but if they can't keep beating the price, people will adopt the technology in droves on their own...

so there you have it... if you want to achieve your goals, all you have to do is make it cheaper... but you can't do that by subsidizing it or regulating the other industry higher to force the demand... that will create backlash, you know, exactly whats going on now as people are reading whats on the wall... forcing everyone to pay higher prices isn't a win... it once again hurts the very people who can least afford it, thats always been the argument... cheap energy lifts people out of poverty...

P.S. thats why I find it so ironic the green energy folks who claim to also want to help those in poverty, block attempts for those in other countries to get access to cheap energy... so the very thing that could lift them out of poverty, is blocked because we think we have a better way for them to live... and we ignore our own history and success as a result of that cheap energy booming our society light years ahead of others...

 

ok..live a year without using any plastic or fossil fuels..no cars..no friends cars..just walk...no buses either...if you ride a bike it must be made with no plastic or fossil fuel grease base products...buy all your goods made with no oil base or plastics..if you can do this then i will listen to you...and most of all live off solar power 24 hours and 365 days a year rain or shine without municipal power usage..

 

I saw someone do this once... it was just on tv moments ago in fact... Mick Dodge... some guy who lives in a state forest park... although its illegal for him to do that, they seem to let him stay around as a bit of a novelty... I wonder how they would feel if 330 million started doing that...

 

Have fun, if that's what you want to do. Hell, you can even turn Amish and nobody will complain. Get a horse and buggy, till the soil, and become one with nature with a sustainable eco-friendly lifestyle.

Nobody is stopping you.

 

You are using fossil fuel to post on an internet forum along with the plastics used in the electronics device you used to make the post. If you truly believe man is causing this, then why do you think its ok for you to waste energy for your personal use of an internet forum?
Secondly the energy you are asking to switch to does not exist. Man has not yet discovered a viable replacement for fossil fuel. If you have plans on how to get a tractor trailer from one side of the country to the other on massive scales without using fossil fuel please PM me. I want in on your trillion dollar invention.

 

and so solar panels are made of plastics so they can't use them either...

 

which is it, is plastic bad or is plastic good?

 

plastic is from oil base..so bad to use if you are against fossil fuels...

 

exactly.

 

he hasn't said one word so maybe he realized that it would be impossible to live without fossil fuels...no wire can be used because the insulation is plastic...

 

I'm not saying that you should stop using any source of dirty energy. Some is inevetable. I just think that the government should do some things to help push for new sources of clean sustainable energy. Even if it's done in a Rand Paul sort of way. It doesn't need to be too expensive, at least when compared to some other things money are spent on.

 

The problem is these guys think at kum bah ya level. They have no concept of the energy required to keep us alive. Lets put it in perspective. If we stopped using fossil fuel today, the food would stop and almost everyone reading this who isn't heavily armed or stocked with food would be dead by this time next week. Also, the same people who claim man is causing climate change wont agree to heavily taxing people with more than two children. Ask them. So man is causing it but they want to increase not decrease the amount of man.

 

This raises a good point. Since oil is used for many more things than fuel, our goal should not be to burn it all up.

 

and when their girlfriend or wife has a child they cant take them to hospital unless they ride a bike or walk...guess Mr. environmentalist will have to deliver their own babies

 

What new sources?

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Perhaps we should turn the power off for two weeks, we can still deliver food but turn it off for two weeks then see if any alarmists want their power turned back on after that.

 

heck no..once it is off it is off for good..no second chance....

 

How exactly is nuclear renewable?

 

The problem with energy is that no matter where you get it there are trade offs. Solar farms and wind farms tend to require far more space per kilowatt hour generated than any other power source and while they are cleaner than fossil fuels both require fossil fuels in their manufacture. Nuclear power has radioactive waste, and that, though grossly overstated by your average green weenie environmentalist wacko, is a problem if for no other reason than the fact that the NIMBY effect is exacerbated. With modern smoke stack technology, about the only things produced by modern coal and oil fired power plants is water vapor and CO2 which is a pollutant the same way O2 is a pollutant. CO2 becomes plants and water vapor becomes rain.

 

If you look back at my first post, I asked why not switch to clean sustainable energy, not why not stop using anything that can contribute to climate change. Of course we would still use energy that is neither clean nor sustainable, I was rather wondering why we don't do something to speed up the switch to clean sustainable energy?

 

Scalability. That you can generate solar on the roof of our house does not mean that corporation can provide it in sufficient quantities, reliably, and at a profit. The government is only worried about commercial corporate sized operations. They do not want you and me not hooked to the grid not paying taxes and fees and for workers to maintain all them lines and poles.

 

There is only one reason I would switch to renewables and downsize my use of energy. I would do it for the freedom and independence from the grid and reduced need for income. I don't believe for a second that man can cause natural calamities other than through nuclear war.

IMO, most people are choking themselves to death with lifestyle. I would love to build my own small house and use solar and wind for power. I could do it and be completely debtfree. My need for income would be very limited allowing me to work less and enjoy life more.

IMO, liberal elites are a joke. Let's see them give up their large footprints.

 

"I don't believe for a second that man can cause natural calamities other than through nuclear war."
I hope you're not serious.

 

I'm very serious. At least from a standpoint of normality. Sure, mankind could try to flood the oceans with oil, but why would we?