Yes (hear me out), "all" Muslims BELIEVE IN terrorism.

Calm down, we are not in WW3. We are on a forum and I am trying to have a debate with you not radical Islamist's. Now do you agree that a person is a product of there environment?

If you insist that I "tell that to the Islamic State" exactly how many milliseconds do you think you would survive by telling them they are dumb?

 

please prove your assertion that the majority of secular humanists have condemned terrorism. Words like 'pretty sure' do not constitute proof. If you cannot or will not supply such evidence, I am forced to conclude that as a body, they are complicit with the goals and tactics of terror. I will wait.

 

If the environment involves many many people around a person saying that barbaric Sharia Law is from the ultimate creator of the universe, and is more moral than "man-made, not god's" law, then yes, of course, that environment will be toxic. That environment was HELPED, largely, by the Islamic texts, of course.

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You're not real big on common sense, are you?

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Some polls do show that, but many polls do NOT show that.

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Mr. Obama, is that you!?

 

Good point, because yes, their #1 role model had many critics of his slaughtered....here's a list, including Asma bint Marwan and Abu Afak: http://www.answering-islam.org/Authors/Arlandson/dead_poets.htm
They are just following their #1 role model, and Bush/Obama approve of his religion, so can we really blame them for going all Jihad on us?

 

Wow. Once again a topic as sobering and epidemic as child sexual abuse is twistedby the mind of a fixated bigot. Please point to your posts where you actually cared about the issue sexual child abuse or its victims beyond exploiting it to demean and undermine religious institutions rather than writing a new one. Try real hard, now. This is not about the Koran or the Bible. Its about kids who are hurt by adults they learned to love and trust only to be exploited and used for sexual gratification. Its not about Mohammed or Christ. Its about kids with names like Sarah, Mike, Alexander, and Karen, who are living in hell because some narcissistic man has a power trip which he confuses with mutual love. Can you show a past post of yours or at least write one now?

 

I gotcha .... and I agree that there are some seriously ripe things in the book. I like to look at it this way (after talking to moderate Muslim friends, who steered me onto this idea ): those who ostensibly support the idea of radicalism, even though not practicing it themselves, are like protestant Christians (most Christian nutjobs are protestant, let's face it), and the spiritual, peaceful, adaptive Muslims are like modern Catholics. I've even had one Muslim tell me they desperately need a "Pope" type figurehead like Francis. Anyway, I guess that's what I mean by 'peace and love'. It's the dismissal of the silly/bad stuff in the book, and a focus on the good stuff. Catholics tend to do that (hence their comfort with science and progress), and there are plenty of Muslims prepared to do the same.

 

Who is more bigoted, me or Jesus? Jesus will see that, say, crank and Einstein both get tortured forever for simply embracing science and not being like him...I on the other hand care about crank and Einstein and abhor Jesus/god's system of utter and complete savagery. So who is more bigoted, btthegreat, me or Jesus? I don't think you can answer that question with a "FS" or a "Jesus", but at least I can ask you the question.

 

Good one! Boy do I feel stupid - just like I felt when I realized that I'd fallen for the ultimate con-job of all time (Jesus' con has the most followers of any con ever.) You apparently never fell for the con (if I recall from your previous posts?), so you are smarter than I am. Jesus has taken more people away from reality than any human being in world history. THAT will be his legacy.

 

"common sense' is not todays lesson plan. Today, I am working on getting you to understand, even from reverse your own tactics, that a failure on your part to respond in my favorite way, does not allow me to 'logically' conclude squat about either the quality of your argument or your views. All I get to conclude is that you did not provide what I wanted ( you didn't), not that it does not exist ( it may well not though), or that I know why you didn't.

 

Sadly, I am indeed without religious foundation. I say sadly, because I feel as though I don't have a good grasp of what it feels like to have an invisible jewish sky magician hovering over my shoulder - reading my mind and watching me go pee-pee.

 

Jesus, is that you!?

 

Has this turned into an Islam-Christianity-Judaism pissing contest?

 

He's also watching us when we "do the nasty". That's why people scream out his name when they.......

 

A Modern Secular Humanism vs. religion pissing contest? Well, kinda.
Religion doesn't believe in "common sense", so religion loses these debates on a regular basis.
For example, try to ask religious people to condemn the approval of killing gays (yes, KILLING innocent people) in the Bible, and the religious people fail morally because they can't do that. We. Are. Winning. Morality is winning.

 

See, now that's something no Christian has ever been able to explain to me - and believe me, I've asked!

What do they think JC/Yaz does when they get jiggy? Do they think he like, goes to another room and waits til they've finished? Seriously, I would love to know how it works.

 

Just think in your mind what it was like to use science, reason, and critical thinking when you were FIVE years old....that's pretty much the same thing as making many decisions as a religious person. Believe not in science, but rather in magic and superstition. Believe that two places that are as provable as Neverland are actually real ("heaven/hell"), and base most of your actions in life on that premise. THAT'S what it's like.

 

Maybe god saw Joseph getting busy, was jealous, and so decided to get in on the action with Mary himself.
There is one person in history, who is not only watching people get jiggy, but "watching over them and protecting them" (allegedly) who is so all-powerful and all-loving that if he was actually real could clear this all up for us! But, sadly, he's not real, so in 2000 years he still doesn't care enough about us to snap his all-powerful fingers and do that in a nano-second. *Sigh*

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Yes, I think he goes back to producing "acts of god", like deadly tornadoes and deadly tsunamis, etc.

PS It is indeed possible to love Christians, but despise their evil invisible friend in the sky.

 

But if both parties just happen to have the same genitalia, then look out(!), because he has a "naughty/nice" book just like the equally-provable god that lives in the North Pole does, and he'll punish them for.....love. Only an insane invisible friend would punish two consenting adults for.....love. Are you listening, god/Jesus/Allah? [What the heck am I thinking - of course they aren't.]

 

I didn't experience anything like that in childhood. Even though I'm old enough to have been subjected to 'scripture' at my public school - it just sounded like boring fairy tales to me. REALLY boring, because there weren't any dragons or spaceships. It was all dull bearded men wearing dresses, and some nonsense about a giant boat. Seriously, that's exactly how it struck me.

Meantime, I have an elderly relative-by-marriage who once said to one of my kids "god must be real, because how could man have made the stars?". My kid was stunned into silence by the depth of stupidity/nuttiness behind her observation, and I don't think he's been able to regard her with anything but the compassion we have for the mentally ill since. He genuinely feels bad for her, which is nice. He didn't even try to explain what stars were, and how they formed etc. He figured rightly that her brain had probably seized into it's permanent setting many decades earlier. Probably in Sunday School.

 

I don't have the BALLS to ask friends intimate questions about what they say during sex, but I'm glad that you do! Compared to you I must seem even more repressed than "The Church Lady": http://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/church-chat/n9682

My favorite line: "with little Jimmie out of the pulpit!"

 

The one school that has removed more children from science/reality than any other school. So obviously one of the most damaging schools of all time.

 

It's very interesting, no?

When I've asked Christians about this (the 24/7 watching thing), they invariably reply that they 'don't think about it', or that it's 'silly to think about Jesus watching us do private stuff'. What this tells me is that they've wired themselves to avoid thinking through the implications of a super-powered invisible being whom they assert watches us 24/7. And if they can deliberately and permanently avoid thinking through the implications on something as trivial as this - what must they be doing with the really big and really ugly stuff? We know the answer to that question of course - but it's still fascinating to watch.

The problem is that the version of Christianity taught to children has no explanatory power whatsoever. It's merely repetition of an old story, and some bland platitudes about being nice (with the implicit threat 'so you don't go to hell). All the yuck is either brushed over in cheery tones (as though it's perfectly reasonable to kill every living thing on the planet in anger), or omitted altogether. If the recipient of this information never progresses beyond the 8 year olds version of Christian theology, then it's easy to see how they're able to avoid confronting the implications of their dogma. And I do think many adult Christians ARE only theologically at 8 year old level - despite the fact that they attend church regularly etc. It's essentially "me" stuff, so they're just feeding themselves regular platitudes about having done the right thing and made all the right noises, and leave it at that. Job done - immortality assured, hell averted. So why risk that by asking difficult questions?

 

Actually I've asked them what they think Jesus is doing when they go pee-pee (and let them think that through to jiggy as they see fit - which I'm guessing they made every effort to avoid doing).

Edited to say .... I didn't think you had balls anyway

 

got 'unavailable' on that vid link!

 

Let's see there is the Secular Humanist Council, the Atheist Alliance, The International Ethical Humanist Union, The European Humanist Federation, The International League of Humanists, The International League of Non-religious and Atheists, Rationalists International all global in scope. Then there is The American Secular Union, the American Atheists, The American Humanist Association, the Center for Inquiry, Freedom from Religion Foundation, The institute for humanist Studies etc. And you are stuck with a "I feel certain.." statement with respect to a percentage of secular humanists or atheists who support or oppose terror rather than quoting scientific polling data on the question. Is this because the irreligious groups mentioned above are too indifferent and callous to care whether terrorists have a lot of hearts and minds in their membership? Is it because they are afraid to poll on the question, lest the world find out about a philosophical soft spot for terrorist tactics? Or maybe they have polled and are burying the results

So Freedomseeker, please respond and justify why you cannot find scientific polling data among atheist and humanists refuting and condemning the killing of innocent people. Which reason above do you suppose best explains why no one will provide you with answers?

if you do not post accurate scientific polling, or choose from the above reasons why you can't, it must be that you are part of the problem, that these groups do not want the world to know about. Instead maybe it would be better for you to condemn the total indifference of secular humanists and atheists to the potential terror apologists within, and thereby gain some credibility where others have none. I am sure you will do the right thing, now that you see these groups for what they really are!