I have been reading Steve Cannanes book about Scientology in Australia and am gobsmacked. Slavery,abduction,brain washing and forced abortions So, my question is When is a religion not a religion? Where is the line between cult and church? How should governments intervene if at all?
I don’t see it matters whether something is a religion, a cult, a church or none of those things. If they’re doing something seriously wrong, it should be acted on in the same manner.
I'm with HonestJoe. There are lots of issues like slavery and abduction, but there is no reason to take the mental sidetrack through whether they count as religions. There will be situations when a person's religious freedom is pitted against someone else's freedoms in one way or another. These situations will have to be resolved individually, but in the examples you give, one's freedom not to be enslaved is greater, and known to be greater.
I think a religion is always a religion, but some are worse than others, and it doesn't always have to involve a god. I think a powerful belief in something that just isn't so, despite all evidence to the contrary, could also be a religion. I think when a group of people hold a belief that is so out of touch with reality, that it prevents them from peacefully co-existing with people that do not share the same belief, because it causes the illusion to waver, then that belief is essentially a religion. I think the line between cult and church is just a matter of numbers. I think the government should stay out of religious affairs as much as possible. But if the people of a religion make themselves known to people outside of their religion by demanding that others change their opinions, speech, or actions, then the government needs to bring the hammer down.
When the practice of religion breached that boundary called law of the land then the government could intervene. As long as it's healthy, non coercive, and prolife, I don't mind at all.
Good question. I'd say there's definitely not a solid line separating them. In fact, religions tend to start out as cults, which are smaller and usually centered around certain cult leaders (or really, one cult leader). A cult which grows in popularity may become a recognised religion, but even a cult that is not really large or officially recognised is also a religion, at least if it is of a religious nature, and Scientology would seem to qualify because it deals in the same sorts of things that religions do - beliefs about the nature of humanity and the universe, about life and death. It has all of the trappings of religion, at least, and of a cult. What sets it apart is its oddball set of "teachings" and practices, which are not traditional to religion, but rather resemble science fiction. It's a "church" based in science fiction rather than the usual spirituality and theology, and by science fiction I mean it involves fictitious technologies and space aliens - - - Updated - - - Is that so? I think we need to be careful about how we define these things.
True but some seem more harmful than others. As I said I have been reading Steve Cannanes book and I as horrified at stories of deprivation of liberty and forced abortions and then remembered all the damage that has been done by paedophile priests I do think that like a lot of big companies that supply social needs there should be an outside agency to hear complaints and act on them. Sort of like an Ombudsman
Given some of the weird (*)(*)(*)(*) in the Old Testament I really do not see a lot of difference between science fiction and many religions
Nobody really cares what an Infidel opines about anything, I have doubts about most anything you say.
Ah, well, there I'd just comment that back then, there was not much if any separation between fact and fiction in the tales people would tell about what they claimed was history and other realities, and also that angels and golems and other strange beings were the precursors of science fiction's aliens and UFOs. So yes, you're definitely on to something there. Same time, though, I think science fiction today is characterised by certain things that do not turn up in such ancient stories as what's in the OT, where magic and spirits and deities dominate.
Sounds like the way a lot of historical churches acted like the Roman Catholic Church and all use brain washing tactics on innocent children called indoctrination so I agree ban them all from any such activities but not pick on one or two.
religion is basically just a prestigious title that grants legitimacy. scientology says its a religion, other religions do not agree, because they do not want to be associated with sceintology, or give scientologists the prestige of being associated with them, the "real" religions. Cults are what other religions call their small start-up competitors as a means to discredit them.
there is no line, that said, Scientology imo is just a myth even Christians can belong to a cult... so it's not the religion that decides it, its the group of religious people and their actions .
I'll give an answer: It's not a religion when it abandons the interior life of the inward search of the inner man and starts worrying about, trying to change, trying to influence something . . . anything . . . outside self and in the world. Sages say our religion (spiritual life) should be "secret, silent, and sacred". Trying to change others is not spiritual. Trying to persuade others of your beliefs is no spiritual. Objecting to the wishes of others who act out those wishes around you is not spiritual. (Objecting to baking a cake for someone whose lifestyle you don't follow is an example.) Working for government to be more Bible-compliant is not spiritual. These and more take you out of spirituality and cause you to descend into that which is worldly.
A religion is a unique set of beliefs and behavior which reflect it. If a set of beliefs is based on some other religion, it never changes the original, but grows from it. It becomes a religion. If it changes the source and then follows the redacted version of the original, it is called a cult. For example, Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses and Islam are based on Judeo-Christian teachings, yet they changed them and came up with their own views. These are Judeo-Christian cults. Once you have a religion a questions is what deity that religion follows? Is it God, god, demons, saints, departed spirits of important people or even departed parents? And the behavior or tradition that is associated with their set of beliefs defines the morality of the religion. Does this make sense? Thanks, Ed
To further the original question. When does a religion get demoted to being nothing more than mythology?
Is there a specific religion in which you are describing? Christianity for example, and of course anybody would say this about their religion but, Christianity is truth or just the way it is. I realize there are areas in the Bible in which people think is disgusting. In particular where God tells His followers: 3Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass. For what He told them to do to Amalek, Amalek also done to Israel. If any nation or kingdom wants war with God, that is what they will get! Goes without saying, any nation or kingdom wants war with America, that is what they will get.
A religion is not a religion when belief is not a prerequisite. Any philosophy that includes belief is a religion, IMO. For instance, AGW is a religion because it includes belief in what COULD happen in the future.
You would have to define what a religion is before you could define what a religion is not. I suspect they overlap and are not necessarily different things. That's a difficult question, at least in the USA. If the behavior and actions of members harm others then intervention may be appropriate, or perhaps not appropriate. If the behavior and actions of members violate the criminal laws then intervention is warranted.
Each religion (including Greek mythology) has at least some truth in it, since it is based on spiritual worlds we do not see. If you do not believe in spiritual world at all then what you ask has no answer.
When its an ideology..like Islam...but youd know my thoughts on that wouldnt you. Scientology is not a religion. Scientology is a cult. A cult is a body that does not believe in God. A sect is a body who believes in God For example Jehovahs Witnesses are a puritan sect that relies on the preaching of fear and guilt to purify their members. And so on and so on.... Supremacism is the worldview that a particular age, race, species, ethnicity, religion, gender, social class, ideology, nation, or culture is superior to other variations of that trait, and advocates those who identify with it to dominate, control, and subjugate those who do not. Similar to apartheid...I could say (Islam, that is...)
