A very simple and easy to understand explanation of why climate change is REAL.

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by SuperfluousNinja, May 4, 2017.

  1. Robert

    Robert Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    is.
    I had a pretty good idea you were not serious about this.
     
  2. jgoins

    jgoins Well-Known Member

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    Ok enough of the bull. How long at this rate will it take before the world is uninhabitable? Put a realistic estimate to it.
     
  3. spiritgide

    spiritgide Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    First- climate change has been with us historically for millions of years. The question you want to push is that the change of today is potentially catastrophic and man made- and assumes that if we change out ways, it will stop changing. Global warming is what has caused the receding of the glaciers that used to cover much of North America- and not just once. So I would ask- what caused those global warmings? And, what caused the global coolings that preceded them?

    While carbon monoxide is a "greenhouse gas"- people produce it too. Perhaps the solution is fewer people or less breathing? Methane is a more potent greenhouse gas, and it is produced by cattle and other animals, particularly large grazing species. Thus- the millions of buffalo and other herd animals that used to roam this country probably produced as much as our cattle do today. We have just discovered that trees exude methane gas from the trunk areas, and we have billions of them. Seems like everywhere we look something is producing something that somebody will declare is the cause of a change which seems to have happened hundreds of times before we ever came into existence, and call it an emergency that we created.

    The climate is changing, that is not in question as it is historically proven to be a continuing process in nature- and we don't really know the pace of change that may occur naturally in the short term, as geologically it is hard to define such things relative to time with a precision of less than 10,000 years or so.
    The question of human responsibility to the degree that we could control the change is in great question.
     
  4. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    So you admit it's happening but you want exactitude before we respond.

    If I see someone about to throw a hand grenade into my house...I'm not going to wait until I know exactly how much damage that will cause before I try to stop him.

    I guess that's the difference between us
     
  5. jgoins

    jgoins Well-Known Member

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    No I don't admit it is happening, I just want to know what the projected rate of decay the so called scientists predict if nothing changes.
     
  6. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Perhaps interesting, but that's not the concern.

    The real issues have to do with national security, global conflict, food security, etc. for the population of today as well as the growth that will take place.

    We can't afford more Syrias - even with tiny inconsequential states such as Syria.
     
  7. ChristopherABrown

    ChristopherABrown Well-Known Member

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    Certainly the above is true. But exactly how much it drives the current climate change is something that can legitamately be questioned.

    This story has many counterparts from ordinary people making ordinary observations about shadows etc. and where the sun used to shine or not shine.

    http://www.thebigwobble.org/2016/06/we-are-all-obsessed-with-weather-here.html

    The 2012 and Mayan calendar issue was real, but not understood. It was never intended to be the "end of the world". It was originally the "end of time" keeping, because all time was kept directly from the suns positions. When the planet shifts on its axis, a society who keeps time with the sun must wait until it re stabilizes and then start a new calendar.

    Of course carbon is responsible for ocean acidification. No doubt of that, so it must be massively reduced. I can see only one way for that to happen and that is for American state Citizens to use law to control their state legislations who can then use states powers with Article V to restore constitutional government. Through "Preparatory Amendment" for Article V, a right retained but not listed, not to be denied or disparaged, the PURPOSE of free speech can be restored.

    Through the restoration of the PURPOSE of free speech, democracy can be restored in its function of upholding the principles of the republic. Also, Americans can begin to discuss and agree upon sustainable methods which can then be shared with the world in the abandonment of petroleum as a main energy source and carbon creator.

    Here is the legal process that implements our unity upon agreement of the most prime right. The right that protects all other rights.

    http://algoxy.com/law/lawfulpeacefulrevolution.html
     
  8. Maccabee

    Maccabee Well-Known Member

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    Hardly anyone debates that global warming exists. What people do argue is whether or not it's manmade.
     
  9. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    Even THAT argument has been answered...
     
  10. Maccabee

    Maccabee Well-Known Member

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    Yeah. We aren't the main contributor.
     
  11. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    We ARE the reason it is increasing at it's current rapid rate ...
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2017
  12. Maccabee

    Maccabee Well-Known Member

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    Evidence?
     
    Bear513 likes this.
  13. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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  14. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    Define climate without resorting to any meteorological data.
     
  15. AboveAlpha

    AboveAlpha Well-Known Member

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    Weather is specific to either the existence of storms, low and high pressure systems or the lack of them.

    Climate is the overall atmospheric conditions of various areas or average conditions of multiple or all areas of the Earth.

    AA
     
  16. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    The point would be that every climatic zone is defined by average temperature, and average rainfall. In other words meteorology defines a climate zone. In fact, Koeppen-Geiger was originally based on similar plant forms found in similar areas.
     
  17. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    But, that didn't counter what was said in the thread you responded to.
     
  18. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    The point sir is that Climate is weather over time in a specific area. Further the notion that we have done much more than scratch the surface let alone are able to make long range projections about weather or climate at our current level of knowledge is at best ludicrous. Please note no one who has experienced the worst of Oklahoma winters and summers believes climate is anything like fixed. Climate is in a constant state of flux. How all the various feed back loops work together is largely unknown. To single out one single item in an amazingly complex system and blame it for a very small increase in temperature is absurd on it's face.
     
  19. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    It isn't rapid it's barely even noticeable.
     
  20. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    It's noticeable. You just refuse to notice
     
  21. Tim15856

    Tim15856 Well-Known Member

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    Why don't you do your part and stop breathing out all that harmful CO2?
     
  22. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    So let's unpack that.

    You're either wishing for a poster's death (a violation of board rules) or you solution to a problem that will impact mankind is to have mankind leave the planet?

    Which is it?
     
  23. Tim15856

    Tim15856 Well-Known Member

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    Having most of mankind leave the planet is what the left would like to happen. So often I find that once they have theirs, they want to stop others from joining in.
     
  24. drluggit

    drluggit Well-Known Member

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    First, you have to prove what additional change occurs because of the additional output. We'll wait.....
     
  25. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Yes, climate is an average of weather over a far longer period of time and wider area. Climate is more interested in 5 or 10 year averages, while weather can be focused on tomorrow. Those longer term averages don't change as much as weather does. Think of flippjng a coin 5 times vs 500 times - one can make stronger statements of certain kinds about the results of 500 flips.

    Likewise, there can be important things to say about OK that become visible when focusing on longer term trends.

    I do not see a basis for your suggestions that climate is too complex to allow progress in understanding.
     

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