Gina Haspel, C.I.A. Deputy Director, Had Leading Role in Torture

No I provided a link by someone who had been waterboarded as I said. For god's sake how you describe it all you need to do is give them a flannel and some warm water and let them do it themselves.

As terrorism - ooops freudian slip! as torture including waterboarding brings poor results and as waterboarding is just having a wash, allow them to take care of their own personal hygiene and allow those who have the skills and expertise to get information to work without torture with any who may have sensitive information. Problem solved and the US's reputation improved.

 

No, the US Constitution does not apply universally, silly.

 

If you were referring to Mancow, I don't really give his opinion much credence.

To characterize what he experienced in 6 seconds as torture demonstrates the absurdity of your position and what a pansy Mancow is.

 

No it wasn't him. I left a link further back and I have also left a link more than once about what experts say about it.

The only reason the US is engaging in any torture is because it wants to hurt people. I have already left a link for that twice as well.

https://www.theguardian.com/law/2017/jan/26/does-torture-work-and-is-it-worth-the-cost-donald-trump

Clearly people who support torture whose only use is to inflict pain and suffering are people who do not believe in the rule of law. Punishment in any society actually I hate to say it but even ISIS results in a trial before punishment. People who advocate torture are advocating punishment without trial.

 

So you weren't there and therefore you have no clue. The torture tapes were destroyed.

If that were true international treaties, which are part of the Constitution via the Supremacy Clause, would have no meaning. Furthermore there's nothing in the Bill of Rights that restricts it to Americans. The Constitution applies to all within the jurisdiction of the US government. Insisting that it doesn't apply universally without providing any support for your false claim and calling me silly are not valid arguments.

 

Water boarding was effective. It is not torture and there is no pain although it is very uncomfortable. It’s now illegal so the discussion is moot.

 

Experts who have never been waterboarded. Like I said. And I still haven't found this link of yours on someone who was waterboarded

 

Yes, I only have the regulations they were required to follow to support my assertions, while you have what you have imagined to have occurred. I think US regulations Trump your imagination.

 

You have no standing to contradict experts and no evidence for your claim. Regardless, common sense dictates that any "confession" acquired from any form of TORTURE, which includes waterboarding is unreliable and worthless because anyone, including YOU, would confess to any crime suggested by torturers in order to make them stop. The evidence is in the claims of those who have been tortured, as also claimed by the Senate Intelligence Committee report on torture (derisively called "enhanced interrogation").

Then you are contradicting yourself. Any severe discomfort deliberately perpetrated on another is TORTURE.

It is illegal and always was but the discussion is about Gina Haspel, who was fully responsible for the CIA tortures, which are crimes against the Constitution and considered war crimes by all international treaties that mention war crimes. So the discussion is fully appropriate.

 

So you have nothing by your own admission. The CIA was also REQUIRED by the courts to hand over the torture tapes. So much for "regulations".

My "imagination" has nothing to do with your claim. YOU made the claim, the burden of proof is on YOU. I made no claims at all other than put your feet to the fire to prove YOUR claim. Spewing "regulations" does not support your claim that any of these were actually followed.

 

Only testimony from those actually involved in the investigation. They were looking for information to save lives and not concerned about confessions.

Water boarding was completely legal before it was banned. I’ve personally experienced due to EIAH the feeling of drowning similar to water boarding. It is not painful but extremely uncomfortable.

 

It is. Some civilised countries still have the death penalty, but you're the only one with torture.

 

Yeah - I waterboard my kids myself when they did something bad. Or I eletrocute them - it leaves no traces, so it isn't torture, right? Right. I really wished stupid people kept their opinion for themselves and the couch they lived on.

No need to go as far as in the next Muslim community to see a society that's on the verge of self-destruction - there's one right at your place.

 

What torture is that ?? Are Russia, China, Iran, Turkey, Syria .... civilized countries ??

 

I don't know what testimony or what investigation in particular you're referring to but the Senate Intelligence Committee conducted an investigation and concluded the opposite. They found that the CIA's torture program detailed brutality and dishonesty and yielded no reliable intelligence or save lives. As such the testimony of those involved was dishonest and worthless.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...5a187e4c1f7_story.html?utm_term=.87d5c063bbc1

It was never "legal". There is no federal law that made torture legal and such a law (if it ever existed) would violate the Constitution and be void from inception.

Your alleged personal experience has nothing to do with what happened at Gitmo and is irrelevant.

 

Well, I guess you couldn't say that 25 years ago, but yeah - Besides you, they look civilised indeed.

IMO, you just don't appreciate how much of a weird mess your country is since the end of the Cold War. It's practically civil war at your place. When was the last school shooting?

 

That's the BS report that came out of Diane Feinstein.

It was absolutely legal. Do your homework instead of operating in some theoretical universe.

My personal experience is the same as waterboarding.

 

You actually believe that Russia, China, Iran, Turkey, and Syria do not torture and do permanent damage to people ?? That is bizarre.

 

Everything Hitler ever did was legal.

 

When was the last school shooting in the ole US of A, civilised nation?

You are deluded. What you wrote here you likely stay, my friend. Will you be proud to show your grandchildren how ol' pa supported torture?

How did you got there, how did you got lost, with no moral compass whatsoever?

 

What does this have to do with actual torture when people are seriously harmed or killed ??

 

Ah, yes ... the old and tired Hitler argument. Try and actually think it through instead of using a bumper sticker.

 

You might want to renew (or find out) your definition of torture. I'll waterboard you 83 times in a month, deprive you from sleeping, put you in a small box and slap your head over a wall until you lose an eye - my guess is that you will come out of it quite different than when you entered.

What's next, defending pedophilia? Rape, mutilation, maybe? Civilized my arse.

 

His audience wasn't paranoid, in those days they were merely sick of the lies told by Dick & Dubya. #MeToo

 

You can't see the forest for the trees. The point is that "being legal" or not is weasely form of argument, and in no way a substitute for morality.

Laws are the creation of men, interested men, and are convienently made so. Laws are a substitute for justice.