Russian Collusion between Obama and Putin

Why was there not a Special Counsel investigation launched into the Obama administration after the Crimea annexation by Russia in 2014? Before Obama won his second term, Obama pledged "more flexibility" to then-Russian President Dmitri Medvedev.

Obama said, “This is my last election . . .. After my election I have more flexibility."

To which Medvedev replied, "“I will transmit this information to Vladimir."



In March 2014 Crimea was annexed by Russia during the presidency of Obama.

Now this is more empircal proof of collusion between Russia and an American president than anything that has come out of the Mueller investigation against the Trump campaign's alleged ties with Russia, yet there was no Special Counsel investigation launched then. There were no people, like Bill Maher, saying that Obama engaged in "treason" as they say about Trump? Why? Is it pure partisanship, delusion, or downright stupidity?

 

"Russia, if you’re listening, I hope you’re able to find the 30,000 emails that are missing, I think you will probably be rewarded mightily by our press,”....

 

What is downright stupidity is the idea that Russia's asked for, or needed permission from a US President prior to annexing Crimea.

 

Ok.

Well, help me understand. Why didn't Russia annex Crimea before? Why during March 2014?

Would they have done the same under Trump? I don't think so.

In fact, according to Daniel Vajdich, senior fellow at the Atlantic Council, quoted in an NPR article, "When you actually look at the substance of what this administration has done, not the rhetoric but the substance, this administration has been much tougher on Russia than any in the post-Cold War era." (https://www.npr.org/2018/07/20/630659379/is-trump-the-toughest-ever-on-russia)

That piece goes on to say that "Trump sought to add $1.4 billion for fiscal year 2018 to the European Deterrence Initiative — a military effort to deter Russian aggression that was initially known as the European Reassurance Initiative. That's a 41 percent increase from the last year of the Obama administration. The president also agreed to send lethal weapons to Ukraine — a step that Obama resisted. And Trump gave U.S. forces in Syria more leeway to engage with Russian troops."

So, according to the facts, Trump has been much tougher on Russia than every post-Cold War president. That means Trump is tougher on Russia than George H.W. Bush. That means Trump is tougher on Russia than Clinton. That means Trump is tougher on Russia than George W. Bush. That means Trump is tougher on Russia than Obama. Not only does this put cold water on this silly notion that Trump is a Russian puppet or a Manchurian candidate, it means that Russia probably would not have done the same under a Trump presidency. Trump probably would have sent lethal weapons to Crimea like he has done to Ukraine to prevent annexation.

Yes, Russia has nuclear weapons, but given the "Fire and Fury" rhetoric from Trump against North Korea and the continuing sanctions, I don't think he is really deterred by that fact.

 

Please, don't make red herrings.

Why was there not a Special Counsel investigation launched into the Obama administration after the Crimea annexation by Russia in 2014?

 

I am not sure why we are talking about Trump in a conversation about whether or not Obama gave Russia permission to annex Crimea ?

The reason why Russia annexed Crimea is not some secret. Putin drew a big red line - and NATO crossed it.

Ever since WW2 - every time Russia has taken a step back - NATO has gone in an built a base. This has been especially true since the fall of the wall. Despite these actions - which violated both the spirit and the letter of various agreements - the Bear did not react (Georgia being one exception).

Crimea is a major Russian Strategic interest. They have held that port for 400 years. Russia is simply not going to allow that port to become a NATO port... FULL STOP - end of discussion.

After major meddling - by the US and NATO allies - in the Ukraine election, a Pro Western Leader was elected. Shortly after - Ukraine was being considered for NATO membership. Russia made no secret of its objection to this and drew a clear red line. Every Leader of NATO knew - especially via back channels- that Putin would not tolerate this - and primarily - having the port in Crimea fall into NATO hands. It simply was not going to happen.

YET - NATO pressed on - kept poking the Bear - despite numerous warnings to "Stop poking the Bear".

When the Bear reacted - All the NATO clowns leaders then stood around feigning ignorance. "Why did Putin do this" ??

The same think with missile defense. In 2002 Bush pulled out of the ABM (anti ballistic missile treaty) - This point of which - based on the MAD doctrine - was to prevent some buckaroo from thinking "we will launch our nukes and when they fire back we will shoot them down".

Putin's response was "This is a mistake". Then in 2007 Bush announced his plan to put ABM's on Russia's border in Poland and Czech.

It is one thing to pull out of the ABM treaty - quite another to put ABM's on Russia's border. This is a total provocation. Can you imagine the childbirth like screams - that would be heard round the world - from the Pentagon would Russia to put ABM's on US borders. Are you friggen kidding me.

This action destabilized nuclear detente' which forced Russia to take counter measures .. And that is exactly what they did - and announced what they were doing publicly.

There are various ways to counter ABM's. An obvious way (which was actually considered - in public) was nukes in space. Currently it takes roughly 30 min for a nuke to travel from Russia to the US. Not sure about you but - it would not make me sleep better at night knowing a nuke was above my head in space - 30 seconds away. Talk about a "hair trigger" situation ?!.

Russia did not do this - Thank God for small miracles. What Russia did was to ramp up their sub program and to violate the short and intermediate range treaty by building nuclear cruise missiles. The point of these cruise missiles would then be to take out the ABM's prior to launch.

Obama then goes on TV feigning ignorance "Russia has violated the short and intermediate range treaty".... the MSM arm of the Establishment propaganda machine then showed videos of Reagan and the Historic signing of nuclear arms limitation treaties.

What Obama - and of course the clown show media - fails to mention was - "While it is true that Russia has violated the treaty - we were the one's that forced Russia to do this".

The idea that Russia needs US permission to annex Crimea or build nuclear cruise missiles is preposterous nonsense. Russia does not go out of its way to piss the US off but, in the above cases it was the US that forced Russia to do what it did.

The idea that Russia would need permission seems to assume that they can not annihilate the US at will. That the US is somehow in a position of strength in this respect. This is complete nonsense. Neither nation is in a position of strength over the other. That was - and still is - the whole point of MAD.

It was not Obama that went away from this doctrine - and assuming that Obama could singlehandedly do this is a stretch to begin with - this happened under Reagan. Immediately after the signing of the historic agreements under the MAD doctrine. The Military Industrial Complex went into a frenzy - Peace is not good for those who make profit (in the case of the Establishment international financiers and national Oligarchs) or good for building pyramids in the case of the Establishment bureaucratic and political elite.

Obama was an Establishment insider. They turned him to the dark side very early on. That said - Obama did put a hold on installation of ABMs "missile defense" on Russia's border. One needs to remember that the Establishment is not some "Cabal" or "Star Chamber". There are numerous competing interests who disagree and conflict on many things.

The key to understanding the Establishment is not in understanding where there is disagreement but - on where there is agreement.

These people are not insane - (at least not all of them). Ramping up the nuclear arms race is not some joke and there are factions that take this issue seriously. Serious enough to caution against "Poking the Bear" with respect to nuclear war.

Unfortunately - the war hawks seem to be winning. We are now engaged in a new arms race.

 

It's a shame nobody has found them.....in reality though...I'm willing to bet a silver dollar McCabe and Company has seen them and made sure they never saw the light of day.

 

To the OP: there was none then and none now in terms of evidence.

 

Did you want Obama to attack Russia?

He sanctioned Russia for the invasion. Tell me, what more would you have him do?

 

The Uranium One deal took place while Russian crime in the US was running rampant under Mueller.

Obama allowed the Koch-Glitsch pipeline company to sell pipeline transfer equipment to Putin bound for the Crimea while there were sanctions in place.

Obama quickly shut down two Russian compounds in the DC area with Russia saying nothing about it. Shortwave radio equipment removed.

Nellie Ohr has a shortwave radio license on file: http://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/LicArchive/license.jsp?archive=Y&licKey=12382876 (Check the dates in regard to the dossier and FBI counter intelligence fabrication)

 

Uranium One was a Canadian company selling its mining interests in the USA.

If the USA ever thinks there is or will be a problem, the interests will be seized and the product reserved for the USA.

 

US uranium has already been leaked out of the country under this deal. Failure of Obama to make sure it didn't happen.

Hillary Clinton's foundation rec'd 145 million dollars in kickbacks funneled through Canada... You are right Starkey, the Canada extension was used to hide the money flow and for money laundering.

 

Obama and Clinton “reset” relations with Putin after Bush ran them out of Georgia. He was “more flexible” giving then the Ukraine, and inviting them into Syria. It’s clear who was really Putin’s puppet

 

Obama got justifiably raked over the coals for that remark, but saying that you will have more flexibility since you are no longer going to have to run for reelection is worlds apart from agreeing to secret meetings with the hopes of receiving hacked emails and other (illegal) election support. I understand what the possible crimes are when it comes to the Trump campaign. What law was broken here? If there was one broken, and there may well be I have no idea, then yeah, he deserves to get investigated for it.

 

Koch quickly finished installing their needed gas transfer equipment in the Crimea right before Trump took office. https://www.rt.com/business/371937-putin-crimea-gas-russia/

http://www.koch-glitsch.com/contact/pages/Russia-CIS.aspx

The interesting aspect of the pipeline has to do with the fact that it was built to be able to transfer gas in either direction. Hint: Vast gas reserves under the Black Sea near the Crimean peninsula.

Again, Obama let this happen in spite of his words of imposing strict sanctions.

 

The Trump-Koch-Manafort-Putin cabal.

 

Uranium One was a Canadian company selling its mining interests in the USA.

If the USA ever thinks there is or will be a problem, the interests will be seized and the product reserved for the USA.

Your 'leaked' means legal mining and transfer of product. There were no kickbacks to anyone. There was no hidden money flow, or you conspiracy folks could not come up with this nuttiness.

 

As I pointed out, the pipeline was finished before Trump took office.

1. It was started well before Trump decided to run for office.
2. Obama allowed Koch to proceed while sanctions were in place.
3. The Uranium One deal was sealed by Mueller delivering samples to Moscow.

<Off-topic>

Mueller is so very conflicted.

https://www.thenewamerican.com/usne...livering-uranium-to-russians-raises-questions

The part I like the best:

“The text and tweet released by WikiLeaks more than suggests Mueller is guilty of a serious crime, passing on nuclear material to the USA’s superpower rival."

 

This is what the issue is about today. We aren't too concerned about what happened four years ago. Trump's fans will do anything to distract from the real issues.

Political reports, "A bipartisan attempt to condemn the Trump administration for relaxing Russia sanctions stalled in the Senate Wednesday after Republicans banded together to block the effort.

"The bill would have formally rebuked the administration before it moves ahead with plans to lift sanctions on companies linked to oligarch Oleg Deripaska, a close ally of Russian President Vladimir Putin.

"The bill needed 60 votes to advance to passage but fell three votes short this afternoon.

"Eleven Senate Republicans joined Democrats in supporting the measure. They weren’t convinced by Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin’s argument that the sanctions should be lifted because the Russian firms had reorganized and had severed Deripaska's control."

Senate Republicans continue to be Trump lackeys, even when it is a bold attempt by Trump to provide protection for Putin.

Is there any doubt we have a President who prefers policies that are beneficial to the communist Russian dictator?

 

The Wikileaks release suggests nothing of the sort. Trump was lured into the plot later by Manafort, who had been working on it for some time. Obama was not aware of the Koch subterfuge. Uranium One was a Canadian company selling its mining operations in the USA; it was Canadian property. Mueller was in no way involved.

Once we are past the report being released, then the secondary DA and AG actions federally and the states will begin a huge operation in sweeping up all of those who were accessory to and after the facts. Those aiding Manafort, Stone, Gates, Trump, Kushner, and so on and so forth, will be convicted and have to pay fines intentioned to break them financially, from the least to the highest.

 

Everyone knows democrats are allowed to sellout America

 

That was pretty good humor that sailed right over the Trump haters. Trump was joking about the felony committed by Hillary when she "lost" subpoenaed emails.

 

You need to take red herring 101.

This attempt is just plain silly.

Putin hated both Clintons with a deep and abiding hate. One of the key reasons is that Putin believed he had an agreement that NATO wouldn't expand toward the east. From the Russian point of view, eastern Europe rightfully belonged as part of the Russian sphere - if not actually being part of Russia.

During the Clinton and Obama presidencies progress was made to increase military strength in eastern Europe and to include former Soviet bloc countries in NATO.

It's just plain nutty to suggest an Obama/Clinton (as DoS) agreement with Russia to let Russia have ANYTHING.

 

The Uranium one Scandal got way overblown. While there is merit to the financial stuff with respect to the Clinton foundation - the idea that this was some kind of national security issue is complete nonsense.

The world is oversupplied right now with respect to Uranium. No one cares about some small Uranium mining interests in Canada on the basis of a military interest. I was in Uranium stocks for a bit thinking that production would come online a little faster than it did after Fukashima. Cameco is the largest Uranium company in Canada - and one of the biggest in the world. They shut down production in one of their mines to try and decrease supply and increase the Uranium price.

Kazakhstan is the largest producer of Uranium. Russia can get all it wants from there.

 

The American bots of Russia try to point to Obama and Clinton in order to detract the logical examination of Putin and Trump's relationship.