What's going on with Brexit?

It seams that quiet a few folks in the UK do not understand, that the UK is just an other small European country, to small to stand alone, like France, Germany, Greece, Italy or Spain.
Its not any more the British Empire.
What they will find out, once they try to get a trade deal with the US ( for example ), they will get bullied and pushed around and if Big Brother across the pond decides, after few years, the deal is not good enough, than they get NAFTAed.

 

I can think of one bloc of nations in the 1980's that fell.

Let's say Ireland gets a better deal from the rest of the EU, or gateway countries between UK and Europe get a better deal than the whole of the EU, that would be fair; However, the EU acting as a bloc won't allow for preferential treatment of certain countries when dealing with the UK.

There's fairness and then there's equality; treating Ireland like Albania or Romania, making them equal isn't fair. So the EU is acting like the Soviets now, putting equality over fairness.

The EU doesn't even do fair trade, it does free trade.

Fairness and the EU aren't things that go hand in hand.

 

The ignorance about the EEC/EU is not a surprise. They fell for their governments propaganda and what it never wanted to tell the folks. They were just in for economic opportunity, but not for Europa.
Now they are paying the price for it, because one of their most stupid PMs ever played with fire, to stop the opposition in his own party and the people went along with it.
Ignorant and with out asking for a plan to vote on.
Sadly they are still ignorant about the EU and its workings, because it is so easy and needs no effort to follow propaganda blindly.
Just have a few bad guys to point the finger at, like Junkers, or Germany ( the evil Empire behind all of it ).

No reflection on their own short comings.

Now their domestic servant will be back, begging for 3 month, humiliated by the kindergarten they call parliament.

It seams self-destruction is a addictive drug.

 

In all honesty, if the EU doesn't give the UK an extension, Brexit wanting Brits aren't going to complain, however, if the EU does decide to extend Article 50, then they will.

People here are banking on EU skeptic countries like Italy vetoing any extension the UK PM wants.

 

Brits remember a time when experts said 'if the UK doesn't join the single currency, UK would go bankrupt/the economy will crash'; People here are expecting to remember experts saying 'if the UK crashes out of the EU without a deal, it'll go bankrupt and the economy will crash' and it being wrong.

I guess UK doesn't listen to scare tactics.

 

I totally agree with you!

As for the eternally evil Germans ... I'm German ... so we shrug it over only with the shoulder with "the question is ... who cares?".

You just have only to read through all the threads on the subject and you see and you know ... there is a lot of ignorance and lacking knowledge about the EU right now at those who get rid of their hate rants against the EU and people like Juncker or Tusk as if they decide about all. These people in the UK do not even know who is the decisive force on the EU side, in terms of Brexit ... the EU Council!

Composition of the EU Council:
The European Council is composed of the State and heads of government of the EU countries, the President the European Commission (Juncker) and the High Representative of the Union for Foreign Affairs and Security Policy (Mogherini).
The EU Council is convened by its President, who has been appointed / elected by the European Council itself for a renewable term of two and a half years. The EU Council President represents the Union externally and is currently Donald Tusk.
For all decisions, each member of the Council has only one vote! For some decisions, a simple or 2/3 majority is enough, for others, a unanimous decision is necessary. As regards Brexit and extension, a unanimous decision is necessary.

What do you mean ... how many in the UK do know this little and important fact about EU with view on Brexit process, including these clowns in your parliament?

Or take this saying on the famous red bus at the referendum back then:

"We send the EU GBP 350 million a week! Let's fund our NHS instead - Vote leave!"

What do you think, how many people in the UK still believe this is a truth? It is a total impudent lie instead and by facts!
These GBP 350 million are very questionable, but OK, let's say the amount is right. Fact: 66% = GPB 231 million return directly to London the next day since the 1980's. And how much of these GBP 231 million went into the NHS instead?

Almost every Brexit advocate I had confronted with this fact did not know that! But the EU is evil ... of course!

 

Look at it like this...

Why would the UK want to agree to a deal with EU when it'll kill a deal with the US?

If the EU wants a deal with the UK, then come to the UK post Brexit on a deal that serves both and not just the EU. Don't jump the gun to be front of the queue when America says it'll kill any US UK trade deal.
Meanwhile, we'll take back our legislate and border. That said, if the UK doesn't understand the EU, the EU doesn't understand what Brexit was about.

 

I am young enough to remember the debates in the Bundestag and all the other Parliaments of the 6 founding nations of the EEC, because of the lofty goal of a political union, not just commercial union.

I think that is an other point that just went woooooooooosh past 99.9% of all Brits and that's why they believe that the EU has suddenly politicaly.
I bet the treaty of Aachen did go woooooosh to and most of them would not understand why Aachen and the symbolism of it. Or what that treaty will mean for the future path of the EU.

The UK never bought into the goals of the EEC, kept them quiet, otherwise the vote for the EEC would have been a resounding NO

The UK has to leave, one way or the other, the EU does not need one more dysfunctional country, which will not buy in to the goals, it has very important, pressing problems of its own to solve and can not waste its time and energy with a dysfunctional UK.

 

Her you go, May shows her utter incompetence. She wants 3 month.
Doesn't she know that elections for the EU parliament are at the end of May and the places vacated by the UK-Brexit will be redistributed between the remaining members.
How is that to work ?
The Uk would be still in the EU and would have to give its people a chance to vote.
If that ain't going to happen, during a 3 month extension, disenfranchised voter could sue the crap out of the UK and EU and prevent the forming and swearing in of a new parliament in July.

 

The EU cares very little about your domestic interest, or what that Brexit is supposed to be about. It has to take care of it self, first, and than if time and energy is left in the schedule, it might concern itself about your country back dreams, which would be a waste of time.

What most of the Brits don't get, the EU has moved on, without the UK, it is not anymore part of the deliberations and talks of the 27.
Yes they would like a soft Brexit, makes sense, but if the UK can not solve its domestic chaos, it will take a hard Brexit, so it can continue with its own business.
Opposite to the UK, the 27 and the EU have been preparing, for month, for both option.

 

'Brexit means Brexit' - gimme a break!! As I keep saying Once a Remainer always a Remainer. And now she's blaming every man and his bloody dog for the imbroglio, and the trait of blaming others for one's mistakes, wrong judgments, and other shortcomings is the first indicator of delusion and megalomania, and that's what has just happened. Just think - 1001 days of trying not (sic) to leave the EU, and that's why we're in this humiliating chaos: and the intention is to keep it that way for the coming generations of politicians (and their family members?) to er, move on to pastures green after life in Westminster? It's why the referendum result is so at variance in the HoC with the national sentiment. Oh, and the latest Project Fear rumour? Forget shortages of life-saving medicines and essential food products being delayed until they rot, because this makes them pale into insignificance . . . a no-deal Brexit will mean a shortage of - horror of horrors - toilet rolls.

"Brexit: Toilet paper maker stockpiles in a case of no-deal" I keep thinking I'm gonna wake up in a minute??

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-47640908

 

That Brexit means Brexit is not the question or is questioned ...
The question is "how?" please ...

If I take all the idiotic dream imaginings of the "no deal wing", then that borders on British suicide ... quite apart from a total ignorance of realities in the UK for little British Mr. Miller and Ms. Smith.

 

I have to admit, Mandelus, that you're far more 'productive' than your EU propaganda wonk colleague whom I spoke of yesterday on my other discussion site. You ought to ask Tusk for a salary increase.

 

Britain's never little.

 

I do it completely voluntarily, without pay. It is my passion to fight idiocy and fireworks of lies and ignorance ...
Although a good idea from you, because if I would ask for money, then one year is enough and still the children of my children do not have to go to work because I would have got so much money then... from
- The EU to fight Brexit lies and Fake News
- Get US authorities to fight 9/11 conspiracy fake news
- NASA to fight the nonsense because there was never anyone on the moon.

Seriously Cerberus ... what of your reasons = the general reasons of all Brexit advocates for Brexit has not actually been refuted as a lie or being ignorance / total lack of knowledge about the EU?

 

Don't underestimate my intelligence; I have more 'knowledge about the EU' than you think, not the least of it being that it's a bureaucrats' Shangri'la, and an undemocratic bureaucrats' Shanrgri'la, also. The EU is on the brink of collapse, and it needs our money to head it off. I'm nowhere near as stupid as you seem to believe.

 

Questionable statement from you ... but OK ... I did not say that either. I said "little British Mr. Miller and Ms. Smith", not little Britain!

 

I did not consider you a jerk or dubbed you ...
But why, for example, do you then insult and attack Tusk in such a way that he decides personally how things will go with the Brexit on the EU side ... if it does not decide in reality?
This raises legitimate questions about your knowledge of the EU!

 

Tusk and his fellow commissioners do decide policy decisions between themselves, then put it to the vote in the parliament - and take careful note of those MEP's who don't agree with their decision?? That's why they hate Farage so much - it's because he's not a toadie like all the others.

 

Nonsense!
About the Brexit, as well as about your extension now decides only the EU Council and here must be a unanimous decision. Neither Juncker, nor Tusk decide here and not even the EU Parliament!
The all the talking and counseling is normal and correct ... yes it even has to be like this ... or does it do anything else in the UK? No!

And as for Farrage ... sorry ... the guy is "the lie with two legs". Just say, you think this idiot is great? He admitted one day after the referendum that almost all the claims for Brexit were a lie and not true by him ... and you forgive such a piece of ****?

 

Wrong the Warsaw Pact traded mostly within itselft and no country could apply for membership, they were force with tanks and guns.
The EU is a organization one can join and leave, by its terms and the contracts each applicant has to sign. It does not block progress, it thrives on progress. The EU negotiates for its members and takes into account each members needs, has to, because in the end each member has to say YES. How many deals did the EU sign and finish since you Brexit vote, 3 just of my head, Japan, Canada and Singapore, 2 more are in the making.
That's the deal if you sign up, the EU negotiates the deals and than presents them to the council of 27 and they all have to say YES.
That's what those nasty and bad bureaucrats of the EU get payed for, cut very good deals for the members of the EU, for all

 

The EU frowns on protectionism, which is blocking developing economies in Africa signed up to treaties with the EU.
In fact, free trade means the EU is free to flood these markets with cheap onions from the NL under pricing local farmers and their local onions stopping them from progress.
EU thrives on free trade, not progress.
It saturates local labour markets by allowing people from poorer economies to settle with freedom of movement. That isn't progress, that keeps wages low.
If the UK ended freedom of movement for people in the EU, then unskilled migrants from poorer economies wouldn't be free to come to the UK and stop unskilled jobs getting a livable wage.

Protectionism is good, free trade is bad, you need fair trade to be good.

 

People in Northern Ireland are worried that any back stop proposed will leave Northern Ireland subject to EU regulations, and that's something Northern Ireland doesn't want, it wants to exit with the rest of the UK. You can not pretend this isn't the case.
It's also feared that this would enable a flood from the EU into the UK via Northern Ireland.

People don't want the EU flooding them.

 

I just wasted my time.​