Most Democrats think "Medicare For All" means they can still keep their plans

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by HB Surfer, Jun 18, 2019.

  1. ronv

    ronv Well-Known Member

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    Does this mean you don't know the difference?
     
  2. ronv

    ronv Well-Known Member

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    1. sure. Does private insurance have 98 billion in fraud every year like government health care currently does?
    I know Obama's HHS secretary was implementing some new processes. Hope Trump keeps it going. I haven't seen any recent numbers.

    2. For always, unless you can tell me how it will magically go lower. You don't need single payer to lower drug costs, since last year the Trump admin was able to drop drug costs for the first time in almost 50 years.
    It goes away when we can negotiate drug prices like um Canada.

    3. Socialized medicine will lead to the collapse of private hospitals. They'll end up being government employees.
    Naw

    4. They don't live longer because of socialized medicine. They live longer because of our higher rates of accidental and intentional deaths. Primarily drug usage.
    I guess you overlooked the survival rates.

    https://www.cnn.com/2016/02/09/health/american-life-expectancy-shorter-than-europeans/index.html


    upload_2019-6-21_17-24-32.png
    Gun control. Another topic. :)
    5. I'm sure lowering their wages won't affect their quality at all.

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...ortages-hospital-ward-shortages-a8172821.html
    The education costs and abuse of internships by are the problem. These are by far the best paying jobs. The problem here is not money.

    6. Yes socialists yearn for the equality of misery for all except their overlords.[/QUOTE]
     
  3. MolonLabe2009

    MolonLabe2009 Banned

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    I know the difference, but you don't.
     
  4. rahl

    rahl Banned

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    Ignoring the empirical data doesn’t make it go away. Sorry.
     
  5. rahl

    rahl Banned

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    They do not.


    No it isn’t. This is why you shouldn’t discuss hints you know nothing about.
     
  6. rahl

    rahl Banned

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  7. MolonLabe2009

    MolonLabe2009 Banned

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    Empirical data is only as good as the people gathering the data.

    WHO is liberal biased.
     
  8. MolonLabe2009

    MolonLabe2009 Banned

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    Single payer is government run.
     
  9. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    Well that is mondo crazy. There's no way socialised healthcare will work unless you limit it to CITIZENS. We don't even extend ours to permanent residents (who are almost citizens). Not a citizen? You're not entitled to anything from the public purse. Not a dime. No welfare, no public education, no healthcare, no housing, no voting, no nothing.
     
  10. Dissily Mordentroge

    Dissily Mordentroge Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Anecdotal but interesting. Americans who move to Australia as immigrants often arrive with extreme right wing views of health care insurance but after a few encounters with our tax funded public system change their views radically.
     
  11. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    Yep. Even if every member of the family had multiple hip replacements and the most cutting edge cancer treatments for the next twenty years. There is no limit to what we can have done, within the normal bounds of orthodox medicine and which is demonstrably necessary. You can't have plastic surgery, for example, unless you have an anomaly or injury requiring correction. You can't expect or demand a doctor in non-medical situations, either. Best example is childbirth. We use midwives, and doctors are only brought in upon medical necessity (complications). Etc etc.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2019
  12. jdog

    jdog Banned

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    Health care only becomes expensive under socialism. When I grew up, healthcare in America was cheap. Doctors even made house calls. It was only when the government got involved in healthcare did it become expensive. So far as Americans who move to Australia, any Citizen who would give up their sovereignty to become a subject is not exactly a genius in my book....
     
  13. rahl

    rahl Banned

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    Baseless denials and hand waiving doesn’t make the data go away. Sorry.
     
  14. rahl

    rahl Banned

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    It is not. Please stop discussing things you don’t know about.
     
  15. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    No, it just sends it back to 1993 where it came from.

    Let us know when you get back to the future.
     
  16. hudson1955

    hudson1955 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Medicare for all should mean you can n buy inn to Medicare at a premium that will cover the cost if care. It would be higher than current NeducRe patients pay but liwerthgan private insurance.

    It cannot be free.not even Medicare for seniors ius free. But due to the large number of insureds the cost should be lower and affordable

    Working in medical administration for over 35 years, I think I know what will work.
     
  17. Dissily Mordentroge

    Dissily Mordentroge Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I don’t know what planet you’re living on but it’s not the same one as mine. I have no idea what you mean by ‘give up their sovereighty to become a subject’. Australia’s Gov’t run health system saves vast amounts. Bulk buying of drugs, bulk buying of expensive technology such as MRI scanners etc all adds up. As to this American obssession with ‘socialism’ Australia’s is, like many Scandanavian countrys, a mixed economy. If you attempted to tell Australians they lived in a socialist economy most would laugh at you, even the conservatives.
     
  18. rahl

    rahl Banned

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    Sorry, ignoring the data isn’t a rebuttal. Feel free to post a peer reviewed paper to rebut the one I gave you. Good luck.
     
  19. jdog

    jdog Banned

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    Australians are subjects. You are not the same legal social status as an American Citizen. Just because you are well kept subjects, you are still subjects. There are only 2 states of human existence, a sovereign or a subject. A sovereign citizen owns themselves and their lives. A subject is owned by and subservient to the state.

    If you doubt this, I can easily prove it. In Australia if you are arrested and sent to court, who are you judged by? You are judged by a Magistrate. This is because the Master is the State, and you are the servant. The government is your master and stands in judgement on you.

    In America if you are arrested and sent to court you can only be judged by a jury of you peers, other Citizens. That is because in America, the Citizen is Master and the government is the servant. The Master (Citizen) cannot be judged by the servant (government).

    Now that you have been educated. Take comfort in your healthcare, as you are trading it for your status as a free and sovereign human being.
     
  20. ronv

    ronv Well-Known Member

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    The VA is gov't run healthcare. Medicare is not.
     
  21. MolonLabe2009

    MolonLabe2009 Banned

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    The poster I was initially responding to was talking about single payer, not VA or Medicare.

    Try to keep up.
     
  22. ronv

    ronv Well-Known Member

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    From @rahl
    Failing memory?
     
  23. MolonLabe2009

    MolonLabe2009 Banned

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    Yes it is government run. Please stop discussing things you don’t know about.
     
  24. MolonLabe2009

    MolonLabe2009 Banned

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    Baseless claims and hand waiving doesn’t make the data correct. Sorry.
     
  25. vman12

    vman12 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I didn't ignore the data. I put it back in 1993 where it came from.

    When you want to join us in 2019 let me know.

    Until then, I don't care about your 26 year old data.
     

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