https://edition.cnn.com/2019/08/12/politics/federal-budget-deficit-rises-july/index.html As a fiscal conservative, I find this more than troubling. When the economy is firing on all cylinders, that is the time to get the deficit under control. Once again Trump has proven to be a con-man (as if anyone is surprised). Trump campaigned to eliminate the debt (not just the deficit, but the debt) and is now driving a huge increase to the deficit. Pathetic. Sad. Predictable.
You’re the only fiscal conserative who even gives a damn. The rest of them forgot about “taxed enough already” the day Trump got elected.
I also care, most fiscal conservatives do. We are just becoming a smaller and smaller minority. Unfortunately most trump supporters do not care about fiscally conservative values, from what I have seen most do not have any steadfast values at all and change on the whims of the party. trump is not a conservative — he just projects that same amount of vitriol that his base has so they love him. They have become a party without a cause except to attack others that they dislike.
When you boil the half distracted low brow and low information crowd that is core to Trumpism, it’s easy to see that. I went to a couple of local tea party rallies in 2010, just to see what it was really about, as opposed to the cable tv noise. I quickly found that it was mainly about race, and anger that a black man was President. That was the one running constant. The other issues were barely mentioned. Flag waving, a little bible thumping, and even some gun toting. The tea parties stood out in the open and validated Obama’s comment about “guns, gays and God”. And if you wanted to make them really really mad, just point out the obvious. BTW, I care about fiscal conservatism too. We blew the opportunity of a lifetime by not allowing the tax and spending habits of the late 1990’s to prevail. We could have retired much of the national debt by now, and had plenty of money to do the other things. Instead, we gave it to the banker. They built additions to their Hampton’s beach houses. Oh, and we started a pointless war in the wrong country and lost it.
As a fiscal conservative I am also truobled by the overspending in washingtopn Both parties are abject failures
This is why I don't refer to Trump supporters as Republicans or conservatives. They are different things. (Venn diagram, anyone?) Even "conservative" doesn't have a clear meaning. People can be fiscal conservatives but social liberals, and vice versa. Actually, it would probably be accurate to describe Trump and his supporters as fiscally profligate and socially conservative (or even neanderthal in some cases). The fact that the deficit is exploding when the economy is going well, and Trump and his supporters don't care about that, shows that they have no fiscally conservative principles at all. Supporting low taxation in and of itself, without looking at the effect on the deficit, is not fiscally conservative. It is being fiscally ignorant.
But didn't you support the tax cut? Supporting a tax cut without addressing spending is NOT being fiscally conservative.
I don't use the term or phrase fiscal conservative anymore. It has become to mean only low taxes. It has nothing to do with being fiscal responsible. I'm in the fiscal responsible crowd if there is such a crowd. I believe this country shouldn't be spending more than what it takes in, revenues. With the massive deficits and ever rising national debt since Bill Clinton's last year in office, the only conclusion one can make is neither party regardless of its rhetoric is or believes in being fiscal responsible. This latest budget deal proves that. Eisenhower was the last president where the national debt actually shrank from one year to the next. He accomplished that twice in his eight years. Since IKE, we've never had a fiscal responsible president. You can throw congress into that mix as it takes both. Political party hasn't made a difference. Nothing but rhetoric with no substance.
If you look in absolute terms, maybe not. But in a growing economy, the tax cut prevented the revenue from growing as much as it should have. So yes, the tax cut did reduce revenue compared to what it would have been in the absence of the cut. The tax cut had the effect of drastically increasing the deficit. If overspending is the problem, address that. And don't cut taxes until and unless that is addressed.
Thats one way of looking at it But others like myself think that lower taxes were a stimulas that that raised revenue Clearly overspending is the problem and always has been
If that were the case then 0 taxes would produce ALL the revenue right? That's silly. Taxes (like all things) require a balanced approach. Kansas figured that out, why can't anyone else?
I have delved into reading Apocalytic books a lot and there are some "authors" who have the no taxes theme as what rebuilt our country after Obama wrecked it by over taxing. Or it was the Liberal EMP or Democrats spending that caused our economic collapse.
Mac did address spending. Real fiscal conservatives, not the spendthrifts who only complain about tax cuts, support both tax cuts and spending cuts.
We are actually underspending in several areas, ie the Federal Prison System that killed Epstein. But Trump orders 3 submarines when the state department asks for 2.
Real fiscal conservatives would oppose a tax cut unless there was already a corresponding spending cut in place to offset the reduced revenues.
FACTS; 1. Estimated versus Actual Outlays.....AT PAR! 2. Estimated versus Actual Receipts....SIGNIFICANTLY DOWN!......WHY?
Yes it did. Indeed, the Trump team didn’t even make the pretense that his tax cut would be revenue neutral. There was some feeble spin from the noise machine, repeating all the “trickle down” myths, and repeating the claim that tax revenue would go up (but never enough to cover borrowing, which is the part they always leave out). But that was about it. I guess you can only sell the Laffer curve so many times. Eventually people figure out they’ve been conned, even if they don’t understand the mechanics of three card monte.
Totally agree with you. I posted weeks ago about the proposed budget adding $320 billion over existing spending and no one cared. I believe fiscal conservatism is something republicans only care about when democrats are in power. I believe that a lot of Trump supporters do not have their own set of political beliefs. They will easily adopt Trumps views on almost every policy, whether it be trade tariffs, shutting down or breaking up private tech companies, increase spending, or attacking individuals.
Why would libs want no govt'? That's silly. Govt has an important role to play in society. Like it or not. So funding it to fulfill that role properly is a necessary function of life.
