"We the People.." Do Not Have Constitutional Right to Vote

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Truly Enlightened, Oct 10, 2019.

  1. yguy

    yguy Well-Known Member

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    Swell, thanks for nothing.
     
  2. ChristopherABrown

    ChristopherABrown Well-Known Member

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    LOL, you didn’t read the whole thread where I explain with multiple proofs, that the federal government is a fraud after 1871.

    You have some unlearning to do thanks to government schools.

    Folks, rahl shows us how sheeple behave after empire conditioning. Avoid this error please.
     
  3. Truly Enlightened

    Truly Enlightened Active Member

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    Thank you again. Major Gabbard is not "just another one of those people". She is an exceptional person. No other person has the courage, intelligence, and the "cojones" to get money out of politics, stop all regime-change wars, remove all draconian sanctions, stop the nuclear cold war, use the "war dividend" to address our urgent social issues, make it illegal to arm terrorists or wage war without Congressional approval, remove the "revolving door" for our representatives, and to bring back the integrity, dignity, trust, and respect, that once made America great, and not feared. Her tweets to the war-mongering Hillary, was in a class of decorum that does not exist. Just brilliant. "Putting all our eggs in one basket" does not really reflect the seriousness of our fiscal and social situation. If we continue in running our economy on debt, eventually our economy will collapse. Just looking at the changes in the "repo market" indicates not if the economy will crash, but when. When this happens, all that money you have amassed/hoarded through opportunities taken, will become worthless. You do realize that our government has a national debt of over 20 Trillion dollars, and an unfunded(promise to pay) debt of around 160 Trillion dollars? Governments must stop borrowing, spending, or giving out tax credits and bail-outs. All Presidents so far have contributed to this debt. Trump is expected to contribute over 5 Trillion more to this debt. https://www.thebalance.com/us-debt-by-president-by-dollar-and-percent-3306296

    My comments about corporations, was that they stay out of politics. I also agree, that more and more corporations are now donating to charities and non-profit organizations, for philanthropic reasons than for tax cuts. Corporation's only mandate is to make a profit. Corporations are not concerned with protecting your Constitutional rights. Or, for promoting equality, life, liberty, and happiness. Corporations promote their own products or services. Corporations should never be allowed to influence any social policy decisions, through favor or profit. In most cases, its self-interests is not our self-interest.

    My family and I are also more than financially comfortable. But I am not so arrogant or naïve enough, to assume that everyone else had the same opportunities and chances that I had. There are many unseen barriers that deny many the opportunities that I had. It is also the true nature of Capitalism itself, to create disproportionate wealth. That is, the wealth-gap between the top 1% and the bottom 90%, will continue to increase. Eventually, the top 1% will own 100% of all wealth, and the bottom 90% will own 100% of all debt. Why should the people pay off corporate debt? Fortunately, I won't be around when(not if) this happens. Hopefully our economy will crash, or a civil revolution will occur first. As Orwell explained, "A hierarchical society was only possible on a basis of poverty and ignorance”. And, "...there is no scenario without poverty where you can rely on a hierarchical system.".

    I said that you were suffering from "Nationalistic Denialism", because you questioned the validity of my accusations about US atrocities and US imperialism. I gave many examples of why America is not always good, and not always right. Since you have not provided any positive example of American intervention, I will assume that you agree with me.

    Donald Trump was never smart. Anyone who claims that by exploiting the bankruptcy laws, means that you are a smart businessman, is NOT very intelligent. I'm sure if daddy gave you over half a billion dollars, you could do a lot better than Trump. He failed, lied, or bankrupted almost ever thing he spent daddy's money on. Even running for President was only a scam to increase the value of his only product-- the Trump Name. He never expected to win the nomination, let alone the presidency. It is ironic that the only thing he expected to fail at, he succeeded at. Trump could have taken a dump on the WH lawn, or had sex on national television, and it would only increase his following. It was not that Trump was smart, it was that we were more stupid. We convinced ourselves that what we were seeing and hearing, was fake. This narcissistic sociopath had no political, military, or any leadership experience to run a McDonalds, let along the highest office in the land. Dismissing the only candidate with military, political, rank leadership experience, and a viable message and solution, only highlights the extent of this level of stupidity. We are more interested in being hyper-partisan, than in finding the solutions. It is unfortunate that pride is the last to go before destruction. But I believe that this rule does not apply to the wise. The future of society will depend entirely on people stepping outside of their imaginary political ideologies. They need to stop being the part of the problem, and be part of the solution. This is not rocket science. Just look at the policies, and start thinking for yourself.
     
  4. carlberky

    carlberky Active Member

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    I agree with much of what you say … but do you really think that anyone can run on that platform? Or even be allowed to?
     
  5. doombug

    doombug Well-Known Member

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    And to think there are many people who want this same government to run our lives. Free healthcare, free education,...etc? All these are one big ruse designed to give power to these corrupt corporations and big donors.
     
  6. perotista

    perotista Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Section 2, Article I reads The House of Representatives shall be composed of Members chosen every second year by the People of the Several States...

    Perhaps the Constitution doesn't come right out and state the right to vote, but in the sentence above it certainly implies it. The right to vote for members of the House of Representatives or to choose them using the Constitution's words. Now that vote didn't apply to senators back then, that was addressed in the 17th Amendment. Nor did it apply to the presidency as the Constitution left it up to the state legislatures, elected by the people, to decide how and to whom to award their electoral votes. Most states in the beginning didn't hold popular votes for the presidency. It was until after the civil war that all states finally went to the popular vote.

    In the beginning the power rested with the state legislatures which were elected by the people which in turn the state legislatures choose the senators and who received that states electoral votes. A true representative government. You elect, vote for a state representative who makes the decisions and takes actions for you.
     
  7. rahl

    rahl Banned

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    I read it. You are incorrect. People are citizens of the US, not of a state. People are residents of states.

    I suggest you actually reading the constitution, and subsequent case law.
    Because I corrected you on citizenship? Lol ok.
     
  8. Truly Enlightened

    Truly Enlightened Active Member

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    Sorry I have taken so long in responding. I'm not sure what you mean by "END of the abridging of the PURPOSE of free speech is effected.". If you are saying that the freedom of speech is absolute, then I disagree for obvious reasons. If you are suggesting that the media that exploits human nature should be more regulated or censored, then I disagree. At some point, it will be the responsibility of the people to determine what the true nature of offensive and harmful speech is. There are many activities that are not covered by the 1st Amendment. https://www.lawforseniors.org/how-g...reedom-of-speech-what-it-is-and-what-it-isn-t .

    I apologize that the rest of your post is just not very clear to me. So, I'm afraid I can't comment further.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2019
  9. Truly Enlightened

    Truly Enlightened Active Member

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    Could you be more specific? Are you implying that, stopping wars, stopping the cold war, de-escalating the arms race, saving Trillions of dollars to address social issues, stop arming terrorists, getting money out of politics, remove all crippling sanctions to reduce the refugee crisis, and providing med4all with choice, is an untenable plateform? I respectfully disagree. If fact, without stopping these wasteful wars first, any other platform will only increase government borrowing, spending, and DEBT

    Are you also implying that Tulsi's platform should not even be allowed? Why would you feel that way? Do you think that we should keep wasting trillions of dollars, and ignore the social issues here at home? I apologize if I have misunderstood you.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2019
  10. God & Country

    God & Country Well-Known Member

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    She is a politician and remains so until she's elected and proves otherwise, I'm just not willing to roll those dice.
    Agreed but how is electing another Democrat the solution?
    Planned Parenthood claims they are. Do you support them?
    Excuses, there is no shortage of immigrants who took advantage of the opportunity that has always existed here and became wealthy. Too many Americans would rather let the government take care of them and blame their poverty on others.
    America is the most generous nation in the world, we just don't crow about it. Name any disaster in the last hundred years and America was there and in many cases before anyone else.
    Really, what qualifies you to say so, are you a billionaire, a mogul, lord over a financial empire, have you outsmarted the Democrat party and their minions, the IRS, the FBI or the CIA? Are you the president of the US and about to be re-elected?
    If it were only that simple. If we do not clean up DC to the core ideologies real or otherwise aren't worth spit. BTW lots of Orwell's writing has proven prophetic but we must remember he was a fiction writer first, political satirist, maybe but then given human propensities those things almost wrote themselves. I have zero answers for what ails America but looking through an Orwellian prism I can see that what the dominant politics have done to the US for the last fifty years and it has utterly failed.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2019
  11. ChristopherABrown

    ChristopherABrown Well-Known Member

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    States powers per the 10th AMD are rendered moot by that. State legislations are disempowered. You provide no proof. These are facts.
    ------
    THE ACT OF 1871
    On February 21, 1871, the Forty-First Congress–also known as the “Acts of the Forty-First Congress,” Section 34, Session III, chapters 61 and 62–passed the Act of 1871: “An Act To Provide A Government for the District of Columbia.” Without constitutional authority, Congress created a separate form of government for the District of Columbia, which is literally a piece of land that extends out for only 10 miles. But why?
    After the Civil War our nation was essentially bankrupt, and America was very vulnerable to European interests. The Civil War itself was nothing more than a strategic maneuver created by the international bankers to gain a stronghold on America. Knowing that the nation was in financial trouble, Congress made a deal with the Rothschild’s of London thereby incurring a debt. As we know banks do not lend money unless it is in their best interest, so the Crown of London created way to gain control of the United States. Thus the Act of 1871 was passed, and THE UNITED STATES corporation was born.
    Note the capitalization; this is very important. Now owned by foreign interests, this corporation obliterated the original version of the Constitution with the Act of 1871. Our beloved Constitution was defaced as the title was capitalized and the word “for” was changed to the word “of”. The original Constitution was written in this manner: “The Constitution for the united states of America” is now changed to: “THE CONSTITUTION OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA”... a corporate constitution. This constitution operates in an economic capacity, and has been used as a tool to fool the People into thinking that it is the same Constitution created by our Founding Fathers. The capitalization of names on legal documents may seem minor, yet have major impacts on each generation born in this country. What the Congress did was create a constitution for the corporate government of the District of Columbia, and not that of America. Let that sink in for a moment.

This corporate constitution serves outside of the original Constitution. It does not benefit the Republic nor its people, yet serves only to benefit the corporation. Rather than having inalienable rights guaranteed under the original Constitution, we now have ‘privileges’. An example of a privilege is the right to travel which also includes the right to operate a vehicle. Once must be licensed in order to do so. These privileges operate outside of the original Constitution.
    ----

    http://www.realtruth.biz/freedomstuff/state citizen or us citizen.htm

    You suggest I repeat you for you. The 14th Amendment is AFTER the fraud of 1871. Null and void in a lawful world.

    Worse than sheeple, cognitive infiltrator, covert agent promoting unlawful politics, exposing themselves.
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2019
  12. ChristopherABrown

    ChristopherABrown Well-Known Member

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    It starts with the simple biological definition of the ultimate PURPOSE of free speech.

    ~~ The ultimate biological, natural law (same things) defining the PURPOSE of free speech is that it is to assure information vital to survival is shared and understood. ~~

    Have you ever tried to share information vital to survival with our society? I have. It cannot be shared effectively. Anyone who has information they know is vital and is not a millionaire finds exactly the same situation. The biological PURPOSE is abridged. Millionaires will not share that info IF it upsets political structures. That definition of PURPOSE is an. If we survive what we are creating, what is happening, it will be by accident not by our own actions.

    I think you missed the point which caused this.

    Government MUST define the BEST speech and always support it. That definition MUST be created by the people in a majority for the intent of the 9th Amendment to be present. All the harmful stuff can proceed into oblivion freely.

    The 1st Amendment needs revision to include recognition of the BEST speech. It was defined long ago, perhaps over a 1,000 years by very wise humans using techniques we cannot intelligently discuss. The definitions however were recognized by the Framers who tried to include them, but Tory gold paying off the community surrounding them saw that the full set of definitions were truncated into something that the empire could manage.

    The fact that history does not record this only proves written history is easily perverted whereas oral histories cannot be intelligently discussed and preserve knowledge vital for survival better. Academia is handicapped by dominance of the church.

    The "Greater Meaning Of Free Speech" is or was, an actual, practiced philosophical doctrine by the Six Nation Iroquois Confederacy, specifically the Seneca. The "meaning" is derived from an understanding that can come from the practice of free speech. ~~From the understanding can come; forgiveness, tolerance, acceptance, respect, trust, friendship and love, protecting life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.~~

    The logic of that passage cannot be reasonably denied in a world of people that know cooperation is vital to survival.

    Perhaps you can accept that this narrative is removed from the one controlled by the church and academia, while it also is more logical, particularly considering our situation and conditions which occurred or were caused under church and academic control.
     
  13. carlberky

    carlberky Active Member

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    "Are you also implying that Tulsi's platform should not even be allowed?" No, I'm implying that her platform would not even be allowed.

    "Do you think that we should keep wasting trillions of dollars, and ignore the social issues here at home?" Of course not, but asking
    for pie in the sky is not realistic until the swamp has been drained … and I don't see that happening soon.
     
  14. rahl

    rahl Banned

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    It doesn’t matter how many times you repeat this and bring up an act that has no relevance to what is being discussed. People are citizens of the US, not of a state. They are residents of a state.



    An amendment to the constitution is null and void? Do you even realize how batshit crazy the stuff you post is?


    Because I corrected you on citizenship? Lol ok
     
    Truly Enlightened likes this.
  15. Truly Enlightened

    Truly Enlightened Active Member

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    Trump has stated, ""My net worth fluctuates, and it goes up and down with markets and with attitudes and with feelings, even my own feelings,". Is this how to determine ones net worth? Until his IRS tax returns are revealed, his voluntary over-inflated property estimates(inherited from Fred), told to Forbes, are nothing but lies to keep his ego in check. Even if we were to ignore his business disasters https://gawker.com/a-complete-list-of-donald-trump-s-business-disasters-1764151188, his inflated net worth is not based on facts, his inflated sense of self-worth and intelligence is not based on facts, his six corporate bankruptcies, his moral and ethical turpitude, his use of daddy's money to always bail him out, his practices of hiring crooks, liars, and thieves, who share the same crooked business acumens as himself, but the worst thing is the pathological 8000 lies so far, that is a total embarrassment and insult to the office of Presidency. Regarding those he has deceived, he can't keep hiding behind the presidency forever. There are federal, state, and even municipal courts and groups, that are just waiting until he leaves the protection of his office for justice.

    If you are a "ends justify the means" kind of person, then you must be very proud of the results. However, I am not that kind of person. I also look at the "journey" as well. It is the journey that shapes our persona, character, and identity. I am not a person that can be manipulated into believing that bad is good, and wrong is right. My informed opinions are not based on the use of top-down logic(Trump rich, therefore must be smart). This fallacious logic is biased, lazy, self-serving, false, and ignorant. So, am I qualified as a rational human being to form an opinion if Trump has ever been intelligent? ABSOLUTELY YES. Did he fool people who wanted to be fooled into believing, that having no military, political, or leadership experience, made him the best choice over candidates with experience?. ABSOLUTELY YES. Does Trump prove how dumb he is everyday(invisible planes, build a wall and have Mexico pay for it, clearing forests with shovels, buying Greenland, threatens to unleash ISIS fighters on Europe, claims to be the "chosen one", "grab them by the p***y", calling Kim Jung-un "Rocket man", or asking for a sitting President's birth certificate)? ABSOLUTELY YES. Trump didn't vote himself into office, so why do you give him credit? Trump's idiocy was always up-front, and in our faces, but people like you just didn't care.

    So, Yes I am more than qualified to give an objective, fact-based, informed opinion about the intelligence of Donald Trump. In fact, any human with more that a few working brain cells is just as qualified.

    the 14th Amendment, through its "right of privacy" protects a pregnant woman's liberty to choose to have an abortion. Planned Parenthood is a non profit(oops, not a corporation) organization that is funded by the government(Medicaid), and private and corporate donations. Most rational people do care about unchecked population growth. Less than 4% of its resources are used for actual abortions, or to promote abortion rights. Most of their resources are used for contraception, sexual and reproductive health, and family planning education. Planned Parenthood is also a tax-exempt corporation under the IRS Code, since it belongs to the International Planned Parenthood Federation(IPPF).

    For the last time people are far too complex to be defined has Democrats or Republicans. Most rational thinking views, are not limited by any specific ideologies. I'm sure you might have some liberal-leaning views on some issues, and some conservative-leaning views on other issues. Those that do not, are called fanatics and radicals. I personally don't like any politician. But, I have not become so guarded and cynical, that I can't discern between spectacle and fact. If a Republican with the bona fides, experiences, and the policies of a Tulsi Gabbard, I would vote for him/her. It just seems mindlessly unproductive, to simply dismiss an obvious and clear solution to a problem, simply because of where the solution came from. This seems rather immature and juvenile to me. Major Gabbard has been elected four times, is three ranks below a general, quit her position as 2IC of the DNC, is standing up to the entire corporate establishment, uses truth to fight power and lies, willing to sacrifice her life for her country, and has never compromised her integrity, or her belief in service before self. No other candidate has been willing to show what they are willing to sacrifice. She is not a bet, she is a sure thing.

    Regarding your social arrogance and "nationalistic denialism", I can only take a horse to water, I can't make him drink it. As I have said before, I was fortunate and lucky, and things worked out for me and my family. But, if we simply use common sense alone, everyone can't be wealthy. Just like a Pyramid Scheme, only those on the top tiers are wealthy. Why do you think that is? I can only bring you the facts and the evidence to justify my assertions. I can't do anything else. Denial of the truth, is also your objective constitutional right.
     
  16. Truly Enlightened

    Truly Enlightened Active Member

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    The policies I mentioned IS her platform. So whether her platform should be, or would be allowed, is irrelevant and academic. Do you think that we should just keep waging wasteful wars, increasing our 160 Trillion dollar total debt, killing people all over the world, sanctioning sovereign countries into submission, and ignoring the urgent needs of our own citizens, just because they are just "pie in the sky", unrealistic, and we should not hold our breath? It is this level of social and political apathy that is part of the problem.

    If you have given up on our society's future, then step aside and let those of us who have not given up, try and save our future.
     
  17. carlberky

    carlberky Active Member

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    Your entire post is irrelevant since Tulsi will not be nominated and thus will have no platform.
    Good luck on saving the future. I step aside and will leave it to you.
     
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2019
  18. Truly Enlightened

    Truly Enlightened Active Member

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    I am sorry. I have read your post many times. Maybe someone else can help me understand what you are trying to say? I apologize that you are speaking way over my head. So if you can just come down a bit, as though you are speaking to a 10 year old. I don't want to misconstrue or misrepresent your points. Thank you.
     
  19. Truly Enlightened

    Truly Enlightened Active Member

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    Unless you ARE God, you have no idea whether Tulsi will, or will not be nominated. The only luck will be, that her voice will be heard to more people. The more people who hear her, the larger her following will become. Even as a VP with Bernie, would be a positive for our future. You don't seem to understand just how desperate the establishment is trying to smear and silence her voice. I can easily understand why the establishment is trying to protect their profit margin, from a credible threat. They couldn't care less about addressing social reforms, or our environmental issues. But, I just don't understand why people have become too apathetic and complacent, that they would abandon the only person with the courage and strength, to stand up to the Corporate Establishment, and speak for the people. It is the people in the Caucuses and the Primaries that nominate the candidates. Not the DNC. Corporations only know that if we, "Give them food, entertainment, and hope, the people will believe anything we tell them.". This is not the future I want for future generations, do you? Even Bernie has some fight left, to stand up.

    As I have said before, if you don't care about our nation's future, then step aside for those that do. It won't be luck, it will be hard work against impossible odds.
     
  20. carlberky

    carlberky Active Member

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    "The 1st Amendment needs revision to include recognition of the BEST speech"

    My problem with that is that Congress must initiate the process and author the Amendment, and who wants the parties of Trump or Hillary to declare what is BEST?
     
  21. carlberky

    carlberky Active Member

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    "Unless you ARE God, you have no idea whether Tulsi will, or will not be nominated."

    If YOU are God, perform a miracle and get her nominated.

    "step aside for those that do."

    I already did, in the post you quoted. Sometimes cut and pasting needs a little editing.
     
  22. Truly Enlightened

    Truly Enlightened Active Member

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    A Constitutional Convention can also be called, by 2/3rds of all the State's Legislatures as well. This is the other way to initiate a new Amendment to the Constitution. At this level of government, the people play a more direct role in the process of Amending the Constitution..
     
  23. carlberky

    carlberky Active Member

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    "Thirty-three amendments to the United States Constitution have been approved by Congress and sent to the states for ratification. Twenty-seven of these amendments have been ratified and are now part of the Constitution. As of 2019, the amendment convention process has never been used for proposing constitutional amendments."

    You are technically correct. However, at least 38 delegates from red and blue states must agree … and ratify a document that they approve.
     
  24. Truly Enlightened

    Truly Enlightened Active Member

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    It is totally irrelevant whether the States have succeeded in using Art. V to propose a new Amendment, by calling for a Constitutional Convention(they have failed 4 times so far). This option was only mentioned in response to your Trump - Hillary Amendment fears. Just because it has failed so far, does not mean that it will always fail. Even using the Congressional method, 6 Amendments so far have failed to be ratified by the Senate.
     
  25. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Thanks to corporate America, I have access to new medical drugs, tools, procedures, immunizations—thanks to corporate America I have a heated home in the winter, and cool home in the summer—thanks to corporate America I have a computer, a smart phone, a printer, a HD tv, a new car with safety sensors, satellite radio, usb, moon roof, power and heated seats—thanks to corporate America I have warm clothes and snow boots for the cold and snow, and swimming trunks and tropical drinks for the summer—thanks to corporate I’ve cruised the Caribbean, vacation on the Hawaiian Islands, and visited the history of Krakow. Thanks to corporate America, I’ve lived the life of luxury, experienced the adventure of an explorer, touched the dreams of childhood, and walked in the gardens of paradise.

    Thank you corporate America—May you always bless me with a wonderfully profitable life.

    Thank you corporate America for making life heaven on earth.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2019

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