Brexit Deal Agreed Between UK & EU / Can UK cope without Northern Ireland?

You may have a pretty picture but you remind me with your posts of of an old fogie who is full of made up facts ie. A vet is short for a veteran a retired member of the armed services, so what were they doing in an armoured vehicle? Stop waving your walking stick and try to engage your brain.

 

The ones who have betrayed the brexit vote, the traitors if you like, are the brexit winners who are refusing to create a hard, heavily controlled border on the island of Ireland between the EU and the UK.
Remainers are not and never have been traitors, they are simply clear in what they want.
Leave means leave, it does not mean stay joined, it does not mean any deal or any treaty of any kind. The ballot paper could not have been clearer.
Brexit winners can't live with the consequences of their victory, so they betray their victory.
Nothing proposed so far constitutes 'leave'.

 

Who would believe in a second one when the first was not implemented - as promised in every political Party's manifesto? No-one north of Watford - east, west or south of the Metropolis.

And the second referendum is not intended to have a choice for Leave - is it? Nope - Remain or Remain with our ' as yet unknown' deal will be the choices. Only traitors are demanding a second referendum = Lib dems whose husband's business has a wonderfully lucrative contract with the EU.

 

You may have a pretty picture but you remind me with your posts of of an old fogie who is full of made up facts ie. A vet is short for a veteran a retired member of the armed services, so what were they doing in an armoured vehicle? Stop waving your walking stick and try to engage your brain.

 

London is Remoaner Country = A remain voter simply voted Remain. A Remoaner never stops bleating about and trying to overturn the Leave vote. Gammon = A brexiteer = a Leave voter who has been called every name in the book ie racist, illiterate, uneducated, xenophobic, didn't know what they were voting for, working class, old, middle aged, fat = gammon and ect and so on.

Yes Veterans took to the streets of London in protest against NI vets being tried for alleged crimes against civilian persons during the Troubles - whilst all convicted IRA and Para's have been freed in an amnesty. .

Indeed I am no longer young - a fogie? No, you couldn't call me that - not by any stretch of the imagination. The pic was a joke -- though there is a photo of me looking just like that when on a break in the first, of many, Belgique brothel I worked in - but I keep the pic so that people know who I am with my few name changes - the pic never changes.

I voted Leave in 1975 - my worst fears of then have been realised - we have lost everything including our unique and wonderful independent from central gov municipalities, the local govs on which Britain is based - Britain was a municipal project - all now gone but in name only. I did not understand, even after having lived close to Brussels and knowing many of the EU bureaucracy intimately, I did not understand, because of the facade of our old institutions, I suppose, how we had come to being a 'foreign, unrecognizable, country in our own country so I took up law --- the study of. It is worse - it is worse that i ever imagined and sooooo insidious so utterly utterly and wickedly, heartbreakingly, insidious. The EU has by 84 thousand laws gutted us - ripped out our soul. I am not madly in love with 'the English' but they are my people and so - I fight on in my own way -

For it is never too late --------------

 

Leave voters didn't know what they were voting for.
Most thought they were going to get a new deal the day after the vote. Very few of them voted for no-deal. The campaign was fought on the grounds of a ''Norway type deal'' or similar by most of the campaigners. Even Farage was pushing that line at the time.
Remain voters knew exactly what they were voting for. There was nothing ambiguous about staying as we are.

 

There is a chance of that, it's called Nigel Farage. He can piss off enough EU members so that they vote against any more extensions. Hopefully.

 

I was born in Epsom and spent most of my youth around that area. I then moved to Croydon, but in reality it wasn't Croydon it was Roundshaw.
Nobody would ever admit that they lived in Roundshaw or Thornton Heath

 

What? We, Brexiteers, have come to the point when we want a clean no-deal Brexit BUT we are run from Brussels - every single aspect of our lives is run from Brussels - from 200 laws on how toothbrushes are made to our bus time tables, to where when and how many houses we may build, to what our farmers may grow, to our Military to our Trade deals made by the EU for the EU and so on - after nigh on 50 years of being run by a farway Empire it really is not so easy to untangle ourselves ie our old institutions and structures and common laws have been insidiously replaced by EU institutions and structures and coded/Roman laws - to untangle ourselves will take at least 10 years - at least - and restructure ourselves even longer. They own our utilities our railways our common land - they are a bureaucratic dictatorship - make no mistake - a protection racket the Mafia and the Triad would be jealous of for they make the bloody laws too! May, I'll not be unkind, negotiated from a point of appeasement, a point of fear. Boris from a point of strength - courage - 'we shall leave with no-deal if you don't negotiate further. From where Boris's imperfect and flawed deal begins we can untangle ourselves gently without too much damage to either side. A brutal split would hurt both sides badly.

The BBC and the media is Remoan, as opposed to Remain - so there has been no honest dialogue in the public domain no honesty at all.

And then we have Parliament! Because of the Fixed term Act 2011 - Cameron and Clegg - Gov must Govern for five years unless parliament agrees to a General Election. Because of May's unpopularity the Tories only have a minority Gov but Parliament, which is composed of mainly Remoaners; as opposed to the country which is composed of more and more and mainly Brexiteers, have refused Boris an Election forcing him to rule with a minority Brexit Gov.

In the old Lords sat the Law Lords - 10 years ago Blair dismissed them and replaced our safety valve, the Law lords, with his EU based Supreme Court. The judgements of which are not valid under common law and only have a fleeting resemblance to even EU law.

Bill of Rights 1689 Art 9 ''That the freedom of speech and debates or proceedings in Parliament ought not to be impeached or questioned in any court or place out of Parliament.''

The Speaker of the House should be neutral - Bercow has broken every rule of impartiality in the book!

Both the Speaker and many MPs have been colluding with the EU to keep us in. Bercow has also, against all conventions and our constitution, taken the Order Paper from the Gov and given it to the opposition who have so been able to bring in laws and amendments against the Gov and the wishes of the people.

Now ---- that is the end of this lesson time.

Ps there is no more need for a hard border in Ireland than there is on any Swiss border with the EU. For a short while NI will have a foot in both systems - until systems for a seamless border are in place - then it will be their decision what to do.

 

He appears not. How you know he is minority? He has a girlfriend in Denmark. People like you want that their relationship gets ripped apart? You guys are crazy.

 

Macron has already said there will be no extension - so has Junker. Farage is a politician who wants to step straight from Brussels into Parliament. We are grateful to him for the referendum BUT ............... he didn't get us Brexit where Boris will. People have never voted Nigel into Parliament - his is a split vote except perhaps in the North - where betrayed old Labour supports and Leave voters simply can't vote Tory but might vote Brexit.

 

No we don't. Europe and the EU are NOT the same thing! You seem to be rather uninformed if you think that they are.

Dear God are you trying to suppose that we all did not travel around Europe before the bloody EU?
Talk about indoctrination!

 

Or New Addington!

 

You demnd that she needs ato apply for a Visa like she would need to travel some shithole country to visit him. You demand that he needs a Visa to visit her.

She lives with him. You want kick her out (we speak about a danish girl, not one from Ethiopia). You demand that she goes to british embassy in Kopenhage to get a Visa. Wait few weeks and same counts for him.

And what for? So you can be Trumps bootlicker?

 

All European residence are applying for permanent residency now - why isn't she, if she lives with him? We all travelled, lived, studies in Europe long long before the EU and we travelled simply with a passport - Even in the event of a no-deal Brexit that is all they suggest - an up to date passport. https://www.gov.uk/guidance/passport-rules-for-travel-to-europe-after-brexit

So bull ****!

No, for our independence from a wicked, greedy, cruel, bureaucratic monster of an Empire.

 

Long before EU relationships between countries were rare. So you assume some Nazi style "SHOW YOUR PAPERS" at your border? You are Europe. I dont show my passport in Europe. You wantr be free from a bureaucratic empire by making evrything overly more bureaucratic? With all due respect but you dont make sense. Right now i can step into a train and drive all the way to London.

You want that i must show my passport, have to applay Visa and bullshit like that.

See this train in London? Its a Deutsche Bahn ICE. Right now i can step into a train in Frankfurt and drive directly to London. Will be impossible then.



I have some questions.

1: How do you intend to fight the anti german hate that you guys foster so much with your BREXIT? They even issued a travel warning here in Germany, that germans security is at risk. Your party makes anti german posters with racist slurs against Germans. How will you act against that?

2. The guy i know is anti Brexit. So is half of your country. They dont accept it that some freaks try to mingle so much into their life. To get your country back on track you wont be sucessful with 50% against your experiment. Whats your plan to unify the people? They are ripped apart. You think when you get it your way 100% they have to follow?

 

Leave voters voted leave because they/we have lived through the Hell imposed on us by the EU. That is it - no more no less. It would have made no difference what politicos said or didn't say we have been wanting this vote from the moment we realised ( well not me I saw what was coming) that the promises of 1972 were a downright and absolute lie. The EU did not save our mines, steel works, factories, mills as workers were promised it would. told by Guggenheim in 1975 that if we did not join workers would have no more jobs - it did the opposite for the European Coal and Steel Community ( in the Rome Treaty) was and is protectionist - Our thousand years old ( Saxon) local govs were made redundant by Service Directives so we are insidiously run from unnatural EU Regional powers who are instructed by Brussels - our utilities via fair trade Directives are plundered ditto our services - with I add the help of Thatcher our streets are now full of the homeless - unheard of before bar the itinerant - but we may not help them now - nope we may not even house our homeless - the municipalities explicit functions are illegal. Our common law legal system is morphing into Roman law ( guilty unless proved innocent )- we even have an EU Supreme Court imposed on us as the highest court in the land. Our welfare systems are deemed illegal - unfair trade and all that -

Nope - we did not vote for any sort of a politicos deal - we voted to Leave the European Union - basta. Cameron ran away - he should have repealed the 1972 Act and triggered Art 50 but he ran away = in came May who failed, of course she was meant to - now we are tired, winter is coming - and Boris managed to tweek May's deal into a mean but presentable state or No-deal which will hurt every one. Not that Brexiteers care much - we have been through worse - we just want our independence back - freedom to start again.

 

I thought you had got yourself a degree or at least were studying for one. Are you trying to tell me that all they taught you was that if a quote suits your personality it is from God and if someone has a different point of view to you they are thick or corrupt. The rest of what you say is beginning to make sense now if that is your orientation.

Of course they are without experience. Everyone is without experience until they get some. However in a world where the youth in general are not too hot on voting, giving them that opportunity when they are at school and can be taught how to ask the right questions and find information to make their decision, they stood to make a much more thoughtful and informed decision than most people who run around these forums.

What makes you feel so superior?

You said

I think you have a problem in that you believe if you think something then so does everyone else. Your need to express how pleased you would be if Scotland left the UK most certainly came over as you not liking Scotland along with you then adding the old long drawn out thing about Scotland getting more money, the old grievance by the far right 'Jock haters' and then when you suggest Nicola's husband is a 'peodo' you just let me know you will be on my ignore list very soon.

So you hate Nicola Sturgeon and would presumably given all your tales of traitors and blood be a danger to her. Be careful Alegorical fact, people sometimes feel the need to report posters who sound dangerous to the police.

I think what you are saying is that you belong to what
Hannah Arendt called in Germany in the 30's and what Paul Mason describes today "The temporary alliance of the Elite and the Mob."

 

MMMM Our train upholstery is made in Germany - wooden seats would be more comfortable - you own our railways and use the profit to keep yours so wonderful - which I agree they are. We who invented the railways - reduced to sitting on hard straight seats with overpriced tickets on trains that barely run! How dare you - you who run yours beautifully but purposefully and deliberately make sure ours almost unbearable to travel in.

2) By telling the truth of the victor's holocost lies, the truth of the horrors inflicted on Germans for daring to challenge the banks, after WWI and WWII, is how I do it and playing Mozart, Bach and Beethoven and so on. I am quite fond of Steiner's three fold commonwealth as a concept too. I am not a Party - Most leave voters but not, by any means, all were working class Labour party members ---- not anymore. Corbyn was all ways a true anti EUer - until now - funny eh?

3) Untrue more people have come over to the leave side since the referendum. Most Remoaners do not work - remain voters may but not remoaners and they live in Southern and Western Cities which they rarely leave for Britain only for hols abroad.- not in the Country at large.

 

I find it entertaining that Corbin does not want to accept new elections for the fear of Boris winning real majority and you people believe that new referendum will result in remain vote?
Things don’t seem to add up here.
If the political leaders on the left truly believed they would get a majority they would have done elections by now. The fact that they won’t means that in general elections Boris is going to come back with true majority and that the referendum would result in leave vote.

What’s the point of Brexit extension? It seems to be inevitable.

 

You cant know how many are for leave until new referendum

 

I am in my last year, fourth, of law, having had to defer for personal reasons last year. It is a well know quote attributed to all sorts of people - Were you expecting that I write an academic paper for and in here? Rhetorical ........

I am not superior. I am merely older and wiser ( which ain't my fault but my mothers and fathers and a Brighton B&B) - to even bother to press the point here. 16 yr olds are only ever given the vote to cache in on their naivety - which in my book is immoral.

What I said is a running joke. multilayered even ----------- ahh but so sorry, I forgot, the English sense of humour is illegal under the CPS's made up hate laws now isn't it? tsk tsk .

Look if you Love Sturgeon good luck to you - she is not popular in Britain, over exposure one suspects, not even in Scotland anymore --- but fine - for someone who hasn't had her pushed down their throats for years on end - fine you vote of her then. Te EU told her to piss off when she asked about joining as an independent Scotland --- but she got her referendum - didn't like the result - so wants another one. It is the wrong time as well as far to late in the day, I suspect, for any nation of the Union to successfully split from the whole. She is desperate because she has failed and is just playing the same old record. No I don't like her, as far as one can like or dislike a person one doesn't know, - and I remember her from way way back when she was a self satisfied frump with brown hair and a terrible haircut.

I am saying what most of Britain is saying - Parliament is Remoaner ( as opposed to remain) and is holding the Gov hostage in Parliament with a minority Brexit Gov - many have been committing treason, they have ripping up our constitution and Parliamentary conventions in order to foil the peoples vote which under oath and by manifiesto they promised to uphold.

When, if ever, we are allowed a General Election - just watch how they fall.

 

Is this some kind of "Islamic" logic?

Imagine Hillary Clinton saying: "Yeah, we know Donald Trump won the elections but he is not to be President because it was very close to 50/50 and we don't like the election results. It should have been us."
Or a guy that is sentenced saying "nah, I don't feel like going in jail, screw that court decision, I'm outta here".

You think rejecting a democratic decision is legit and won't be met with force? Think again.

 

I am relaying what is happening - Parliament is full of Remoaners who are trying to thwart Brexit by often illegal means - to stay in the EU. The EU is a lovey cushy job after Westminster for many a 'loyal' MP! Don't try twisting our wish to suit your uninterested parties argument.

It was a ps because I reread your post after I had answered some of it - and added that important point just so.

It was actually May's fault that the border was ever mentioned - The EU offered her a Canada style deal and she turned it down.

''find an answer to an Irish question only to find that they have changed the question'' The DUP will be fine. Sinn Fein never say anything - Ireland will be ok.