The US needs a United Labor Party.

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Sackeshi, Oct 21, 2019.

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Would you support this party.

  1. Economically yes

    1 vote(s)
    11.1%
  2. Economically no

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. Socially yes

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  4. Socially no

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  5. Voting yes

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  6. Voting no

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  7. Yes

    4 vote(s)
    44.4%
  8. No

    4 vote(s)
    44.4%
  1. Sackeshi

    Sackeshi Well-Known Member

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    Base- Made up of the non voters, go find out who is not voting in these elections (the over 1/3) and simply convince them that they might as well vote for us to unhinge the 2 party system.

    Economics- Creation of government backed super unions one for each industry that set the requirement such as a minimum of 6 months paid leave for the mother and 6 for the father after having a baby. Minimum wage of 15 tied to inflation. 2 weeks paid vacation and 2 weeks paid sick leave. Mandatory day off to vote and health insurance.

    Blacklisting of all employers who do not offer such benefits and withholding of workers from said companies (Small businesses get a break)

    Having applications get filtered though the union before being passed on to union members so that bad applications can be thrown out forcing jobs to cave.

    Banning stock buy backs

    Capping the salary of the CEO to 10 times the lowest earning employee.

    Unions operate across state lines and with disregard for the separation of states

    Social-
    Open borders, enforcement of labor standards regardless of nationality or status. Universal higher education and Universal healthcare. Basically neutral on everything else, the different factions can fight over social policy.

    Voting- Support for ranked choice voting and proportional voting for state legislatures. Support for an amendment to do away with legislative districts for the house and make it a proportional election with each party getting its share of the 1000 seats depending on the percentage of the vote won.

    Support for automatic voter registration.
     
  2. jcarlilesiu

    jcarlilesiu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Have you ever owned a business?
     
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  3. Sackeshi

    Sackeshi Well-Known Member

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    no
     
  4. jcarlilesiu

    jcarlilesiu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    So... you want to give everybody in the country a month off with pay, not to mention an additional 6 months off if they have a child. And you don't need a full day off to vote. That can be done in 30 minutes before or after work or on a lunch break.

    And who exactly controls and monitors this "blacklist"? Isn't that already done with employees knowing who is not good to work for, or better, can't people just quit if their employer doesn't align with their expectations?

    What?

    Why?

    So the CEO of a company that offers employees $15 an hour can only make $312,000? Nobody would take that job.

    Why are you so opposed to the idea of competitive states and the competitive labor market? You want to give a monopoly to the government and don't see the opportunity for abuse? Really?

    *Rolls eyes*

    Why should anybody else pay for you simply for breathing?

    Another... get rid of the electoral college advocate

    People are too lazy to register, but their vote counts.


    I would be willing to be a trillion dollars you're a millennial./
     
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  5. jcarlilesiu

    jcarlilesiu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Clearly.
     
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  6. Sackeshi

    Sackeshi Well-Known Member

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    Yes because that is a minimum of what every country in Europe offers.
    The elected union leaders. The union members elect union reps who serve on a "Labor legislature" and elect a labor executive. Both of which together vet companies/employers.
    If a new position opens up and a business needs employees, they must send the application to the Union governing body, and they must approve it before it gets sent to the relevant union members.
    Because its allowed manipulation of stocks, during the 40 years they were banned waged rose with productivity. After Ronald **** you Reagan legalised them again waged stagnated.
    If you can afford to pay yourself millions you can afford higher wages. Simple as that, it is the way it was basically during the 40 years of the FDR economy.
    I should say government funded. The labor market is not competitive, there are to many workers. For it to be competitive you need less workers than jobs available. Unified labor is the only way to force better benefits and better pay.
    No one is saying that. Simply saying, if you violate labor laws, you will be punished and the illegal will be set free. To you know stop the explotation of illegals that hurts all labor.
    Nope never said that, I said allowing people to vote for the party they want instead of which party of the big to they hate the least. If you have 1000 seats that means for every 0.1% of the vote a party gets that is one seat they get to fill. Parties get to control their own internal nomination process no open primaries and the voters get to decide which platform they want to vote for. It does nothing to affect the presidency.
    It is the only way to stop the obvious red tape that states put up to discourage people to sign up. If you have to take more than 1 day to register its undue burden.
    Yes I am.
     
  7. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    I thought @Sackeshi was leaving the country? Why worry about a new political party in the US?
     
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  8. Thedimon

    Thedimon Well-Known Member

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    Nobody would want to run your company. They’ll just move to their countries.
     
  9. Sackeshi

    Sackeshi Well-Known Member

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    They won't get any better deals in any other free nation.
     
  10. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    How old are you, if you don't mind my asking?
     
  11. Sackeshi

    Sackeshi Well-Known Member

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  12. Thedimon

    Thedimon Well-Known Member

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    So, a small restaurant owner would have to go to a union to hire a dishwasher or a waiter?
    This plan would only leave giant corporations in business.
    Small and medium size employers would disappear.

    CEO is not an owner.
    How do you expect a company to retain talented managers? With top salary of $312k they will run to other countries as soon as opportunities open up.
    Considering that with your plan above only large businesses will remain, these corporations will end up being managed by people who cant get a better deal overseas.

    You do realize that your plan would cause huge unemployment those who are lucky to get a union job will be doing well, but those who lose jobs will have a very tough time finding new employment as labor market is artificially severely restricted.

    Horrible idea. Some countries practice this and this system breeds corruption - parties will be able to literally sell seats in parliament. Also, what if you like the party but they appoint some crook to represent you? Party bosses will become extremely powerful.

    In sum, your plan is horrible. It will result in very high unemployment, brain drain and the rise of the oligarchy as the party bosses will yield incredible amount of power almost totally unchecked. The wages for those employed will be high, but prices will increase substantially which will result in unemployment resulting in homelessness as people won’t be able to afford anything.

    If you want party and union committees deciding people’s lives I suggest you to visit North Korea to see how the implementation of such system works out for average folk there.
     
  13. Thedimon

    Thedimon Well-Known Member

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    Oh, you hope to project this on all Europe and Asia?
    Even in Russia CEOs get paid more than what you suggest.
     
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  14. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    Well that explains it. You're still years away from experiencing any of the financial pressures of adult life. Career instability, children, education, mortages, cars, home maintainence, ensuring you'll survive your retirement, etc etc etc.

    Let's see how you feel about 'open borders' when you have all the above to worry about. I would bet both your legs that you'll feel differently. And if you don't, it just means you grew older but not wiser.

    Put that good and abundant youthful zest for 'justice' to good use. Go do charity work. Because that's what actually counts.
     
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2019
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  15. Sackeshi

    Sackeshi Well-Known Member

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    This would only apply to businesses (including all chains or different buildings) that have more than 100 employees. Small business and family business are not independant
    It is not the top, it is the top if they pay the minimum $15 wage, if they are doing well they will raise everyone's pay including their own. It is to tie labor to profit. Also you realize the top countries and freest in Europe are basically run by the unions. So much so that they have higher average pay than nations with minimum wages.
    Well businesses that refuse to work with the union will find themselves going out of business and then the union will replace those jobs by starting up businesses in their place.
    We can have rules against such things, no one can pay more than $10,000 to any party during their election. Also cap businesses would be banned from using business profits in campaigns. Most free countries don't have the joke of a primary system that we have in the US. Have strict rules to run and have strict punishments for violations.

    Yes, start up "sister parties" in other nations, it would have to be a "global revolution" a world run by labor.
     
  16. Thedimon

    Thedimon Well-Known Member

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    There are sales people who earn over $300,000.
    So, let’s say they company has 1,000 employees earning $15 each and a see earning $150/h or around $300k (rounded).
    So, in order to double the salary of the CEO so that he/she doesn’t run away to Japan, Germany or Russia you give those 1,000 people a $15/hr raise. That would translate to additional payroll cost of $31,200,000.
    Good luck with new CEO, because the old one left the country. ;)

    Unions starting businesses?
    Good laugh!

    You want to create rules for the few people who run a few political parties? You mean, you think you can force those 6-7 people who are more powerful than the president to legislate and execute laws to keep them in check?
    LOL
    You will have opposite effect - those people will be able to write laws that would shield them and give them even greater power.

    Very naive.
    OK, what happens if sister parties fail in other countries?
     
  17. Sackeshi

    Sackeshi Well-Known Member

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    Yeah because its so easy to just go become CEO somewhere else lol. Tying the lowest wage to the highest wage, means everyone gets a raise at once. Who finds 300K a small salary?

    Indeed, no reason why they could not start a business. Once the businesses realize they can't beat the union they will simply give up and start paying people fairly instead of lining their pockets.

    When parties are voted based on proportions they will behave. Corrupt parties will be thrown out, just like in countries that don't have FPTP.

    Then oh well, although I am sure if they see ULP take over in one country and greatly improve the standard of life, other countries will follow.


    You seem to think anyone will give a **** about greedy clowns leaving the country. Simply force anyone who tries to leave who has over 10M pay a 90% tax before unlocking their passport.
     
  18. xwsmithx

    xwsmithx Well-Known Member

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    What is this, the 1920s? No one needs a labor party anymore.

    You being a millennial, I don't know if you've heard of this thing called "capitalism". The basic principle is that any two people are free to exchange any two goods, services, cash, or cash equivalent that you both mutually agree to, without any interference from the government. In this way, companies that produce goods at low cost do better than companies that produce goods at high cost and profit, making money for the employees, managers, and owners of the companies. In the labor market, you as an employer are free to hire whoever you want at whatever price you're willing to pay. You as an employee are free to work for whoever you want at whatever price you're willing to take. Any interference in this system drives up the costs for the employer and drives down the number of jobs available for the employee. Please note that in a free market system, the employer is not obligated to give you a job and the employee is not entitled to make any particular wage. The company exists to make a profit for its owners. It does not exist to give jobs to entitled brats who think they should have one. It does not exist to give $15 an hour wages, six MONTHS? of parental leave, or paid health insurance. All of these things you think a company should do are mandated in many countries in Europe, and those countries have the lowest rates of economic growth in the world as a result. Only countries with outright socialist or communist systems do worse. Capitalism is the economic engine of the world, but it can only work when government stays the **** out of the way.
     
  19. Thedimon

    Thedimon Well-Known Member

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    Anyone who gets offered $301k.

    There is more to business than just labor force. Unions consist of people who want financial safety. Business is about risk taking. No union will be able to create new businesses because employees are there to do an 8 hour day and get paid for it.
    90% of startups have owners working overtime and losing their investments. Only a few succeed.
    No union employee would be willing to risk a nice cushy job for the risk of losing not just income, but also personal assets and bankruptcy.

    You seem to think CEOs are greedy clowns. It can be explained by your young age, as no one would let you get close to one.
    CEOs tend to work overtime, they are on the phone 24/7, always travel and have virtually no personal life. If a unionized employee screws something up bad enough, it will be the CEO who gets roasted by the board. CEOs have talent for sales, operations and finance.
    Very few can do this job successfully. That’s why they get paid so much. Finding a smart and experienced CEO is a major challenge and because they are so intelligent they are in high demand everywhere on the planet. You restrict their pay and entire economy will be ruined. To you they are greedy clowns, but without them companies cannot run their day to day operations.

    Grow up, and instead of seeking free sh!t from the government, go get yourself meaningful education and earn your own money! You obviously understand very little of the subject you started.
     
  20. Sackeshi

    Sackeshi Well-Known Member

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    Okay fine, no cap on CEO pay but a cap on a company or its executives buying stocks from shareholders. No stock buybacks. Make the ten fold teather apply to owners of the business.
     
  21. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    All of Which is why people under thirty have astronomical unemployment rates, and Europeans are slowly being replaced By Muslims.

    As for the voting stuff Not interested in suffering under the tyranny of those who would vote themselves money from some one else's purse.
     
  22. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    Why are stock buybacks bad?
     
  23. Sackeshi

    Sackeshi Well-Known Member

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    because they manipulate the markets.
     
  24. bradt93

    bradt93 Well-Known Member

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    Go back to playing video games son.
     
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  25. ArchStanton

    ArchStanton Banned

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    I take your former liberal professors and CNN have done a fine job of indoctrination. One day you'll find out about the real world and realize you've been brain washed.
     

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