We Were "This Close" Says Iran

So shallow. Technological advancement has doubled lifetime expectancies. It's more than watching TV.

I'm waiting for the name of a country that has done more for the world over the last 100 or 200 years.

 

LOL, you’re the one whose constantly referring to the material success of America! You can’t get more shallow than that....

 

As I said, technology has doubled life expectancy over the last 100 years. It's brought billions of people out of poverty. Don't knock it. Perhaps you prefer to go back to the days of serfs.

 

That’s not the point, as no one is knocking technology. It’s just that you seem to think that greater technology equates to an overall better quality of life, as if humans are just material beings who think solely in material terms. However, with all the suicides and drug-overdoses that occur in America, there is clearly a malaise that technology cannot fix.

 

Yeah. What he means is, we were THIS CLOSE... to being OBLITERATED from the face of the planet!

 

Shut up - it matters not which one is which - and Generals often act as diplomats - such as in this case ... given who this man is to the Iranian people -

I have trouble continuing from here this is so mind blowingly simpletonish. Like explaining semantics to a kindergarten class.

The above is coherent - albeit not informed . and you missed/avoided some of the main points made in my post.

So your argument is that when someone has committed terrorist actions and brags about killing the enemy - this is justification for assassination. Got it.

How many US Generals - Diplomats - Leaders - in the US should be killed on this basis ?

 

Saddam is one example of which there are many - of the kind of Scum that the Reagan admin was supporting.

 

Technological advances didn't start with America and don't end it with it either. All human progress builds on what has been learned from past generations and on top of what has been done previously.

Iran, in any case, has no issues with technological progress nor is that the reason why Iran opposed US hegemonic policies in the region. I personally have a problem with the lies, propaganda, and the overall lesson that some like to teach about what is "right". I am not a fan of the idea that "might makes right", but I have more respect even for that idea (which I would still reject) than the one that proclaims (either explicitly or by implication in the conduct I see regarding Iran) that the 'ends justify the means', especially when those "means" are focused so much on lying constantly. About propaganda constantly.

The price of that won't be paid just by the 'enemy de jour' of America, but within America and by America itself. Promoting lies, liars and propaganda involves a lot more than many of you imagine. It is what has corrupted American politics almost beyond repair.

 

I like to add the following to what I said in my last post:

While America has always had huge and unmistakable warts which it has carried throughout its relatively short history as a nation, it has also had some great ideas and some very strong points to its credit. Which side of America prevails within America will have a lot to say on whether America will ultimately be seen as having been a force for good or evil?

The founders of the American experiment, and the framers of the American constitution, for instance, were wise men. Even today, there is much to learn from them and the vision they espoused on many issues. Learning from them doesn't mean becoming dogmatic and imagining their 'solutions' for everything applies to everyone else in every other situation. Many of the 'solutions' they found came from the 'give and take' within America society and the competing forces within it during their time. But as 'lawyers' and people who were trained to use reason, logic, and knowledge, to find the right balance between these competing voices, what they focused on and crafted was devoid of the kind of 'dogmatic' approach that many of those who are now claiming their mantle are following.

On the other hand, America, built on a vast and rich landscape that was already occupied (albeit relatively sparsely and not by an equally advanced civilization), began with warts in trying to justify taking lands from native Americans and claiming as their own. That process inevitably involves dehumanizing and lying about those who you are trying to dispossess of their lands. And, at the same time, with even greater force and resonance, was the lies, propaganda, and ideology that became embedded within the American political culture to justify the institution of slavery and the racism it entailed.

Finally, while America prides itself as a "nation under God", and even though one of the biggest accomplishments of the Enlightenment period in Western civilization has been about distancing knowledge from religious dogma and towards reason (which is the 'good' part of secularization of western societies), ultimately not just America but Western civilization has not found a ready answer to the kind of forces which are unleashed once you ease religious dogma and fail it substitute a coherent ideology of what makes right. That process inevitably leads to other forms of dogma, to fascism, to racism, imperialism and the like. I say inevitably because the liberal humanistic tradition in the West, which is laudable in some of its forms, cannot withstand the logic of rampant materialistic self-interest, of the 'ego' run amock, of the instinct to control. of the kind of selfish and self-centered 'logic' of which Trump is a perfect specimen. Once people believe that the only real "good" comes from 'material advancement', from 'power and wealth', and the rest are all tales and nothing more, then within each society, as the old restrictions arising from the better parts of 'religion' fade (or as they are directed towards its most dogmatic and hateful aspects), the competition will be for each individual to cross each and every line to finish "first". It won't be just about each 'country' competing to finish first without regard to any real 'moral' restriction or limitation, within each country, the same dynamic will apply.

Under this dynamic, the US will not last as a major superpower resembling anything that (the best) of its ideology might proclaim. And that is the dynamic whose full force and effect will reveal itself even more clearly in each passing decade, until and unless America is restrained.

 

Is this the flirt zone ?

 

Its a great image - Nice that they let the Guards and the Inmates play BDSM games.

Too bad we don't have images of the really nasty stuff - Extraordinary Rendition - Some we sent to our friend Assad - for questioning Many whom turned out to be innocent as the net went very wide.

 

You can't claim to be America's enemy, actively fight it in various arenas AND build Nuclear capability....it got nothing to do with being nice or imperialistic, its common sense, America is too strong to be played like that.

EDIT: or you can just wait for democratic president like I suggested....

 

The "justification" was the attack on the oil refinery and the Iraqi base killing an American, they thought to skip around the arena taking small bites off the giant, surfing the casus beli without crossing it, well the giant ended that game, Solimani was many things but he was targeted for being a threat, a well known dancer of the arena, some say he developed his own dancing style....

 

There are suicides all over the world. Don’t imply it’s unique to America.

I’m still waiting for the name of the country that has done more for humanity over the last 100-200 years. China? Russia? Nigeria? Laos?

 

You need to tell us all the things you have done which you believe are so good measured against all the things you have done which were so bad so that we can come to our decision.

 

How idiotic. Learn some history.

 

I never implied it. However, when all that America exports is rooted in materialism, vice, and the almighty dollar; the consequences is human suffering on a level that people like you prefer to ignore.

Iceland. We have them to thank for the purest water on earth, and I encourage everyone to buy a bottle of Icelandic water.

 

You certainly can if you think that you’re on a divine mission. Just ask the Jews.

 

Well clearly you do not believe you can mention anything that would make it appear that the US has given the most to the world nor do you know anything about history as you are incapable of giving any answer but abuse.

 

The U.S. won three world wars against evil ideologies coming from Europe.

We’ve promoted capitalism throughout the world, lifting BILLIONS of people out of poverty.

The U.S. gave the world the electric light, the telephone, the internet, and the mass production of automobiles.

We’ve given the world much of its culture and technology, and advancements in medicine.

The list of our contributions is endless. And how does one poster respond? With a picture of a man on a leash?!?

I’m still waiting for someone to give me the name of a country that has given more to the world over the last century. Zimbabwe? Pakistan? Portugal?

 

as far as Nazism is, the US could have gone either way. Many US Corporations worked with the Nazis. I was hearing last night that some of them managed to get compensation from the US destroying them in Europe while they were working for the Nazis.

Apart from that the US and the UK did many things which would have had them hanging on the end of the rope had they lost.

and in particular the US demanded such a hard settlement from the German's after WW1 that many people believe that was a major cause for WW2.

Capitalism as it is running now believes in allowing the richest to take everything and that if anyone does not make it tough luck - they can die. Even people in my own country are now dying of hunger thanks to your capitalism and its destruction of Social Democracy which is the time when the standard of living and social mobility grew.

Capitalism is greed is good and do not think of the person in poverty - it is all their own fault. It is authoritarianism by the 0.1% and goodbye to Democracy. In this the US has been extremely hypocritical destroying countries demanding they become democratic when it is not even so itself.

It has destroyed countries all over Latin America supporting the most ruthless dictators who have acted in the most inhumane way to the people because it wants them to give them, the US, their resources. That is your capitalism working again, destroying people for its own ends.

The US has destroyed the ME firstly for control of oil and secondly in order that the CZ's in Government can enjoy rapture and Armageddon. This is destruction of the world. All of this counts as bad points against the USA.

 

Generals have always been targets. Yamamoto in WWII is just one example. You need to read a bit of history and how military leaders have always been targets.

This scum bag was not acting as a diplomat. He was organizing terror attacks. His death was a huge win.

As far as me shutting up, no.

Yes, if you openly plot attacks against Americans and then boast about it you forfeit your life. I’ve no ideal how you think we should respond to such actions but why do i imagine it involves a conversations and a hug....

 

Typical lefty views. Everything is the fault of someone else.

Hell even blame the invasion of Poland in 39 on the U.S. The European powers dictated the terms of surrender of Germany, not the U.S.

The Middle East was not destroyed by the U.S., those folks have been at war with each other 5 times longer than the U.S. has existed as a country. You might want to consider the impact that crap has had on the Middle East and it’s development.

 

Perceptions about America, and its role in the world, are the subject of numerous polls and those polls speak for themselves. Lets just say that outside a select few countries, the US is hardly seen the same way some (even then, not nearly all) of the partisan American voices who like to beat their chest, and sing its praise here, see it. Elsewhere, in places where America's role has been nothing but disastrous and destructive, the perceptions about it are obviously even worse.

But to go back to the subject of this thread, I want to re-post the article from over a month ago based on the comments of the commander of the Al Asad air base and highlight some of the comments he made to ask a few simple questions. Questions which should shed light on a lot of points that lead to constant discussions between me and some of the posters in threads such as this one.

https://www.spacedaily.com/reports/...le_Irans_missile_attack_on_Iraq_base_999.html
'Surviving was a miracle': Iran's missile attack on Iraq base
By Maya Gebeily
Ain Al-Asad Air Base, Iraq (AFP) Jan 13, 2020

The Questions:

1- Why would the US suffer serious damage to its largest base in the region, risk casualties and fatalities to its servicemen (loss of life and limb avoided by 'sheer luck', but with over 109 servicemen injured and suffering from TBI), and sit and do nothing (a) to take out or otherwise prevent the launch of the Iranian missiles, before they were launched, when it was telling its soldiers to hide in their bunkers, (b) attack and try to take out the launch sites during each "wave" of those launches and (c) not respond by firing even a single bullet or shot at any of the launch sites even after the attacks had concluded?

The first 'justification' offered by the Trump administration for the assassination of General Soleimani was that he was 'planning' attacks against US forces. Iran was 'planning' an attack against the US openly after his assassination. It went through and conducted the attack. At no point did the US even risk anything by even sending a bullet in Iran's direction.

2- How can American servicemen, even those serving in command of America's largest base in a country neighboring Iran, be so ill informed about Iran and its capabilities?

 

He was such a hero, sniff, sniff and now he's a martyr. Nothing but virgins and beer from now on fore him.