Evidence for The Creator: Entropy

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by usfan, Mar 13, 2020.

  1. yguy

    yguy Well-Known Member

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    No, I also have his own words, as quoted by you, which clearly indicate to anyone with a lick of sense that he's an idiot.
     
  2. Paul7

    Paul7 Well-Known Member

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    You haven't heard of the Big Bang?
     
  3. Paul7

    Paul7 Well-Known Member

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    "Georges Lemaître first noted in 1927 that an expanding universe could be traced back in time to an originating single point, calling his theory that of the "primeval atom". For much of the rest of the 20th century scientific community was divided between supporters of the Big Bang and the rival Steady-state model, but a wide range of empirical evidence has strongly favored the Big Bang, which is now universally accepted."

    Wikipedia

    Nonsense, there are libraries written on the existence of God. If would be more honest to say you disagree with the arguments, if you've even read them.
     
  4. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    You haven't heard of the Singularity?
     
  5. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    Appeal to Bandwagon fallacy duly noted FTR.
     
  6. Paul7

    Paul7 Well-Known Member

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    It is ludicrous not to say dishonest to say there is no evidence for God.
     
  7. rahl

    rahl Banned

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    ok? nowhere in there is an assertion or claim stating the universe "began". Only that it expanded.

    no, there are fictional books. I have just as much evidence that Zuess exists, or Sauron, as you do that your god exists.
    I've read them, and refuted them. You are making unsupported assertions regarding the universe, and the existence of your god. You can't substantiate either.
     
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  8. edthecynic

    edthecynic Well-Known Member

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    So after YOU claimed YOU quoted Adams, now you finally admit YOU lied.
    Thank you, YOU have NO credibility!!!!
     
  9. Paul7

    Paul7 Well-Known Member

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    The Big Bang was the beginning, obviously. Do you think the universe was there before that?

    You obviously haven't read them to make a crazy statement like that. Does anyone claim the last two exist?

    I can't *prove* my position, and you can't *prove* yours, I just think given the evidence my world view is more likely true than not.
     
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  10. yguy

    yguy Well-Known Member

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    Lol, right neighborly of you to trumpet your desperation, you betcha.

    Those in the peanut gallery may wonder why Mr. Ed hasn't asked how it follows from Mr. Adams' quote - which I naturally assumed was accurately requoted by my adversary - that Mr. Adams is an idiot. He doesn't ask because he's afraid of the answer.

    8)
     
  11. edthecynic

    edthecynic Well-Known Member

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    Post this quote YOU say makes Adams an idiot rather than YOU!
     
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  12. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    No, it is FACTUAL to state that there is zero credible evidence for the existence of your imaginary god.
     
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  13. rahl

    rahl Banned

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    the big bang is the expansion of the universe. We do not know what came before it.


    irrelevant. the evidence is the same for zuess, sauron, Dumbledore and your god.


    how do you come to that conclusion, when you have exactly zero evidence to support the existence of your god?
     
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  14. yguy

    yguy Well-Known Member

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    You're welcome.
     
  15. edthecynic

    edthecynic Well-Known Member

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    That's NOT a quote!
    That was a link to an article that makes a fool of your tuned BS.
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2020
  16. yguy

    yguy Well-Known Member

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    Of course it is. I quoted you, presuming you were quoting Adams.
    As everyone can see, I quoted no link.
    which doesn't matter, because the quoted subtitle is spectacularly idiotic on its face.
    Of course I never said a damn thing about tuning, but obviously your desperation has you clutching at imaginary straws.
     
  17. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    There is concrete evidence going back to an incredibly short time after the big bang. So, that part has been worked out using evidence and a concrete decision making process.

    There is essentially no evidence from before that. Nobody can claim it is "obvious" what happened before the earliest time from which we have information. And, that earlies information comes from when the big bang was already in progress - not from the "very beginning" of this universe, let alone the environment in which this universe got its start.

    As for deciding if a religion is "true", there is no such decision making methodology. One can't pick two religions and use a commonly held decision making methodology to decide which one is more likely.

    The problem with religion isn't "religion v science". It's "religion v religion".
     
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  18. An Taibhse

    An Taibhse Well-Known Member

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    If we apply Einstein’s Theory, to talk about a before would be meaningless... time didn’t exist.

    If you want to touch on entropy, the beginning (if there was one) of the universe, beginning of life, possibility of extraterrestrial life, religion vs science, physics and philosophy, etc. the following discussion between Brian Greene (string theorist) and Richard Dawkins (the man the religious believers like to hate) might be of interest to some. Or just rejected out of hand without viewing by others because they have let others influence their biases.

    For those that think they understand Dawkins position they might be surprised. As for Greene, he leaves open the possibility of a creator but see how and why.
    For some... enjoy
     
  19. edthecynic

    edthecynic Well-Known Member

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    Yet another false statement!
    The very article you falsely claimed to be quoting mentions in the title "tuning," of corse, you dishonestly edited it out!!!
     
  20. yguy

    yguy Well-Known Member

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    Actually I've yet to make a false statement in this conversation. You, OTOH, have made more than I'll bother to count.
    As everyone can see, I never claimed to be quoting the article, though I did implicitly claim to be quoting from the article, which of course is precisely the case.
    Nothing dishonest about it, because all by itself, what I did quote justifies my assessment of Adams.
     
  21. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    It depends on what you consider to be evidence.
     
  22. edthecynic

    edthecynic Well-Known Member

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  23. yguy

    yguy Well-Known Member

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    None should be surprised by now that you find it convenient to omit the relevant context, so here it is:
    The referent of "it" was of course the underlined phrase, as the subtitle of the article is very specific indeed; so I guess you must be on about strike 12 by now.
     
  24. edthecynic

    edthecynic Well-Known Member

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    Only in your childlike mind!
     
  25. usfan

    usfan Banned

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    A godless universe of cold, lifeless matter, and eons of dissipated energy coursing endlessly through infinite space has no mechanism for order, or 'winding up' matter into a compatible condition for life, such as the earth's atmosphere.

    And, there is no mechanism to begin life, even if the right conditions were met. The amazing complexity and diversity of living things have no explanation for origins, in a dissipating universe of randomness and chaos. Only an intelligent Designer could have ordered life and the universe, overriding the principles of entropy, and 'winding up' the universe into the conditions for our existence.

    The conditions for life, and especially life itself, cannot be explained by random chance. We cannot replicate anything resembling life, under the most optimal conditions.. Yet it is alleged to have happened by chance? In a universe of chaos and dissipation?

    There is no mechanism to override entropy, to increase complexity in the genome, or 'create' new genes or traits, in living things. The theory of common ancestry is flawed in the most fundamental assumption:

    ..things can increase in order and complexity in a universe of entropy.


    Entropy functions in any system, open or closed. The micro system of our solar system is able to support life (constantly dissipating, devolving, and dying), in a micro system of sun warmed energy, infused into the earth's atmosphere. But this source is winding down, and will burn out, leaving the system cold, dead, and lifeless. That is entropy, in action.

    Something (or Someone), 'wound up' this system, and set the stars on fire, so light and heat could provide the very narrow window of conditions for life to survive. But it is winding down, like everything else in the universe. Entropy, as the overriding principle in the universe cannot be ignored or denied.

    If entropy must constantly and continuously increase, then the universe is remorselessly running down, thus setting a limit (a long one, to be sure) on the existence of humanity. To some human beings, this ultimate end poses itself almost as a threat to their personal immortality, or as a denial of the omnipotence of God. There is, therefore, a strong emotional urge to deny that entropy must increase. — Isaac Asimov
     

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