Navy And Media Questions

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Just A Man, Apr 3, 2020.

  1. Just A Man

    Just A Man Well-Known Member

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    I see the captain of the aircraft carrier that has a number of crewmen with the coronavirus has been fired. I thought it "odd" that the media reported the captain was pleading for help. The military has it's chain of command and this poor captain must have forgotten about it. I agree with his firing. But now I have several questions the media is failing to report on -- 1 Does the Navy or the media know how the ship became exposed? 2 Are there any other Navy ships that have a crew member with the virus?
     
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  2. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    He forgot nothing.

    His command was in jeopardy and he was getting no response. He had 5,000 men packed into a metal boat in which the virus was spreading.

    There were 100 confirmed cases and no possible way to "social distance"

    He sent a plea up the chain of command and when that got no response he "leaked" it to the media

    He knew his career was likely over at that point but he put his men ahead of his career.

    The guy's a friggin hero
     
  3. Capt Nice

    Capt Nice Well-Known Member

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    ^ winner!
     
  4. drluggit

    drluggit Well-Known Member

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    All good questions. I doubt anyone outside of the Navy actually knows the answers to any of them. Certainly the folks posting here don't. The official Navy reports say the Captain actually didn't notify the chain of command in his concerns, and likely there probably is an operational security reason for it. But speculating it isn't useful. Let us hope that the sailors and officers of the ship are getting proper attention and health care provided to them.
     
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  5. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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    This story is a sign of the mad times in which we live. POTUS pardons a war criminal like himself, and fires a man who stepped outside the chain of command for a matter of public health.
     
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  6. Yulee

    Yulee Well-Known Member

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    This why our armed forces do not win conflicts anymore. Piss poor leadership.
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2020
  7. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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    You are right about the poor leadership, but there is more to it than that.

    Since AUMF under Bush, the US has been fighting "regime change wars" as Tulsi Gabbard describes it. We have been involved in military actions that are in fact military aggression against countries that have done us no harm. You could say the same thing about Vietnam, long before AUMF.

    Our military is engaged in military imperialism, NOT defense of the country. Smedley Butler USMC pointed that out nearly a century ago.

    Our motives are greed and aggression, NOT defense of country.
     
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  8. God & Country

    God & Country Well-Known Member

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    Who knows but I'd like to think your scenario was true.
     
  9. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

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    Apparently the left doesn't understand how the military works. All he needed to do was pick up the phone and call his boss - presumably the fleet commander. He embarrassed the Navy and provided a completely wrong example to others on how to use the chain of command. He knew he would get relieved.
     
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  10. Just A Man

    Just A Man Well-Known Member

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    He hadn't learned much about the Navy in 20 years. I suspect he would be ticked if someone on the carrier went over his head. He has shown poor leadership skills. A carrier has doctors, dentists, hospital corpsmen and a sick bay (hospital). Put them to use Capt and talk to your immediate superior. His plan may have been to get relieved so he could get off the contaminated ship. He must be a democrat -- LOL
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2020
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  11. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The military tends to be very unforgiving because combat readiness is their number one mission. Anything that jeopardizes that will result in harsh discipline. We should not expect anything less. Most military commanders expect it. I have scene commanders removed for less.

    In order of priority, the mission comes first. His men become second and he becomes third.
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2020
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  12. FAW

    FAW Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    So you are theorizing that Trump personally is responsible for him being fired?
     
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  13. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    Dude.

    Keep up

    he went through the chain of command and got no response

    he sacrificed his career to protect his men

    He had to know his career was over and in truth, higher ups had no choice but to relieve him

    and this has nothing to do with Trump
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2020
  14. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

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    Then he needed to repeat going through the chain of command. He could call his boss daily with an update of infections and deaths. Going around the chain is a no no.
     
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  15. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    The guy sacrificed himself for his crew. He threw himself on the grenade.

    what part of that do you not get?

    that said ... the brass had no choice but to fire him but at least his men were protected
     
  16. Just A Man

    Just A Man Well-Known Member

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    In the military you can go over the head of your immediate superior but you need to request in writing and get written permission. If you don't do that then you are in trouble because of the military culture and protocol. Sounds to me like the guy is either a wuss, or arrogant, or he mentally flipped when the virus invaded his ship. Maybe he had MacArthur disease.
     
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  17. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

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    That isn't how the military works. He knew it when he did it. What part of that do you not get?
     
  18. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    No kidding.
    It was an extraordinary situation and he sacrificed himself for the good of his men.

    Sad that you don't get that
     
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  19. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    Guess I did huh?

    Go away now
     
  20. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

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    I get that. But in the military it gets you fired. You can't go over a superior's head without consequences. When you go over an admiral's head you are certain to get serious consequences and that is what happened. He would have done better to stay, take care of his sailors and pester his superiors for faster response. I feel sorry for the man but he did handle it incorrectly.
     
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  21. Facts-602

    Facts-602 Banned

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    I’m sure he was motivated by concern for his crew, but you don’t go outside the chain of command.
     
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  22. Just A Man

    Just A Man Well-Known Member

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    More to the story is slowly coming out.

    President Donald Trump said Saturday he backed the Navy’s decision to fire the commander of the aircraft carrier USS Theodore Roosevelt, Capt. Brett Crozier, “one hundred percent,” noting that the captain made a mistake when he stopped the ship in Vietnam for a port visit.


    “I don’t know much about it, I can only tell you this,” Trump began. “Here we have one of the greatest ships in the world — nuclear aircraft carrier, incredible ship with thousands and thousands of people, and you had about 120 that were infected.”

    Now, well I guess the captain stopped in Vietnam, people got off in Vietnam — perhaps you don’t do that in the middle of a pandemic or something that looked like it was going to be. History would say you don’t necessarily stop and let your sailors get off, number one.

    But more importantly, he wrote a letter. The letter was a five page letter from a captain and the letter was all over the place. That’s not appropriate, I don’t think that’s appropriate.”

    Acting Navy Secretary Thomas Modly announced on Thursday he was firing Crozier, after a memo he wrote to his superiors was leaked to his hometown paper San Francisco Chronicle.

    Modly said that Crozier did not share his concerns with his direct superior — who was on the ship — or him personally before sending the email via an unsecured and unclassified system, which assured its leak.
     
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  23. RodB

    RodB Well-Known Member Donor

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    A cardinal sin in the military and a necessity for successful military operations.
     
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  24. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    Wait...so in HINDSIGHT...Trump thinks that the captain should have taken the virus more seriously than HE did??
     
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  25. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The Captain was fired for giving a copy of a memo to the newspaper.
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2020
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