Tax the 1%...

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by dadoalex, May 18, 2020.

  1. Surfer Joe

    Surfer Joe Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Lol...probably more than trump.
     
  2. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    But that would mean quite a few unpleasantnesses:

    1) hard work
    2) sacrifice
    3) self-discipline
    4) missing out on funsies
    5) admitting that business builders aren't any more or less evil than people on minimum wage
    6) acknowledging the obscene inequity of redistribution
     
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  3. bringiton

    bringiton Well-Known Member

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    Fact.
    If they pay the privileged for permission.
    As long as they pay the privileged for permission.
    It's not all a choice, as I have proved to you repeatedly. Who chose to have their rights to liberty forcibly removed and given to the privileged, hmmmm?
     
  4. Oh Yeah

    Oh Yeah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Your right. Were too damn busy making a living and supporting our families we forget about the useless non-contributors to the system until we are reminded we are not paying our fair share. So if I am one of the useless contributors to society what is my fair share?
     
  5. bringiton

    bringiton Well-Known Member

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    Fact.
    Everyone has had their rights to liberty removed, not just the poor.
    So? In ancient Rome, there were slaves who rose to great wealth and status, including owning slaves of their own. That didn't mean they weren't still slaves. The fact that a given person may be strong enough to run a race while carrying someone else on their back does not mean that those who are not strong enough to do so are to blame for their inability to run the race.
    No it isn't, and there is nothing magical about it. When they chose to participate in evil by buying privileges, they stopped being the good guys, just like a slave who starts buying slaves.
     
  6. bringiton

    bringiton Well-Known Member

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    False. It has never been close to existing.
    Garbage. You have to pay a landowner full market value just for permission to access public education.
    As long as you pay a landowner for permission to access them.
    You only way you can choose not to be on the treadmill that powers the escalator of the privileged is to drop out of the economy and the community.
    But no one ever chose to have their rights to liberty forcibly removed and given to the privileged as their private property.
    Strawman fallacy.
     
  7. bringiton

    bringiton Well-Known Member

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    That is your policy, how you evade the fact that your beliefs are false and evil.
    False. I did not choose to have my rights to liberty forcibly stripped from me and given to the privileged as their private property, and no one else did, either.
    It is you who are perpetrating the illusion.
    There is government and the rich, greedy, privileged parasites it serves.
    You are a good example of that.
    Correct.
    We are all have-nots in the sense that our rights to liberty have been stripped from us and given to the privileged as their private property. But some of us ARE the privileged, and also get to own others' rights to liberty.
    I'm not.
    Privileged.
    No, they just owned my rights before I was even born.
    That is what slave owners told the abolitionists: "Just save up your money and buy some slaves of your own! Problem solved!"

    Can you find a willingness to understand why exhorting abolitionists to buy some slaves of their own was not responsive to their objections to slavery?
    I have started my own business. And while I did not get wealthy, let alone overnight, I did make a living for many years.
    Lots of people can't. The fact that a given individual might be strong enough to run a race while carrying someone else on their back does not mean those who are not strong enough are to blame for not being strong enough, or that there is nothing wrong with making them carry someone else.
    "Shut up and get back on the treadmill!"
    The way you are talking, I think I know what kind of businesses you started from scratch and got wealthy overnight with....
    But it won't be justice, will it?
     
  8. dadoalex

    dadoalex Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    If you're unable to participate in a serious conversation then don't.
     
  9. dadoalex

    dadoalex Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Why? What has my tax level to do with the proposition?

    My tax level (federal) is around 20%. About 8-10% more than the tax rates the 1% pay.

    Given the benefits the 1% derive from the economic, legal, and tax system a 1 time 10% tax is not unreasonable.
     
  10. Moi621

    Moi621 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I Am Typing Slowly To Aid Those Who Don't comprende. .. TAX LAWS
    Bipartisan tax reductions since JFK that amounted to
    Dinner & a Movie for us and the CREATION OF A NEW WEALTHY CLASS.

    Splitting the
    Middle Class into a
    Upper Middle Class
    and a Lower Middle Class.

    typing slower for the less . .. .

    EISENHOWER TAX CODE BUILT FREEWAYS!
    All tax cuts since have served the monied while working people
    live hardly better than welfare folks. An observation by the most

    Popular Ex President, Jimmy Carter.



    BIPARTISAN SELLING TAX REDUCTIONS HAS BEEN A FRAUD!



    Get It Or Not.


    I Remember the 40 hour week, holidays, vacation, sick GWTW
    And no more pension systems beyond social security. g'luck


    This is the result of all those :heart: tax reductions qualitatively I mean

    Enjoy the graphics.
    Then understand, We Need a Return to the Eisenhower Tax Code

    inequality-p25_averagehouseholdincom.png super-rich.gif inequality-page25_actualdistribwithlegend.png
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2020
  11. dadoalex

    dadoalex Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Thing 1: It's never a good idea to enter a conversation by insulting the participants. You didn't insult anyone in particular, just everyone. It immediately turns people off to whatever your arguments may be.
    Thing 2: Not responsive. This is not about any changes to the tax code or the results of previous changes. It is about implementing and using a 1 time tax.
     
  12. Oh Yeah

    Oh Yeah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Well you have taken 10% away from the rich and gave it to who? Let's say we have a landlord who owns an apartment building with 100 apartments and the building and land are worth 10 million. We take away $1 million and divide it up among the 100 renters that occupy the building. Each person is paying $2000 a month rent at present. The government tells us that we are looking out for your best interest so here is a check for $8000.00. (Would have been $10,000 but taxes you know. Uncle Sam always gets his first) The whole building is shaking from people jumping up and down with glee. The following week the mailman delivers notice that due to costs beyond his control that rents will increase !0% upon expiration of their present leases. Rents will also be raised 10% for the next 3 years. Year 1 $2200 a month, Year 2 $ 2420 a month 3 $2662 a month.

    Year 1 your rent has increased $2400.00 a year.
    Year 2 Your rent has increased$5040.00 a year over year 1
    Year 3 Your rent has increased $7944. 00 a year over year 1
    Total increase in rent for 3 yrs. $15,384.00
    Landlords increase in profit $538,400 $1,538400.00 minus $1,000,000.00 = $538,400.00

    Business are just like landlords, they are not going to just sit and take a 10% haircut. They will raise prices and within 3 years all those people who you say will be middle class will be back where they were. Poor class, middle class, rich class and obscene class is only a number. Even a society where everybody has a job or an income or a accumulation of wealth you still have a bell curve of the haves and have nots.

    I play the stock market and at the beginning of the year Boeing and Apple were my best stocks. Then came the crash. Boeing went from the pent house to the basement, Apple went from the mansion to middle upper class. Coronavirus came along and Cruise lines , casinos and energy stocks found therselves living on the streets. Now that things are getting better the dogs are the occupiers of the mansions and those that were prepared for hard times are sitting in the Penthouses. The lesson learned? This is America and you may be down and out today but tomorrow is coming and you still have opportunities to better your lot in life.
     
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  13. Oh Yeah

    Oh Yeah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I didn't start the fantasy. You did.
     
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  14. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    1) We all have to pay for what we want/need - whether via money or labour. But please let me know where I can find this special universe, in which that doesn't apply, because I'd like to move there.

    2) See above. No free lunches. Laws of physics pertain to this universe.

    3) Of course it is. We're born into First World democracies. Every adult who chooses to breed, first decides how they'll ensure their kids are financially secure. Building upon that considered (by choice) parental support, every child has access to free education, free libraries, and in many cases free healthcare. If parents choose not to exploit those incredible advantages - which are not available to those outside the First World - their child's future poverty is on them, no one else. Thankfully, kids who had the misfortune of being born to irresponsible and lazy parents, are still able to choose to make good despite that - though it will come a bit later and may be harder work. Like anything, it's harder to lean knew disciplines in adulthood than it is in childhood.

    4) Your 'privileged' is someone else's 'hard working, disciplined stayer'. Privilege comes in many forms .. from inherited money, to living on welfare without making the slightest effort to use that privilege for its intended purpose (as a leg-up and out of poverty).
     
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  15. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    Actually I've changed my mind. You go live in your magical universe where our laws of physics (cause and effect, etc) don't exist, and I'll take my chances here.

    Let us know how you get on in that wondrous place .. that Free Lunch Universe.
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2020
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  16. Moi621

    Moi621 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    My apologies. :rolleyes:
    As a child of the fifties when working people worried
    if their bonus would put them in a higher tax bracket
    Well expressed in "Mad Men".




    Rather than Taxing the 1%
    Consider the Eisenhower Tax Code!
     
  17. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

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    That's exactly what it will be. When all is merit (not race, not colour, not creed, not religion, not quality of parents, not beauty, etc), there is no fairer or more just system. Anything LESS than merit is unjust, because it rewards for accidentals and irrelevancies, and punishes for same - arbitrarily.

    You want justice? The communists have always had that right, even if nothing else. If you don't work, you don't eat.
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2020
  18. dadoalex

    dadoalex Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Thing 1: Go reread the OP. Apparently you missed some of the finer points and
    Thing 2: The valuation, just based on revenues, of your apartment is about $16,000,000;
    Thing 3: Your challenges have been answered. Read the thread.
     
  19. Robert E Allen

    Robert E Allen Banned

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    Fact any American can climb as high as their skills and work ethic will allow. There is no one holding anyone back.
     
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  20. Oh Yeah

    Oh Yeah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Apartment buildings are different values in different states. We just had a Doubletree that should have brought $11 million sell for $3 million. In New York it may have sold for 3 x that.

    I reread the thread and what finer point did I miss? Even with the money reinvested, and 5% is unrealistic at present, how does that help get anyone into a higher class when you will have higher inflation? Your idea is not new. We use to have a 90% tax rate on the rich and we had a massive amount of poverty. I would support a Value Added Tax. In that way those who consumed the most would pay the most. If we must have the socialist Social Security and Medicare then their would be no capped limit on how much one paid into the system but benefits also wouldn't be capped.
     
  21. EyesWideOpen

    EyesWideOpen Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yup. Only people like Biden and Schumer know best where to spend our money, since they are pure and untainted, having never had a real job outside of politics.

    The actual men and women who took the risks, developed the products and services to create a successful business, they sure as hell don't know what they are doing. Just ask the likes of Biden and Schumer, they'll tell you.
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2020
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  22. dadoalex

    dadoalex Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That the thread is not about how someone might respond to a tax. It is about a one time tax that ...

    5%? Amazon is up over 30% in 6 months. Pretty sure we can find someone to manage that'll get us 5%.

    We just pumped 3+ trillion dollars into an already heated economy. Where's the inflation?
     
  23. nra37922

    nra37922 Well-Known Member

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    Just a word about taxes.

    Why blame the ones who can take full advantage of the tax code as WRITTEN BY CONGRESS?
    Tax code to complex - BLAME CONGRESS.
    Tax code has to many loopholes - YUP BLAME CONGRESS

    If you want to tar and feather somebody then go after those ass-wipes.
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2020
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  24. Oh Yeah

    Oh Yeah Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I'm on the Amazon Train. Last year Apple 89% and two weeks ago I bought Penn Gaming and made 70%. I also had Boeing and Honeywell and lost my behind on them until recently. Democrats and some Republicans will oppose any form of money being in the stock market. After all they can't very well be anti corporation and support being invested in the market even though historically the return on capital has been 9% YOY. I'm not criticizing your OP but just pointing out IMO I don't think it is feasible due to human nature and what it is.
    More money will have to be pumped into the economy as unemployment is not going back to 3-4% anytime soon. Bankruptcy and mortgage forbearance ends soon which is more infusion by the Fed. Some say Gold $3000 - $5000 an once. I'm more realistic at $2000.00. I've been nibbling as I think the cost of things will drive prices and inflation up. My own food bill is up about 20% on a weekly basis now.
     
  25. Reiver

    Reiver Well-Known Member

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    This made me laugh. Its right wing economics that coerced the wedge between wage and productivity. People are less able to support their families because of it.

    So, the more important question, is why did right wingers allow it? Were they duped (i.e. They're easily herded) or is it a case of reverse altruism (i.e. They're genuinely worried that the rich fellow is overstretching by buying a second super yacht). Let me know ;)
     

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