If "Our Creator" endowed us with rights...

sorry first cited has no bearing on when it was first said.

If you like your head to remain on yoiur shoulders nothing Rothschild has ever done is put into the public!

Its a big club and you aint in it! -GC

 

The idea that income tax is illegal has long since been dispatched.

Remember that you proposed an income tax. And, your proposal was one that benefits the wealthy!

 

Thanks -

That was a clear presentation and I fully agree that most people seem not to know how serious it has gotten.

I agree that our tax system needs serious adjustment.

But, I don't believe that will directly help those in the bottom half, as they already don't get taxed. We need to identify and support features of our system that help individuals at the middle and bottom move up (collective bargaining, academic and vocational education, childcare, healthcare or whatever we find), and then seriously support those features.

And, allowing those in power to affect who votes is just not acceptable.

How many times do we have to demonstrate that hosing down the wealthy with money isn't what helps those living paycheck to paycheck?. Why would anyone think that a corporation has rights of citizenship?

 

Only those countries like the U.S. who give corporations more rights than people.

Everyone should be taxed, including the poor who do pay taxes on many things, as we speak, thanks to a regressive V A T or sales taxes on good.

A minimum income law built into the tax code would end poverty, and our economies would then be trickle up instead of trickle down, --- which is a better way for an economy to grow.

The lower incomes spend all their money, which is what an economy likes, while the rich do not and cannot spend enough to have the most dollars changing hands, which is what adds value to the economy.

Regards
DL

 

I do not agree with this as allowing our candidates to gain votes by capturing hearts and minds is what elections are all about.

Now if you mean the rich effecting us covertly, by buying their politicians, then we are on the same page.

Regards
DL

 

My "we don't tax them" comment was limited to income tax - which only about half the population pays.

You are right, of course, that those who don't pay that tax are still paying a good number of other taxes.

So, I agree with what you're saying in general. But, I havent seen anything that suggests we can make enough difference with our tax system to allow those in the middle class and below to move up.

Your vid showed that even the middle class has little to no budget for investment. And, data on retirement savings shows a disaster. I don't see a way for these people to move up that is as easy as reducing taxes on them. I'm in favor, but I doubt it is sufficient.

I'd sure read a cite on that, though. It would be outstanding if cutting tax on hourly wage earners (for exampe) was enough to make a real difference.

 

Today's federal level politicians have to spend a significant portion of their time from day 1 in fundraising in order to prepare for their next election. And, that money comes from the wealthy and corporations. Our system is AWASH in money, protected by the courts as "speech". REALLY bad news, obviously, if one is interested in having citizens have some sort of equal voice rather than being dominated by major corporations (who AREN'T people) and the wealthy who are allowed to make giant donations to campaigns.

Beyond that, our method of elections, based as it is on polling places, is easily manipulated by tricks such as gerrymandering, misallocation of equipment (leading to long lines in specific precincts), changing sites and sites that are difficult to travel to, ancient and easily hacked machines that have no paper trail, barriers to registration, limited voting hours requiring missed work for hourly workers (a poll tax), volunteer staffing that doesn't know the law, etc.

Look how Stacy Abrams lost her election. The candidate that beat her was the person in charge of the voting system in the state, using several well known tactics to seriously affect the outcome in HIS OWN election!

Beyond that, we have Washington DC where a population that is larger than two other states gets no congressional representation. In fact, their finaces are controled by the House - a pure case of taxation without representation. I think it would help working class America if Washington DC has as much representation as states smaller than it is.

The reason for the odd shape of Washington DC is that the federal government ceded part of DC back to Virginia in order for Virgina to be able to do the economic investment in its seaports - work the federal government just wasn't going to ever do. Why are Maryland and Washington DC blocked from similar investment opportunity? Congress.

 

CT nonsense

 

I support your Right to be wrong.

 

Keep telling that lie. Wasn't it Hitler that used that technique? Just saying...

 

Dude, You tell more lies than any politician on Capitol Hill. I proposed we go back to the time before the 16th Amendment was illegally ratified.

 

More ad hom. I have not ever lied to you.

As always, the question I ask is how you plan to fund state and federal government in a way that is more fair than income tax.

It's easy to complain about government. I mean, first of all I'm only 1/330,000,000th of the USA. So, not that many of my ideas get snapped up!!

We have to work toward reasonable solutions that have some sort of prayer of being acceptable to more than ourselves.

I suspect income tax is a bad place to start, as there really is NO chance of changing that - other than incremental changes to the parameters of the system - like tax brackets, decuctions, etc.

I'd rather work on reducing taxation without representation, upholding our standards of equality, making voting equally available to all, figuring out how to reduce the number being left behind in our economy, etc. These all share in our concept of rights and democracy.

But, feel free!

 

You’ll have to break this down for me. How was the 16th amendment illegally ratified? Please be specific.

 

And you follow it rigorously.

 

CE FACT you should have paid attention when I posted the court case where the judge spelled it out.

I think you meant the 14th.

The 16th was not enforced in the verbiage used, they enforced a different meaning than was stated, which is still fraud but I think that one was legally ratified IIRC.

Get rid of the 14th and the 16th falls like dominoes.

 

I stand corrected by me, my keyboard got ahead of me. Its been so long since I argued con law some of this stuff i starting to slip. Yeh if you have any good links so I can refresh my memory that would be way cool. I do remember something about volume or edition 43 in the IRS code that proves the point they way they are collecting taxes today is, well Ill just say wrong for the moment, its been to long.

 

An argument above between illusion and confusion: hard to tell the players

 

1) The truth is never an ad hominem

2) I responded to your question. We fund government the same we did in the first 150 years of its existence. The thing about the income tax is that it does not pay for the illegal interest on the federal debt nor the army of bureaucrats required to collect and disburse the funds. So, if you looked at that LONG list of other taxes, you don't need an income tax. You need to downsize government

3) I agree that we need reasonable solutions. It appears that you already have decided that some things won't work. In reality, before the right wing came along with that part that morphed into the alt right and MAGA crowd, we had the war pretty much won. People were reclaiming their Preamble status as Americans; with the Fair Tax on the table, it opened up a major discussion as to the legality and validity of the income tax (which is why I left that link - we can repeat it again.) The right, with their obsession over immigration, destroyed nearly 50 years of work and progress by the patriot and constitutionalist movement (for lack of a more descriptive adjective) with their POLICE STATE agenda

4) Since I do not believe in democracy (our Constitution guarantees us a REPUBLIC) you and I have very little in common when it comes to finding the right solution

5) Misrepresenting my position and feeding off your own misrepresentations and straw man arguments is dishonest... if that isn't lying, there isn't a cow in the whole state of Texas.

 

See my previous post for the link. That is your response.

 

Forced to follow it only because you continue to employ it. Unlike you, I don't practice it and don't expect to try and fool others by using it the way you do.

 

I have left a link a couple of times regarding the 16th Amendment. It's a bit more complicated than the 14th. The 14th was illegally ratified AND on false pretenses. See these for the 14th Amendment:

https://constitution.org/14ll/no14th.htm

https://fromthetrenchesworldreport....ually-illegal-as-it-was-never-ratified/176732

http://www.sweetliberty.org/fourteenth.amend.htm

http://www.thetruthaboutthelaw.com/its-time-to-tell-the-truth-the-14th-amend-was-not-ratified/

When you have judges, lawyers, historians, civil libertarians and other researchers questioning the 14th Amendment, it merits looking into. Just because a de facto court emanating out of Washington Wonderland, District of Corruption will not consider the matter does not mean that we, the people, have no recourse on the issue.

 

The facts of the 16th Amendment were summarized, for the most part, by Aaron Russo's video. I have a separate issue with that Amendment:

We were told that the 16th Amendment was about the black people and their rights. In reality, the United States Supreme Court used the 14th Amendment to nullify the Bill of Rights, eliminate unalienable Rights, and declare that the government is in the rights granting business. That flies in the face of all the established precedents from the ratification of the Constitution all the way up to the passage of the 14th Amendment. So, we are either Citizens or subjects.

http://freedom-school.com/citizenship/two-united-states-and-the-law.html

 

and the 13th, and the 14th, and the civil war! we are always 'told' what to believe!

 

Nice that we basically agree on this.

Try thinking in demographic terms. It then shows how easy it would be.

Just visualize moving those bricks in the graph from the rich right to the poor left and you can see, visually, how little effort and change it would really take to move the economy and our demographic pyramid to what the graph showed as our ideal form.

All it takes is political ands social desire to make it right.

Most do not even recognize that poverty is being imposed by our tax system.

Regards
DL

 

As one comedian said, the American public can no longer feel the big red white and blue prick being gamed up their ass in so many issues.

If you Americans are that dumbed down by your government, and don't recognize what they are doing, then you will continue to elect Trump like instead of Obama type leaders.

The wold's intelligentsia feels sorry for you Americans.

Nice that a few like you see what is going on though.

Regards
DL