Question: Will the Officers Get A Fair Trial

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Starjet, Jun 5, 2020.

  1. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You are correct with regards to Minnesota law. My apologies.

    Second-degree murder: According to the Minnesota statute, whoever causes the death of a human being, without intent to effect the death of any person, while committing or attempting to commit a felony offense other than criminal sexual conduct in the first or second degree with force or violence or a drive-by shooting” is guilty of murder in the second degree.”https://www.voanews.com/usa/nation-...-degree-murder-3rd-degree-murder-manslaughter

    This has not been my understanding of the law. Thank you for the enlightenment. However, they still have to prove 1) He understood his action was illegal and a felony, (the placing of the knee on the neck), and 2) That the officer understood death was a real possibility or should have understood it was. That is still an extremely high bar.

    I still think they have a better chance at a guilty verdict of reckless homicide and only went to 2nd degree to appease the mob, which it didn't.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2020
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  2. jay runner

    jay runner Banned

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    Damn good thing the Rev. Al Sharpton is not the prosecutor. They would all walk for sure.
     
  3. Quantum Nerd

    Quantum Nerd Well-Known Member

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    I have to admit, I'd hate to be called to jury duty on these cases. Whatever the outcome, people will be upset.
     
  4. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Thanks. Very informative. So there are two types of 2nd-degree murder. I've always viewed the first type as true second-degree murder, and the second type as reckless homicide. Still, I see their point. And under their law, the charge of 2nd-degree murder is appropriate, but still very hard to prove--was the police officer committing a felony or acting within arrest procedure. It is going to be a very interesting trial.

    And still, each officer, as an American citizen has the right to a trial.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2020
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  5. jay runner

    jay runner Banned

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    If all the laws are followed and the prosecutor dose an admirable job there is no reason to be upset. If there is a conviction almost nobody will be upset.

    The two guys who were new on the job, one guy just four days, might possibly catch a bit of a break but they will get something. The AG might have to hedge his bet on those two to ensure some kind of conviction. Mama said you got to take what you can get.
     
  6. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Oh yeah. The mob is out for blood, not justice.
     
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  7. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    Medical examiners report states that the knee to the neck for almost nine minutes was the cause of death.

    Not drugs

    Not corona

    Not heart issues.

    He was killed
     
  8. Lesh

    Lesh Banned

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    Dupe
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2020
  9. Pants

    Pants Well-Known Member

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    They do, indeed, deserve a fair trial. Everyone does. There seems to be a bit of a dance around the actual charges, but the video is pretty damning evidence.
     
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  10. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    You do understand what the word perhaps means don't you and the possibility exists that the struggle was getting him out of the car.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2020
  11. ECA

    ECA Well-Known Member

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    You do understand because you haven't watch one video you're just talking out of your backside, right?
     
  12. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    You do understand that neither of us knows everything about this story and until the trial starts none of us do.
     
  13. ECA

    ECA Well-Known Member

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    Given that you haven't even bothered to see any of the videos means you know absolutely nothing about the story.
     
  14. spiritgide

    spiritgide Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I agree a fair trial is unlikely. The government is allowing themselves to be cowed into compromise and submission, and they are going to throw these defendants under the bus regardless. This is not to say they are innocent- but that genuine justice will not take place.

    They are even afraid to point out that the arrest which started this was not of a black Jesus as the news implies, but of a excon who spent 5 years in prison for an armed home invasion and was arrested this time because he was passing counterfeit money. You won't find that information easily, because most media has pulled such stories rather than take the heat for speaking poorly, even though truthfully, about the incident.

    The same people who march for "justice" for Floyd George are part and parcel of the rioters who loot and burn stores and throw bricks at police. I can't speak for everyone, but I'm really tired of them being referred to as "protestors". When you come prepared for violence, looting and arson- you aren't a protestor, you are a gangster, a terrorist, and the kind of person most people would shoot without hesitation is their home was the place being attacked.

    "Protestors?" Of what- people objecting to rioting? Not enough goods to steal? Shortage of matches to start fires with?

    Two big guilty parties here- The MSM, liberal and progressives for promoting such mindless, immoral thinking- and local/state government for not nipping this in the bud with hard and immediate consequences for the criminal acts.
     
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  15. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    At the very least, the video shows the officer pressing harder on the citizen’s neck as he asks the citizen to stand up and get in the car. Indeed, the officer is acting like a sadistic Nazi SS thug from an old post WW II news film reel. It’s absolutely horrendous and without moral justification

    But one man’s sin doesn’t morally justify the destruction of the rule of law. Indeed, it’s that officer’s sin that makes the rule of law necessary; otherwise, humanity is nothing but a pack of frothing mad wolves, as ANTIFA, BLM, and the Boogaloos Boys have aptly demonstrated.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2020
  16. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Whatever the man’s sins, the action of the officer pressing on the man’s neck after being subdued, and while begging for help, is not justified.

    But you are right, George Floyd is not a virtuous man, and if the officer knew of his criminal past, it may have influenced his decision to behave so monstrously. But police must behave as professionally as doctors. Whatever their sins, individuals retain the right to be treated humanely by the professionals.

    I wouldn’t make it as a cop. I’d get pissed and kill somebody for sure.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2020
  17. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    Does it show that or is that your interpretation? Could he be asking him if he's ready to get up or can it be clearly understood at all? How do you know he's pressing harder on the guy's neck? Side of the neck or back of the neck?
     
  18. spiritgide

    spiritgide Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I don't think we can know what was really in officer Chauvins mind. I certainly don't think he intended to kill George, that would have been really stupid. I do believe he may have been too aggressive a personality and that he used excessive force. It 's possible he didn't understand the anatomy well enough to realize that pressure could be deadly, but he no doubt would have known it carried risk.

    It seems that we all should understand that cops are people too, and that they have very high-stress jobs. Their rate of divorce and suicide is quite high, and there will be incidents of bad behavior. This occurs in all professions, just in different degrees and ways. But- the last thing that this incident does is entitle people to riot and destroy private property or to throw bricks at cops all over the country. What that behavior does is show us what cops have to deal with in people everywhere, and that should tell us why some of them will become aggressive.
     
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  19. Reality

    Reality Well-Known Member

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    Have you looked at the statutes involved?
    All they have to prove is an excessive force claim. Prove the underlying felony of assault in the 3rd degree (in MN that's the charge. Assault which does lead to a substantial injury. See Autopsies) during which a man died and you've got felony murder which is 2nd degree murder, subdivision 2 in MN.
    No intent to kill is required.

    You telling me you don't think they can even prove excessive force?
     
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  20. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    All I’m saying is each officer has a right to their day in court to face their accusers and their peers. It’s the state that must prove their guilt.

    OJ went free. Casey Anthony went free. No riots. Any bets what will happen if any of the four go free?
     
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  21. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I agree. I’ve seen some horrifying cases on Discovery ID, and I’m always astounded and impressed that the police behave as rationally and objectively as they do after seeing the body of a raped, tortured, and butchered body of a child. I could not do it. I’d beat the monster who did it to a pulp, and shove fire ants, wasps, hornets, and scorpions up his ass and down his throat. I’m don’t have the courage to be cop, not because I’m afraid of bad guys, but because I fear what I would do and what I’d become.
     
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  22. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I watched the video. Every time he asked the individual to stand up and get in the car, he pressed harder on his neck. Sadistic mockery.
     
  23. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    Or the guy wasn't moving or replying. And he not knowing the situation was a bit torqued by the lack of response to the question?
     
  24. Reality

    Reality Well-Known Member

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    Of course they do, but their guilt is certain. We've all seen the tape. Regardless of anything else, when the one cop says there are no vitals and Chauvin remains in the carotid hold for 3 more minutes, that's excessive force > caused substantial injury >3rd degree assault in MN, a felony > man died during commission of a felony > Felony murder > 2nd degree murder subdivision 2 in MN.

    There are only so many plausible explanations for yanking him back out of the car, or for continuing to sit on his neck after no vitals. Using your magic wand, tell me what they could say they had did which if 100% true would absolve them in BOTH of those situations.
    Go on.

    OJ: Not on tape in broad daylight with a crowd of witnesses. DA lost all credibility by planting OJs blood at the scene from his samples taken to eliminate him. The blood still had the anti coagulant preservative in it.
    Plus they took a day for opening statements, which tells you everything you need to know right there. And no one thought to unlatch the glove for OJ to try, plus since it was wet it had shrunk.
    Wholly distinguishable.

    Casey Anthony: Charged with something that required intent, evidence problems etc. Not on tape in front of a crowd of witnesses. ETC.
    Wholly distinguishable.
     
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  25. Starjet

    Starjet Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    We'll see, won't we? And what about the man on video in the LA riots in '92 yanking a truck driver out of his truck and smashing his head in with a piece of a concrete slab. All on video. He walked, and the driver forgave him. As evidenced by the brutalization of the truck driver in '92, George's life, and the Minneapolis officer's action, humans don't always do the right thing.

    Warning: Graphic
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2020

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