Andy Atheist Wrote: "If God is all knowing (Omniscient} then it logically follows that if God knows today, what choices I will make tomorrow, then I have no choice tomorrow to do anything other than to make the choice that God knew I would choose."___Andy Atheist JAG Replies: Yes it is true that since God is Omniscient and knows the future and knows what you will choose to do, then you will do that which He knows that you will do. But , , , that does NOT mean that you did not freely choose to do that which He knew you would do. Here we need to understand what Free Will means. Free Will means there is no Force external to you, that forces you to do, that which you do not want to do. God merely knowing what you will choose to do, does not mean that God forces you to do, that which He knew you would choose to do. Nor does it mean that you did not want to do it. You did want to do it. Your Free Will freely chose to do whatever you did. It Is Vital To Remember That , , , Free Will means that there is no Force outside of you, that is forcing or coercing you into choosing to do that which is against what you want to do. The fact that God knows what you will choose to do, does not mean that there was any Force-Outside-Of-You coercing you to do that which God knew you would choose to do. __________ Secular Laws , , , Free Will is a secular truth, and not only a religious truth; How so? Because all of Civilized Humanity recognizes the legitimacy of the institution of Free Will and has legislated human Free Will into law. the Law says humans are responsible for their choices. The Law recognizes the legitimacy of the Institution of human Free Will. Keeping in mind what Andy Atheist said, read this dialogue between Henry and The Judge. Henry: Your Honor, yes it is true that I robbed that bank and in the process I killed three bank tellers, but Your Honor, God is Omniscient and God knew I would rob the bank and kill those three tellers, so Your Honor its not my fault that I committed this crime, I merely did what God knew I would do. The Judge: Oh okay, Henry. I understand. Thanks for explaining. Case dismissed. So? So humans Are Responsible For Their Free Will Choices. So all this talk about Free Will NOT being a true, valid, and legitimate explanation of why humans are personally responsible before God for the evil choices they make is irrational and belongs in the basement below the basement where unproductive totally-useless abstract philosophical academic speculations blathers on and on and on. Nothing said by humans can invalidate this truth: Humans Are Responsible For Their Free Will Choices. _________ Many Atheists blame God , , , However my view is that the air-tight solid truth demonstrated in the conversation between Henry and The Judge, will be dismissed as nonsense by most atheists and the irrational assault on the institution of human Free Will as a legitimate and valid explanation of human evil and sin will continue as if Henry and The Judge had never been presented. Why? Because atheists who remain atheists are not going to ever give up blaming God for the evil in the world -- and thereby excusing themselves for their own Free Will evil choices to do evil. What does Henry and The Judge demonstrate? That Humans Are Responsible For Their Free Will Choices. -- and to say otherwise reduces to absurd-nonsense. The Coming Judgment , , , One last point: Not only does all of Civilized Law recognize Free Will as a legitimate explanation for human evil choices, but so does God and the Bible and God's laws regarding Free Will will be applied at The Judgment just as man's laws regarding Free Will are applied in Human Courts. What does that mean? It means that human Free Will choices will determine human Eternal destiny. John 3:16 asks humans to make a choice. Joshua 24:15 asks humans to make a choice. "But if serving the LORD seems undesirable to you, then choose for yourselves this day whom you will serve, whether the gods your ancestors served beyond the Euphrates, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land you are living. But as for me and my household, we will serve the LORD." ___Joshua 24:15 `
Again you have missed the point, please show one atheist who has ever blamed god for anything, only a theist can do this! Atheists take responsibility for their own actions and their own moral code. Most civilised law works on the assumption that god does not exist, only in a theocracy would anyone get away with the suggestion that it was gods will they killed their wife because she was an adulteress, this is because secular moral values are now far more sophisticated than 2000 years ago when it was ok to beat your wife or except payment for your daughters rape since god said so. Civilised law does not recognise imaginary friends full stop unless you are deemed to be insane, then it does not recognise your imaginary friend just that there is something mentally wrong with you. To say civilised law proves god grants free will is disingenuous at best.
Atheists don't believe in god/gods so they don't blame "him/her/it" for anything. More interestingly, why are theists so obsessed with understanding the inner working of atheism?
Sorry dude, but an omnipotent God who creates a universe has purposefully DESIGNED that universe to to act in a certain way. Since an Omnipotent God would know every action a human in that universe would take at the moment of the universe's initial creation, then that human was DESIGNED to act in a certain manner - hence the idea of free will is negated ... IF the creator is indeed an omnipotent being. So, either you have an omnipotent creator and no free will, or just a more advanced creator who is not omnipotent and you MAY have free will.
I would think an Omnipotent Creator could easily create a Universe in which there is Free Will irregardless of logical contradictions. A Creator bound by the rules of logic is hardly Omnipotent.
HENRY and THE JUDGE. {I re-worked the Opening Post} The takeaway point in this post is human Free Will choices are responsible for the evil in this world. _______ Many Anti-Christians and Atheists daily look for ways to demonstrate that humans are not actually responsible for their Free Will choices to do evil. Atheists do not believe that God exists, but they postulate that God exists for the sake of argument. Here is ANDY ATHEIST trying to blame God for the evil choices that humans make, and at the same time take the blame off of human beings for their Free Will choices to do evil. ANDY ATHEIST Wrote: "If God is all knowing (Omniscient} then it logically follows that if God knows today, what choices I will make tomorrow, then I have no choice tomorrow to do anything other than to make the choice that God knew I would choose."___ANDY ATHEIST JAG Replies: Yes it is true that since God is Omniscient and knows the future and knows what you will choose to do, then you will do that which He knows that you will do. But , , , that does NOT mean that you did not freely choose to do that which He knew you would do. Here we need to understand what Free Will means. Free Will means there is no Force EXTERNAL-TO-YOU, that forces you to do, that which you do not want to do. God merely knowing what you will choose to do, does not mean that God forces you to do, that which He knew you would choose to do. Nor does it mean that you did not want to do it. You did want to do it. Your Free Will freely chose to do whatever you did. It Is Vital To Remember That , , , Free Will means that there is NO-FORCE-OUTSIDE-OF-YOU, that is forcing or coercing you into choosing to do that which is against what you want to do. The fact that God knows what you will choose to do, does not mean that there was any Force-Outside-Of-You coercing you to do that which God knew you would choose to do. __________ Secular Laws , , , Free Will is a secular truth, and not only a religious truth; How so? Because all of Civilized Humanity recognizes the legitimacy of the institution of Free Will and has legislated human Free Will into law. The Law says humans are responsible for their choices. The Law recognizes the legitimacy of the Institution of human Free Will. Keeping in mind what ANDY ATHEIST said, read this dialogue between HENRY and THE JUDGE: __________ HENRY: Your Honor, yes it is true that I robbed that bank and in the process I killed three bank tellers, but Your Honor, God is Omniscient and God knew I would rob the bank and kill those three tellers, so Your Honor its not my fault that I committed this crime, I merely did what God knew I would do. THE JUDGE: Oh okay, Henry. I understand. Thanks for explaining. Case dismissed. ___________ You say THE JUDGE would NEVER do that. You are correct. THAT is the point. What Andy Atheist said was ABSURD-NONSENSE. So? So humans Are Responsible For Their Free Will Choices. All this talk about Free Will NOT being a true, valid, and legitimate explanation of why humans are personally responsible before God for the evil choices they make is irrational and belongs in the basement below the basement where unproductive totally-useless abstract philosophical academic speculations blather on and on and on. Nothing said by humans can invalidate this truth: Humans Are Responsible For Their Free Will Choices. _________ What does HENRY and THE JUDGE demonstrate? That Humans Are Responsible For Their Free Will Choices. -- and to say otherwise reduces to absurd-nonsense. `
I wonder if omniscience is even possible, given what we know about how things work on a small scale? For example, it's not possible in principle to know both the position and momentum of an elmentary particle, and we know that particles are really waveforms with probabilities. This implies that the future is unknowable, not just because of the amount of computing power needed but actually in principle.
Certainly every atheist I ever met or have read understands that humans are responsible for the evil that humans do, taking responsibility for their own actions is an atheist trait. We have no higher power to blame since there is no reason to believe in one. There is no "problem of evil" for the atheist only for Timmy the theist is it an issue!
The absurd nonsense exists only for Timmy the Theist who has to reconcile the existence of an all loving god with the incredible evil he permits. Lack of belief in god does not require word salad and cognitive dissonance to explain evil! Good men will do good things, bad men will do bad things, but it takes a god to make good men do evil!
