Job Losses Spike, 1/3 Can't Pay Rent, Depression Imminent

Discussion in 'Latest US & World News' started by Horhey, Jul 9, 2020.

  1. crank

    crank Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2013
    Messages:
    54,812
    Likes Received:
    18,482
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I have a real world example for you.

    Last weekend I offered a house to Melbourne friends. It was already pretty clear by Sunday that a full lockdown would return, and their jobs would be impacted again. Given they're renters, that's not good. I offered them a house to themselves, for zero rent, for as long as they needed it. They turned it down. Instead they want to keep forking out $500pw rent, and keep fingers tightly crossed. PS: This is the second time I've offered the same people the same house. First time was in March. Had they taken it then, they'd have been out of Melbourne and saving $2000 a month. That's $10k, at this point, and counting. All because they like living in their expensive inner city location.

    My point is that if you expect to live like you're on a middle class income, while on minimum wage or welfare, you are wilfully choosing your fate.
     
  2. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 8, 2016
    Messages:
    5,000
    Likes Received:
    718
    Trophy Points:
    113
    China's system though, namely, capitalism funded by the state, is already superior - in economic terms - to our system of 'invisible hand' markets funded by private banksters.

    https://ellenbrown.com/2019/06/14/the-american-dream-is-alive-and-well-in-china/


    So your "bargaining chip" may not have much appeal....
     
  3. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2017
    Messages:
    27,695
    Likes Received:
    21,093
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    We've been a 'State Capitalism' by definition ever since the 2008 'too big to fail' bank and auto bailouts. You want more of that?
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2020
  4. a better world

    a better world Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 8, 2016
    Messages:
    5,000
    Likes Received:
    718
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2020
  5. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2017
    Messages:
    27,695
    Likes Received:
    21,093
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Digging ditches and then filling them in, eh?

    Im not totally opposed to that...

    But I also don't think thats necessarily 'state funded capitalism'
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2020
  6. Thingamabob

    Thingamabob Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2017
    Messages:
    14,267
    Likes Received:
    4,465
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Logical. I have been saying the same thing to the idiots on this forum but they can't get passed the idea of the state "providing" jobs. The idea (in their feeble minds) conjures up fantasy scenarios of people getting kidnapped off the streets and ending up in the gulag.
    Nor am I.
     
  7. FreshAir

    FreshAir Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2012
    Messages:
    150,175
    Likes Received:
    62,815
    Trophy Points:
    113
    all for it

    also we should raise taxes on corporations by 25% and give any corp that does not outsource their jobs overseas a 25% tax cut
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2020
    modernpaladin likes this.
  8. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2017
    Messages:
    27,695
    Likes Received:
    21,093
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    LOL i was all 'woah, hang on!' til the end.

    But then I was like 'hell ya'.
     
    FreshAir likes this.
  9. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2017
    Messages:
    44,677
    Likes Received:
    12,448
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Not necessarily. There is nothing about the capitalist system that makes crashes, recessions, or depressions inevitable.
     
    crank likes this.
  10. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2010
    Messages:
    63,706
    Likes Received:
    13,464
    Trophy Points:
    113
    what part of cheap servile labor do you figure is above your academic pay grade ?
     
  11. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2010
    Messages:
    63,706
    Likes Received:
    13,464
    Trophy Points:
    113
    "The capitalist system" ?! - which one. In laissez faire such things are inevitable - at least throughout history this has been the case.

    Current regulated Capitalist systems try and control the swings - but, the invisible hand is hard to tame.
     
  12. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2010
    Messages:
    63,706
    Likes Received:
    13,464
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Brilliant deduction Watson - but how does this relate to Oligopolies using nefarious practices to reduce wage competition - and competition from the little guy - small businesses.
     
  13. FivepointFive

    FivepointFive Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2017
    Messages:
    2,754
    Likes Received:
    684
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Does LangleyMan know how to read graphs??

    [​IMG]


    Agree we seem to intervene too much.. I see my Grandsons wallet evaporating before my eyes.. He will be footing a large bill for the pandemic response when he starts working 10 years from now... So glad Kanye got 2-5 Million so he could run for President..

    Troll the Polls.. Say you like Kanye.. I would love it if he beat Trump and Biden in a poll.Problem is people would believe it and take Votes from Joe
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2020
  14. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2010
    Messages:
    63,706
    Likes Received:
    13,464
    Trophy Points:
    113
    And you can go back much further .. the last 3 economic empires Spanish, Dutch, British - all went into major decline roughly 20-25 years after going off gold. When there is nothing backing the paper - there restrictions to creation of debt are lifted ... and Gov'ts can't resist unlimited credit. At one point the interest on the Spanish debt hit near 40% of revenue .. an absurd case. 30% and alarm bells go off at the IMF - the ship is taking on water faster than can be bailed out.

    After the Reagan spending spree - followed by Bush - Clinton was welcomed by interest of 25% of income on our debt.

    But I digress slightly .. We went off Gold in 73. The Constant Dollar top of the Dow was made in Jan/Feb 2000. We beat the average by a few years.

    The Dow stagnated for 16 years could not make a new high .. we finally did it during the Trump Bump - "the Crest of the Tidal wave"

    This was done - in True Reagan Style - by massive amounts of stimulus spending .. Taking the deficit from 500 Billion to 1.2 + we won't include Corona -

    But the emperor had no clothes - it was a false break out .. and was failing prior to Corona The manufacturing index had spent some 5 months in the negative just prior to Covid. GDP - after spiking up to a whopping 3 - 3.5% for a year (nowhere near the 5-6% predicted by carrot top) due to the massive nitrous oxide injection - fell to under 2%

    At Dow 25,000 we are not quite to constant dollar trendline territory but - we have yet to feel the economic Tsunami coming on account of Covid.

    I claim 2000 was the top in terms of the overall economy - and we have been on a downhill slide ever since.
     
  15. FivepointFive

    FivepointFive Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2017
    Messages:
    2,754
    Likes Received:
    684
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    We are heading for Star Trek where money does not exist.. The accumulated wealth of this planet is useless.. We need folks to gamble like Musk on actually doing something good for humanity.. I think we are at a tipping point on this planet., hopefully to a better place. The Floyd protests were global. That says something.

    This is no Bolshevik.. The hoax is on the wealthy. It feels like all money could evaporate in an hour if we aren't careful.
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2020
  16. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2010
    Messages:
    63,706
    Likes Received:
    13,464
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Yeah - but the transition from now to Star Trek will not be smooth. The haves will not go gently into that good night.
     
  17. FivepointFive

    FivepointFive Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2017
    Messages:
    2,754
    Likes Received:
    684
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Yeah.. Hope I can't get a condo on Bezos's Space Condominium

    Not looking forward to being one of the meek inheriting a used up planet.

    Maybe he will need maintenance techs compensated with food and shelter
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2020
  18. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2010
    Messages:
    63,706
    Likes Received:
    13,464
    Trophy Points:
    113
    In keeping with the moving into a different paradigm. Accountants are rubbing fingers together thinking of the savings to be had from having people work from home. At the same time - this is a partial solution to CO2 emissions

    I predict a Commercial Property collapse -
     
  19. Horhey

    Horhey Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2010
    Messages:
    5,724
    Likes Received:
    1,026
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Workplace democracy.

    From a few minutes ago.

    Stagnation of wages & banking practices: loans, credit cards and debt.
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2020
  20. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2017
    Messages:
    44,677
    Likes Received:
    12,448
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    You have it all wrong. Opening up while the virus is spreading won't save the economy.

    8CBE2492-56EE-4B24-9EDE-BF2BB17DC227.jpeg

    We need to get the virus under control, then people will relax and start spending.
     
  21. One Mind

    One Mind Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2014
    Messages:
    20,296
    Likes Received:
    7,744
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Humans are a part of the capitalist system
    .
    Monopolies are a part of the system.

    Greed is human and a part of the system..

    Making loans that people can't pay back, discounting them selling them off to be bundled and then selling the risky loans to investors as safe investments happens under capitalism. The ensuing crash happens under capitalism.

    After FDR regulated banks we didn't have another financial driven crash until after the financial sector was deregulated. Coincidence? Yeah, right.

    Neoliberal capitalism has increased income disparity. Opened us up for crashes and impoverished people. It sends far too much of the pie to the top. This has happened.

    You are trying to say capitalism cannot be structured to mostly benefit the rich and powerful. And I say BS. Reality shows the BS.
     
  22. One Mind

    One Mind Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2014
    Messages:
    20,296
    Likes Received:
    7,744
    Trophy Points:
    113
    The new deal was dismantled after the GOP came back to power and the dems stopped representing working people. Books are written about it.

    The tripling of energy costs in the 70s really hurt our economy. This was a used to convince that the problem was the new deal system instead the shock of energy costs tripling . The rest is just history as they say.
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2020
  23. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2017
    Messages:
    44,677
    Likes Received:
    12,448
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    There is no "laissez faire" capitalism, but there is capitalism rigged in favor of some businesses.
    Greed and corruption are responsible for creating conditions that lead to crashes. We failed to regulate subprime lending that lead to the housing crash.

    713ACC79-A951-4E14-9FD8-59DFEDC65980.gif
     
  24. Heartburn

    Heartburn Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2015
    Messages:
    13,499
    Likes Received:
    4,973
    Trophy Points:
    113
    All those answers are given for current conditions and the government has given the impression there will be endless support for those who are damaged by the shutdown. The government will not. End the aid and see what percentage are willing to work then. All those numbers will change once the real shutdown takes effect and the govt. larders can't keep up. Open this country and economy back up and let's learn to work around this virus because it isn't going anywhere.
     
  25. One Mind

    One Mind Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2014
    Messages:
    20,296
    Likes Received:
    7,744
    Trophy Points:
    113
    An offshored economy that gave us the servant economy is too weak to endure a covid shut down.
     

Share This Page