Brexit Delay? The EU wants one, the UK does not.

Discussion in 'Western Europe' started by The Rhetoric of Life, Mar 31, 2020.

  1. philosophical

    philosophical Well-Known Member

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    Two different systems either side of a border, each side is likely to protect the integrity of their own system.
    If both sides are not in complete alignment then guarding that integrity and dealing with transgressions will come into play sooner or later.
     
  2. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    They have never in history been in complete alignment except for a brief period under the British Empire.
    As previously noted S Ireland has a different currency and different laws to N Ireland.

    Each side deals with transgressions in it's own way depending on which jurisdiction those transgressions occur.
    Each side is indeed responsible for looking after it's own interests. Including the integrity of it's own system.

    Should both sides agree on what a transgression is and what response is required for one, they may co-operate.

    For example, tariffs due for crossing into S Ireland from N Ireland may be collected in the UK and vice versa.
    Foot and Mouth disease or rabbies may be addressed in the same manner on both sides of the border at the same time.

    No reason for common sense and mutual co-operation to end just because your choice of ruler for the UK has been denied you.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2020
  3. philosophical

    philosophical Well-Known Member

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    Brief period under the British (Empire) is rather a loose statement.
    For example when was the 'British Empire' supposed to have started?
    If it was under Oliver Cromwell for example it wasn't that brief I would suggest.
    Goodness knows what you mean about my choice of ruler for the UK. The UK has always ruled itself and exercised sovereignty over it's own affairs.
    Whatever structures that have existed in the UK has been accepted by the UK. Including 'mutual cooperation' with other EU states.
    The UK has never been subject to unwilling dictat from other countries. Certainly far back into the 'British Empire' and beyond.

    Noticed your use of the Rees Mogg ism 'common sense' a term that has popped up a lot recently, including in Barnard Castle.
    Hmmmn.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2020
  4. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    Not up on the history. Sorry.
    But that is the only time the island of Ireland has been a single political entity without borders to the best of my (limited) knowledge.
    I suspect that the British Empire was predominantly an 18th and 19th century period of history. With the 20th century marking the end of it.

    Whatever structures that have existed in the UK famously were not accepted by it.
    The EU was roundly rejected the first time the UK was offered any say in the matter.
    And polling suggests that it would always have been rejected by the electorate at any and all times during our membership and before.

    That UK leadership was complicit in this is not a mark of honour on their part.
    Hence all the cries of anti democracy and so many of them losing their seats in the recent election.

    I fully expect mutual co-operation to continue with EU member states in the future.
    Just as with other countries.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2020
  5. Montegriffo

    Montegriffo Well-Known Member

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    A little history for you then to help fill in the gaps...
    The first time we had a referendum on whether to stay in the European single market it was a resounding vote to remain.
    In fact, it was the first time we'd ever had a referendum on anything.
    We've had only 2 more since that first one in 1974.
     
  6. philosophical

    philosophical Well-Known Member

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    I see plucky Britain might have agreed some kind of arrangement with Japan that could be nearly as good as the one it had before.
     
  7. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    A little bit of history for you.
    The EU didn't exist back then.

    And there was no European single market back then either.
    And there still isn't.
    Just the EEC and now the EU.

    If the EU was just a trade agreement between 8 similiar economies like the EEC, it might have survived a referendum too.
    But it isn't and it didn't.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2020
  8. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    The Japanese foreign minister has said the deal has been made with the UK.
    UK tariffs with Japan are to be lower than EU tariffs with Japan.

    Without the EU we got better terms with Japan than what was on offer to us through the EU
     
  9. philosophical

    philosophical Well-Known Member

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    As long as cheese trade is excluded.
     
  10. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    Yes, lol.
    Sorry Stilton.

    I didn't even know Japan makes blue cheese.
    They aren't known for eating dairy produce.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2020
  11. Cannabis Kills People

    Cannabis Kills People Newly Registered

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    Stop saying Britain....
    Its UK not Britain ffs!...
    Britain is not a country!..
    Boris is the UK prime minister not British prime minister...
    We are UK citizens not bloody British...
    Our passports are called UK passports NOT British passports....
    Its a UK trade deal not a British trade deal...
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2020
  12. Montegriffo

    Montegriffo Well-Known Member

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    Britain won't be a united kingdom for long.
    First the Scots and then the Northern Irish will leave the union after our suicidal decision to leave the world's largest trading block.
    All those little Englanders will end up with just little England and Wales.
    The United Kingdom will unravel.
     
  13. Cannabis Kills People

    Cannabis Kills People Newly Registered

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    Scotland had their vote and stayed part of the UK.. They are not going to get a second referendum, ever!... Boris wont even let Nicola Sturgeon take a seat at the UK government’s cabinet or even attend cabinet meetings... And once we leave the EU completley after the transition period, Boris is handing Westminster control over Scotland and taking away many of their devoled powers and control of laws that will revert from EU to UK....

    I couldn't care less what Ireland do, but reunification requires a referendum in both the North and South of Ireland for it to legally happen. The South will never vote for it and neither will the Catholics. The North have received annual subsidies of billions of pounds for decades and wont give that up.. Then there is the question of differences between the healthcare systems in the jurisdictions where Northern is HSC (basically NHS run) and free to everyone and Southern Ireland pay crippling health care charges for doctors appointments, hospital appoinments and hospital stays....
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2020
  14. Baff

    Baff Well-Known Member

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    Both Scotland and NI have had the opportunity to leave the UK.
    Both voted not to.

    Some of them who lost those votes, are still campaigning to change this.
    Maybe one day they will.
    Maybe not.

    The future is unwritten.

    In both cases the votes were close enough for this to be a real possibility.
    In the case of Scotland they decisively voted to be part of the UK so recently that they aren't going to have another vote on it for a long, long time.
    Much to the chagrin of the losers.
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2020
  15. philosophical

    philosophical Well-Known Member

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    Personally I don't agree with either Scottish or Irish nationalism, or patriotism in general. However an eternity of being governed by the Etonocracy would cause any decent person to look for a way out, even nationalism.
    Little Englanders are vermin in my opinion, but they won and wield the power.
     

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