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Justice ready to charge Google with monopoly search practices

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by Lil Mike, Oct 17, 2020.

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  1. JET3534

    JET3534 Well-Known Member

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    JET3534, Oct 17, 2020
    #26
  2. Thedimon

    Thedimon Well-Known Member

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    The point of such judgement is to ensure there are no abuses.
     
    Thedimon, Oct 17, 2020
    #27
  3. Yulee

    Yulee Well-Known Member

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    Most legal experts will tell you Microsoft won that suit. So much so that Microsoft gladly renews the settlement agreement twice.
     
    Yulee, Oct 17, 2020
    #28
  4. dadoalex

    dadoalex Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You've listed the reasons this fails.

    Yahoo, Bing, Duck...There are other engines, Google does nothing to inhibit block or otherwise inhibit access to competitors, barriers to entry into the market are nominal (got an engine? You can enter the market for a few hundred dollars)

    That you may not like the returns from a Google search makes Google "monopolistic?"
    Is the same true if I do not like the returns from a Duck search?

    Be careful what you wish.
     
    dadoalex, Oct 17, 2020
    #29
  5. Thedimon

    Thedimon Well-Known Member

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    How much money did they spend on lawyers?
     
    Thedimon, Oct 17, 2020
    #30
  6. dadoalex

    dadoalex Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I can't say where you got the image BUT it wasn't Google. It appears to be the bottom of something like a Washington Times or NY Post story but definitely not google.
     
    dadoalex, Oct 17, 2020
    #31
  7. dadoalex

    dadoalex Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Ahhh History.

    Microsoft's issue was "bundling" which is the same issue that put IBM under a court supervision for nearly 20 years. MS was "bundling" IE with Windows which was not a problem until MS went all MS on us and and began "integrating" IE into the OS which served to block access by competitors.

    Google, with a few exceptions, is not a hardware company and licenses Chrome OS/Android OS to hardware companies which may in turn choose to install whatever search engine suits them.

    BUT, if you want a more complete experience:

    https://www.spyfu.com/blog/google-search-operators/

    Learn how to use the Google search operators.
     
    dadoalex, Oct 17, 2020
    #32
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  8. Thedimon

    Thedimon Well-Known Member

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    They make contracts with hardware makers that dictate things like default browser, or what the default search page is.
    That’s the meat of the problem.
     
    Thedimon, Oct 17, 2020
    #33
  9. cd8ed

    cd8ed Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Who knew sexual orientation and race were political biases — the answer of course is anyone listening to the Republican party platform or language.

    As for the image search, you obviously don’t understand how search parameters are used... not surprising, here is duck duck go (a favorite of the alt-right)
    upload_2020-10-17_16-35-13.png

    And bing:
    upload_2020-10-17_16-36-39.png


    Just because the results don’t match your biases doesn’t mean there is a political agenda, either that or it is a vast world conspiracy by media, education, corporations, and the vast majority of the population against conservatives — or it could be that bigotry is despised by many and right wing is actually the extreme screaming minority (silent majority you are not).

    Maybe y’all should create your own search engine instead of trying to dictate what others do?
    Stormfrontsearch.com is an available domain, nothing is stopping you!
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2020
    cd8ed, Oct 17, 2020
    #34
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  10. Yulee

    Yulee Well-Known Member

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    Where’s Sun Java these days? Or Netscape Navigator?
     
    Yulee, Oct 17, 2020
    #35
  11. HockeyDad

    HockeyDad Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Um right. Apparently google is only able to correctly search for what you want if you search for non-white ethnicites:

    A black couple search gets me straight black couples:
    upload_2020-10-17_16-12-34.png



    Japanese couple gets me straight Japanese couples:
    upload_2020-10-17_16-21-1.png




    Swedish couple search gets me this interracial couples:
    upload_2020-10-17_16-20-12.png

    Polish couple search get me interracial and gay couples:
    upload_2020-10-17_16-23-37.png


    This is evidence of a company deviating further and further from reality and concentrated on pushing a narrative. This is very dangerous territory given that google now has more power than 95% of the nations in the world.
     
    HockeyDad, Oct 17, 2020
    #36
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  12. cd8ed

    cd8ed Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Black straight couple results in 18 images on the first page
    upload_2020-10-17_17-57-16.png

    That is with me signed out and with my cache cleared, of those 18 only 8 are of a black couple.
    I would do the rest of them but I expect similar results.

    Again, you don’t understand how search engines work.

    So your narrative that there is some secret ploy to feed you propaganda is summerly debunked

    As to your independent search results, maybe you are looking up gay and interracial (or homophobic or racial) themes and your search history just mimics this... Think of google like Netflix, it tries to match you to relevant content that matches your history. If you watch horror you will get more horror, if you watch gay movies and then search “love” you will be recommended LGBT themed movies and shows.

    It isn’t google, it’s your browser history.
    And duck duck go and big will show very similar results, not a conspiracy but an algorithm
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2020
    cd8ed, Oct 17, 2020
    #37
  13. HockeyDad

    HockeyDad Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Kind of off topic.... how did you make those wonderful red circles? I don't have a photo editing software and was wondering if I could do something like that with freeware. I am using the snipping tool and have to hand draw circles and it always looks like crap.
     
    HockeyDad, Oct 17, 2020
    #38
  14. cd8ed

    cd8ed Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I am on an iPad, if you screenshot — on the photo edit bar click the plus sign on the bottom right bar and it will bring up a few annotation options. If you are on windows there are tons of programs I can recommend that are easy to use and free. If you have an android I can’t help, haven’t used one since an update bricked a brand new phone.
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2020
    cd8ed, Oct 17, 2020
    #39
  15. HockeyDad

    HockeyDad Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I am on Windows 10.
     
    HockeyDad, Oct 17, 2020
    #40
  16. cd8ed

    cd8ed Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    cd8ed, Oct 17, 2020
    #41
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  17. HockeyDad

    HockeyDad Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    HockeyDad, Oct 17, 2020
    #42
    cd8ed likes this.
  18. jcarlilesiu

    jcarlilesiu Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Agreed. And I'm conservative.

    Let the market play out.
     
    jcarlilesiu, Oct 17, 2020
    #43
  19. cd8ed

    cd8ed Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Btw, I looked up why adding the words “white” and “straight” to the word couple changes the results, they pull from sources where there are descriptions in the article, since white straight couples are the norm those two words actually pull in additional context modifiers. To find straight white couples all you have to do is search the world “couple” — do you think this shows bias? Seeing that around 7%-10% of the population identify as LGBT, 18% are Hispanic, 13% are Black, 8% are Asian the below is not demographically representative. Does this upset you as much as “straight white couple” bringing up other results? If it doesn’t that says more about your beliefs than it does google’s search results.

    upload_2020-10-17_18-39-44.png
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2020
    cd8ed, Oct 17, 2020
    #44
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  20. cd8ed

    cd8ed Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The market has already played out (for now).
    They just don’t like the results.
     
    cd8ed, Oct 17, 2020
    #45
  21. dadoalex

    dadoalex Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    No, they don't.

    Hardware vendors will include, for a price, software from various companies for a price. As IBM and Microsoft learned, the arrangement you're describing is illegal in the US and EU.
     
    dadoalex, Oct 17, 2020
    #46
  22. Nightmare515

    Nightmare515 Ragin' Cajun Staff Member Past Donor

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    I don't have enough experience in this field to know whether or not Google is under any obligation to have a "balanced" search algorithm.

    I get it, this is one the primary means by which folks get information and Google being a private company who can "do whatever they want" is dangerous. However, Google isn't the only search engine, nobody is forcing all internet users to use Google. There are alternatives as you mentioned such as Bing, DuckDuckGo, etc. Same with Twitter and Facebook and all of these other social media platforms that folks are up in arms about right now.

    I don't particularly like the fact that the largest search engine on the internet is openly censoring things or pushing a certain narrative but I also don't like the government telling them they can't do that as a private company either. Simply use a different search engine if you don't like what Google is doing, they are by no means the only one available.
     
    Nightmare515, Oct 17, 2020
    #47
  23. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    How would "net neutrality" have made a difference?
     
    Lil Mike, Oct 17, 2020
    #48
  24. Burzmali

    Burzmali Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Most android devices have similar markup tools for photos and screenshots. Anyone who doesn't know they exist just hasn't taken 30 seconds to explore the 3 or 4 buttons in the toolbar of their image viewer.
     
    Burzmali, Oct 17, 2020
    #49
  25. Burzmali

    Burzmali Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    They used to have contracts with other software publishers/developers. I know a major chunk of Mozilla's (Firefox) income ($25 mil/year, IIRC) used to be Google paying them to default to them as the homepage and for search. No idea if they still do that.
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2020
    Burzmali, Oct 17, 2020
    #50
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