Definitive proof that there was no fraud

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by CenterField, Nov 28, 2020.

  1. Independent4ever

    Independent4ever Well-Known Member

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    Could I make stuff up like Trump is currently - sure. However I accepted the results that night and never thought of Trump as an illegitimate president. Do I think Russia tried to influence - yes, but based on the rules of election, Trump won. I am sure other foreign counties tried to influence for Hillary
     
  2. Spooky

    Spooky Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    They finally killed Rush though.
     
  3. Independent4ever

    Independent4ever Well-Known Member

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    CNN & MSNBC - yes

    FOX - Chris Wallace - in the middle, most of the rest of Fox, no better than CNN
     
  4. peacelate

    peacelate Banned

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    Guliani: "this case is not about fraud"

    Trump lawyers: "we're not alleging this election was stolen"

    Case closed.
     
  5. Independent4ever

    Independent4ever Well-Known Member

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    Truth lies in the middle in most issues, Anyone that (as an example) is 100% in agreement with everything Trump does or 100% against everything he does has zero credibility. No different than Obama, Bush, etc

    If the election had been held in Nov 19, I don't know who I would have voted for. My hatred of Trump all came in 2020
    I voted 3rd party in 2016 as I did not like either candidate much and I was indifferent to who would win
     
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  6. Anansi the Spider

    Anansi the Spider Well-Known Member

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  7. Anansi the Spider

    Anansi the Spider Well-Known Member

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    The people who construct the political framework define the sensible middle.
     
  8. Anansi the Spider

    Anansi the Spider Well-Known Member

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    What about Hollywood? What about the rest of the TV networks? What about the music industry? On the whole the corporate executives favor the liberal/left.

    And what about the educational establishment?
     
  9. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    What is it you think the far left is selling?

    Medicare for all? 69% are in favor of it, including 42% of republics.

    And, how is that 'far left' when universal health care is the norm in some 50 western developed nations?

    That's the main thing.

    What else are you are afraid of?
     
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  10. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    Lies? If you are voting for Trump, you are IN LOVE WITH LIES!

    "Climate change is a hoax"

    "Stock Market will crash if you elect Biden" ( hit 30,000 recently )

    "Dems stole the election" ( no, but Trump is trying to )

    "Dems will raid medicare to pay for socialism" ( WTF ? That makes no sense)

    there are tons more lies you must love, if you are interested.
     
  11. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    His debt to foreign banks is a national security threat.

    His incessant undermining public faith in elections is a national security threat.

    His incessant assertion that the press is the enemy of the people undermine public confidence in the very thing that protects them from tyranny, i.e., a vigorous and free press, which is a threat to liberal democracy, and a national security threat.

    His contempt of congress and obstruction of justice is a threat to national security

    His attempt to use the DOJ for political ends is a threat to national security

    His hiring lobbyists to the cabinet posts they fought against is a threat to national security

    His failure to grasp the seriousness of climate change is a threat to national security ( this is the big one)

    His gutting the state department, leaving half of the ambassadorships unfilled is a threat to national security

    His hiring of incompetent persons is a threat national security.

    His incompetence handling Covid is a threat to national security

    the unprecedented turnover in the white house is a threat to national security

    His tendency to hire sycophants/yes men, and fire those who speak truth to power is a threat to national security.

    His lack of knowledge of US history, lack of knowledge of civics, and many things along these lines, is a threat to national security

    His arrogance and total lack of empathy, and total lack of humility, plus the above, means he is unfit for the job and his unfitness is a threat to national security.

    His nepotism is a threat to national security.

    His spending too much time watching TV and tweeting and playing golf is a threat to national security ( well, it's not good, let's just say that much )

    Trump's imposing tariffs which caused farmers to permanently lose markets is a threat to national security

    his corruption, bilking of the US Taxpayer to the tune of $16 million from entourage stays in his hotels and resorts, all of which his family has profited and his nepotism, allowing his daughter in law to win millions of dollars worth of China trademarks while he was negotiating with China, his allowing Jared to garner a $500 million bailout from QATAR, all of which is a threat to national security

    is nauseating fawning over Putin whose objective is to destroy and/or greatly diminish America's standing in the world, is a threat to national security

    his incessant egregious lying, i.,e., "Truth Decay" is a threat to national security

    Trump's usurping the Senate by appointing 'acting' heads of departments of whom the president is supposed to appoint and be confirmed by the Senate, the acting heads cause more instability and decrease of moral in the rank and file in those departments,
    is a threat to national security

    Trump's firing of Comey, which was detrimental to the morale of the rank and file of the FBI, and Trump's scapegoating the FBI, and undermining a once trusted American institution (post Hoover, of course). is a threat to national security

    his acquiescing to Erdogan by allowing DOJ to interfere in US Attorney's office investigation of a Turkish bank because it will adversely affect members of Erdogan's family, noting that Erdogan tried to do it with Obama, and his DOJ refused, but Erdogan is finding Trump a pliant president, noting that Trump abandoning the kurds, who were instrumental in helping us in the Iraq war, whose members died for America, Trump did this to appease Erdogan, whereupon the vacuum that that pull out created forced the Kurds to turn to Russia, thus increasing Russia's influence in the region, noting that Trump has property in Turkey, is a threat to national security

    Trump's decision to begin the process of withdrawing the United States from the Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty will end an arms control agreement with Russia that has been a centerpiece of European security since the Cold War. The move, meant to penalize Russia for noncompliance, is likely to alarm the international community, particularly Europe, and cause fears that the US and Russia could enter a new nuclear arms race is a threat to national security

    Trump's pulling out of the Trans-Pacific Partnership, A massive trade deal meant to counteract China's economic power. Trump ran on a promise to spike the plan, saying it was unfair to American workers. The pact was never officially adopted by Congress. The other 11 nations have carried on without the US, the void this pullout caused allowed China to gain considerable influence over international Trade in the affected regions. The partnership was an agreement that was the result of many years of negotiation is a threat to national security

    His pullout of the Iran nuclear deal. Despite criticism, the deal bought America about 15 years of time to work on ways to thwart their development of nukes, and without the deal, they are restored to their pre-agreement abilities, with one difference, their money in banks, which was frozen, is now in their hands, so we don't have the benefit of the agreement nor the benefit of the freeze on their funds is a threat to national security

    Trump's receiving a $500 million dollar loan from Deutsche Bank while simultaneously a deposit that amount was made to that bank, the money coming from a Russian state bank ( which means Putin controlled ) which makes Trump beholden to Putin, which explains his refusal to criticize Putin, or do much about Russian election interference is a threat to national security
    .
    Trump's appointing a Secretary of Commerce who was the VP of the real estate loan department at Deustche Bank when Trump was getting many loans from Deutsche Bank is a threat to national security


    Trump's failure to grasp certain fundamental economic concepts, his contentions which are essentially false, such as 'Tariffs are paid by China" ( no, they are paid by Americans ) is a threat to national security

    Trump's appointing of a Postmaster General whose apparent mission was to slow down mail in ballots from arriving on time, noting that this postmaster general (Dejoy) has failed to comply with a court order to expedite the mail in ballots is a threat to national security

    Trump's 'tax cut' which was nothing more than largesse for the superrich, and crumbs for everyone else thus causing deficits to careen to levels history has never seen is a threat to national security

    Trumps repeal of many important environmental regulations is a threat to national security.

    And this is at the top of my head, who knows what I'll find if I research it.
     
  12. Soupnazi

    Soupnazi Well-Known Member

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    It would take millions of switched votes
     
  13. Surfer Joe

    Surfer Joe Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    There is nothing dangerous about a principled repub or democrat who is a conscientious public servant.
    If you put people of good will in a room to hammer out solutions to our challenges, we will win.
    Get rid of the corruption and partisan demagoguery and the system will work as designed.
     
  14. doombug

    doombug Well-Known Member

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    LOL! You have only bolstered the case for fraud.
     
  15. Andrew Jackson

    Andrew Jackson Well-Known Member

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    Explain how?
     
  16. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    :applause:
     
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  17. doombug

    doombug Well-Known Member

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    There are sworn affidavits of ballots with only Biden on them and no down ticket. Why? Because dems were scrambling to get Biden enough votes to pull ahead. No down ticket votes? LOL! That is obvious.
     
  18. Andrew Jackson

    Andrew Jackson Well-Known Member

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    :roflol:

    WRONG!

    You have got to be kidding.

    People voting ONLY for President is extremely common.

    Here is a helpful article that destroys your assertion:

    VERIFY: It's normal to have ballots that vote only for president

    https://www.king5.com/mobile/articl...dent/507-683eff6b-be69-4902-8302-d85085fe5c0b

    You're welcome. :salute:
     
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  19. doombug

    doombug Well-Known Member

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    Hahaha! Your propaganda blog post proves nothing. Besides the OP is claiming that so many people hated Trump that more than 10 million people voted for him this time. What a joke!

    Sure some folks do only vote for president but the same candidate got these ballots.....sounds mighty fishy.
     
  20. Daniel Light

    Daniel Light Well-Known Member

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    When millions of people are against your policies, a normal person would ask themselves why and maybe take a self appraisal.

    Trump, being a narcissist, always ignores any possibility that the problem might be with himself, and points the finger at sinister outside forces.

    Given Trump’s 40 year history of lying to those around him - wives, subcontractors, University students, employees, the press - I’m amazed his followers never entertain the possibility that Trump is lying to them as well. It really is a cult phenomenon.
     
  21. CenterField

    CenterField Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Single issues are misleading, when we look for voting patterns. I've mentioned this here, a few times. A pollster asks someone "are you in favor of Medicare for All?" It seems politically correct to say "yeah, sure" because it's hard to say that one is not interested in extending health care to fellow Americans. But when that same person goes to the secret ballot box, he/she will think "wait a moment; this will cost me more taxes; this will dilute my own benefits when I reach Medicare age; likely I'll have to face waiting lines for services, and by the way this guy who is for Medicare for All is also for this, this, this, this, this, and that, all positions that I don't like. F....k Medicare for All, I'm voting for the other guy." Why? Because even if it is true that the voter was actually for Medicare for All and not just paying lip service to it when approached by the pollster, the voter still isn't overall a liberal. It's not one issue that defines one's ideological position.

    Here, a real life example. In my town, there was once a ballot referendum to increase local property taxes, earmarked for the public school system. I remember a Home Owners Association meeting in which an organizer stood up and said "Dear neighbors, it's off topic but I'd like to invite you all to join this great initiative of increasing our property taxes for the good of our children. Our schools need more money, which will result in better education for our children. Let's all vote for it!" Everybody said "Yes! Sure! Great idea! Absolutely!" Well, come election day, the referendum failed. They published maps showing how the neighborhoods voted. Ours voted massively against it. In the secret of the ballot box, the neighbors likely thought "What, my taxes will go up? F....k the schools! I'm not voting for it!" This is how misleading single issues can be.

    In this election cycle, this point was again thoroughly demonstrated by Super Tuesday Dem primary exit polls. I clearly remember (because at the time this very issue was being discussed in a forum I used to be a member of) that CNN exit polls in a given state showed massive support for Medicare for All. I thought "oh well, this bodes well for Bernie Sanders, the champion of M4A!" Hm... when the actual votes were counted, Sanders was thoroughly beaten in that state, by a humiliating margin. So much for the M4A support collected by the pollster...

    This was also demonstrated by the one poll at the time that asked the question in two stages: Pollster: Are you for Medicare for All? Responder: "Yeah, sure." Pollster: "Would you still be for Medicare for All if it resulted in your taxes going up by $2,000 per year?" Responder: "I'd have to pay $2,000 more per year? Wait a moment. Hell, no!"

    You can collect a figure like this, 42% of Republicans being for M4A and 69% of Democrats.

    But then if you ALSO ask "are you for the Green New Deal? Are you for immediately banning fracking and drilling? Are you for more regulations for businesses? Are you for a generous refugee policy at the border? Are you for amnesty for illegal aliens? Are you for extending free healthcare to illegal aliens? Are you for decreasing the Military budget in favor of social programs? Are you for defunding the police? Are you for higher income taxes across the board?" And then, you ask "Would you still vote for the candidate proposing M4A if all of the above ALSO came with it?"

    I GUARANTEE that you'd collect A LOT smaller percentage of people saying yes to the last question, than 42% of Republicans (more likely a round zero) and 69% of Democrats (probably not much more than 30%, consistent with how Sanders and Warren performed in the Dem primaries, when the final percentage of popular votes given to the sum of these candidates was 33% while the sum of the moderates was 67%).

    Look, we've just nominated a moderate in the Dem primaries, soundly defeating the far left candidate by more than 8 million popular votes. Then we got that same moderate candidate beating the far right candidate by a lot of popular votes but with the down ballot races telling a far different story (federal Senate, federal House, state Senates, state Houses ALL showing GOP gains almost everywhere - unlike in 2018 - and the electoral college going for the moderate candidate by a difference of merely less than 44,000 votes total in 3 states (had Trump won Wisconsin, Arizona, and Georgia, the EC would have featured a 269-269 tie, sending the presidential election to the House with the Constitution granting one vote per state delegation, and then Trump would have prevailed with the 26 Republican-majority delegations - Trump would have won the election if he had flipped just 22,000 votes or 0.014% of the total).

    This doesn't sound to me as a mandate to implement far left policies.

    And by the way, I'm FOR universal health care (I'm NOT "afraid of it"), and I DID vote for Biden. Just, I don't see these elections as delivering a far left mandate. But for example, no, I'm NOT for free healthcare for illegal aliens, which was spelled out in all letters, believe it or not, in Sanders' official platform in his web site, but not in Biden's. I checked.
     
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2020
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  22. Andrew Jackson

    Andrew Jackson Well-Known Member

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    It reminds me of that old saying:

    If you run into a Raging Imbecile in the morning, you ran into a Raging Imbecile.

    If you run into Raging Imbeciles ALL DAY--You're the Raging Imbecile.

    ^Donald Trump to a tee.
     
  23. Anansi the Spider

    Anansi the Spider Well-Known Member

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    Are these elites always so disinterested? They don’t work together to exploit the people?
     
  24. Anansi the Spider

    Anansi the Spider Well-Known Member

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    Check out the margins in those three states and you’ll find you are mistaken.
     
  25. CenterField

    CenterField Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Well done. This post should be copied and pasted, framed, and displayed on walls everywhere. Applause!
     
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