Major Study Finds Masks Don’t Reduce COVID-19 Infection Rates <<MOD WARNING>>

Discussion in 'Coronavirus (COVID-19) News' started by Bluesguy, Nov 19, 2020.

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  1. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    What in the hell is going on when we can buy N100 respirators on Amazon?
     
  2. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    All I’ve posted is facts. I’m sorry facts are making a mess of your argument. :) When I’m working I sometimes miss the edit deadline. It happens.
    Ok. Let’s be clear. Nowhere in any 60 Minute content from March 8th does Fauci utter the term 3M. He references masks seen in video footage of people in China and South Korea. He NEVER specified what type of mask they are or who manufactures them. I’ve watched it all before, but just to make sure I’ve looked up every bit of content from that interview that aired—on the regular program and on “60 Minutes Overtime“. There simply isn’t any reference to a 3M product.

    You will kindly now provide a time stamp of the time in the interview where Fauci identifies any mask as “3M”.

    Should be or shouldn’t be? Are you waffling?

    The lie is Fauci’s statement “right now in the United States people should not be walking around with masks”. That is in direct conflict with the known science at the time. It is a flat out lie.

    Ironically, at about the 13:30 mark of the full March 8 interview, Fauci says “the danger of minimization on/in any arena of infectious disease and outbreak is that you might get people to be complacent, number one, number two, when bad things happen your credibility is lost because you’ve downplayed something”. Yet, in the oft posted 60 Minutes Overtime segment from March 8 we’ve been discussing in this thread, Fauci downplays mask usage repeatedly. And because he waited till April 3rd to recommend masks, bad things did happen. Bad things like 3500 new daily confirmed cases and 1300 deaths on April 3rd. And then you guys wonder why Fauci’s credibility is shot. His words were prophetic. He downplayed, bad things happened, and his credibility is lost.

    I believe @notme’s credibility is lost as well.
     
  3. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    Some media clown told them all we have is crap because...Trump. Of course they aren’t going to actually look at what’s actually available. Everything from legit N95’s, to KN95’s, to as you point out, respirators. But nobody cares that lies told for political reasons sicken and kill. It sickens me.
     
  4. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    Bureaucratic indifference. Self-serving politics.
     
    557 likes this.
  5. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    You think there will be a US for you to come “home” to? Do you even want to at this point?
     
  6. Tigger2

    Tigger2 Well-Known Member

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    For clarification 557 was pointing out that masks were but one tool in the fight against spreading the virus and that the over reliance on masks alone was negating some of their effect. He made that clear himself fairly early on.
     
  7. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    Wrong again. Where did I say that I was opposed to mask usage before pandemics are out of control? Link please. I stated that Fauci said that, I'm not Fauci.

    Now let's see once again who is on record on being opposed to mask usage in the general population:
    You Nov 19th 2020 : "I think those more negative implications outweigh their protective qualities. Many of us predicted this outcome months ago."

    Me: May 27th 2020 : "Though people should be more informed about how to use a mask but even if incorrectly worn it is not worse than no mask"
     
  8. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    Your statement posted on Nov 19th in another thread was "I think those more negative implications outweigh their protective qualities. Many of us predicted this outcome months ago." and that was in reference to the conclusion stated in this OP which is "Major Study Finds Masks Don’t Reduce COVID-19 Infection Rate"

    You used the word "outweigh" which means taking everything into consideration. You have supported the anti-maskers opposition to wearing masks
     
  9. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    He used the word "outweigh" which means taking everything into consideration. He agreed with the conclusion of this thread's OP which is "Major Study Finds Masks Don’t Reduce COVID-19 Infection Rates".
     
  10. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    Where is the lie? He stated in February "A mask is much more appropriate for someone who is infected and you're trying to prevent them from infecting other people than it is in protecting you against infection. If you look at the masks that you buy in a drug store, the leakage around that doesn't really do much to protect you."
     
  11. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    Of course I can! I'm not Fauci. I stated that Fauci said that he feared that the public would buy out much of the supply. That doesn't mean I agree with him. I don't know how much supplies there were in the US as to question whether his fears were justified. I can say that in the UK we did not have enough supplies
     
  12. AlpinLuke

    AlpinLuke Well-Known Member

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    And the WHO didn't help as well ...

    About the matter of the mask the WHO made even confusion.
    Since I've been rescuer for years, I do know how and when to use a surgical mask and I do know that it's intended to block what we issue breathing. The surgeon wears a mask not to protect himself from the patient, but to avoid to infect the surgical wound, simply breathing.
    For the same reason he wears surgical gloves ... and so on.

    But those PPDs [Personal Protection Devices] work in both the senses.

    Now, probably the WHO at the beginning of the pandemic considered the difficulty to find billions of masks and that washing the hands and keeping the distance was good enough [they suggested the mask for infected subjects, if I remember well].

    But, in our overcrowded cities and means of transports also out of the cities, to keep the distance is impossible and without symptoms a person can be contagious without knowing. so that to wear a mask reduces the risk of infection [for you or for the others].

    Anyway, we need to be careful, since like any virus SARS-Cov-2 can transmit itself by contact. This is why it's important to wash or sanitize the hands frequently [and to avoid to touch your face without sanitized hands]. You can touch a table ... you don't know who has passed just before of you [if there is a droplet with alive virus and you touch it, touching your mouth or your nose or your eyes, you could get a viral load]. So that sanitize your hands if you cannot sanitize the surfaces you touch.

    A bit of science about mask.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/ar...TzlyDGy__0ZJKGuBsqxfxi40rEQ_gjvnVoZI-AkqMEN8M

    And this one explains also why masks with valve shouldn't be used.
    https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2020/06/4...s-heres-science-behind-how-face-masks-prevent
     
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  13. Tigger2

    Tigger2 Well-Known Member

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    Yes I questioned this and he clarified. I took that clarification to mean that people should have been told masks were only part of the equation. Rather than he meant masks contribute to the spread the virus.
     
  14. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    You have taken the position Fauci’s statements in February and March such as this one: “right now in the United States people should not be walking around with masks“ was not a lie.

    You said this:
    But clearly, the time to recommend masks is before pandemics are out of control. You’ve posted statements from Fauci where he admits to having information on asymptomatic spread sufficient to begin recommending masks (by his own stated criteria) in late February/early March. Yet he didn’t recommend for another month.

    If you don’t believe the above statement I’ve quoted is a lie you don’t support mask usage early in or to prevent a pandemic.
    The thing is, that’s not opposition to mask usage. It’s an observation of reality intended to get people to think about their behaviors. I’ve explained that to you in detail.
    You failed to see Fauci say in the March 8 interview that incorrectly worn masks can lead to unintended consequences such as touching your mask and face, etc.? He used that as part of his justification for the above statement that people in the US shouldn’t be wearing masks. Was Fauci making a valid point or lying about the unintended consequences? Is Fauci pro or anti mask? I’ll reiterate you really need to just sit down and think about all this. You need to get off the media carnival ride and apply some logic to this subject.
     
  15. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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    I don't have it all figured out, but I do understand that I and the public have been deceived.
     
  16. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    Here is the entire passage you edited to fit your narrative. Note the specific reference to certain demographics.


    I really haven’t any interest in rehashing all this with you. It’s been explained over and over. I’ve repeatedly said I would never tell a person not to wear a mask, even when I present data that does not support mask usage.

    But your selective quoting above should be sufficient evidence to the third parties here you are misrepresenting my views. I’m a pragmatist who understands the positive and negative attributes of masks and their usage.
     
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  17. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    I recall him saying a mask wasn't necessary if you kept your distance.
    Don't remember him saying that, but we know this is the case.
     
  18. LangleyMan

    LangleyMan Well-Known Member

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    Meaning what? Exactly who deceived you and what did they say and do?
     
  19. Eleuthera

    Eleuthera Well-Known Member Donor

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  20. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    You concluded in November " : "I think those more negative implications outweigh their protective qualities" which means that you would not advise mask usage for the general population.

    You state that Fauci lied. His early comments were similar to yours which then means you also lied.

    You need to think about the difference between an opinion and a lie
     
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  21. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    Ah. It’s probably wise to stop pulling Fauci’s wagon. Good move.

    So you are going back to the incompetence/malicious defense for Fauci. Fauci knew Americans would benefit from wearing masks, he knew his actions of not providing mask options would cause exponential growth of cases. He knew people in the US should be wearing masks but he explicitly said they shouldn’t. He intentionally killed Americans and he intentionally lied to precipitate their deaths. He did this while South Korea was offering a different model to the world. One where proles and professionals alike could be protected.

    Ok. Go with that. That’s much more logical.
     
  22. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    LOL. Thanks for telling me what I mean, even though I’ve directly quoted (correctly instead of incorrectly as you did) myself telling you what I mean.

    I have never told anyone not to buy or wear a mask. Ever. I have repeatedly told people to make their own decisions based on facts. I have recommended mask usage to you directly and you have vehemently opposed that recommendation. I’m on record at PF as being the most pro mask member. I recommend masks to more people and usage in more places than anyone here. I also present evidence showing that incorrect usage (implicit trust) often outweighs their physical properties of protection. As have Fauci and many other medical professionals.

    Fauci told people they shouldn’t be wearing masks when it was the most likely to save the most lives. It was an outright lie.

    I have presented facts, as always, which nobody can refute.

    The fact Fauci can be correct and I can agree with him in no way has an effect on the opposite being true on another point. I’m not emotionally invested in the guy. Others have to believe everything he says is true. I don’t. I can judge each statement based on whether it aligns with known evidence.
     
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  23. 557

    557 Well-Known Member

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    And this thread demonstrates that is exactly what some people WANT.
     
  24. notme

    notme Well-Known Member

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    And those are 3M masks. He dumbed it down, and you still did not get it.

    not relevant.... there are no lies here.

    Please quote me he mentioned 3M masks.
    I made no such claim.

    He said that, because there was a shortage.
    He specifically said that this is the point of that.

    I told you so often before. You're just dishonest by ignoring facts.
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2021
  25. truth and justice

    truth and justice Well-Known Member

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    Lol. You wrote "I have never told anyone not to buy or wear a mask. Ever." In the same paragraph that you wrote ". I recommend masks to more people and usage in more places than anyone here."
     

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