Pick between $15/hr min-wage or UBI

Unskilled workers are not directly productive enough for most local private enterprises to employ them for more than a pittance - IOW the free market wage.

 

These people have already joined the workforce and are gaining experience. Would they still show up for work if you paid them for doing nothing?

 

Millions of unskilled Americans are being paid for doing nothing right now. Private enterprise cannot afford to hire them.

 

Can I say both?

If a businessman can't pay his employees a living wage then he doesn't have the business necessary to hire someone. He should keep the money and work harder to put more money into the business until he can.

Too many small business owners hire people to make their jobs easier. They have to understand that the whole idea of owning a business is that every part of it just makes the owner's job harder and harder. Expanding and hiring is not something you should desire unconditionally. You make more money but you also have more work

 

So just hand out money with no restrictions on how it can be spent, no regulation on it's use, no follow up it is being used properly according to taxpayers desires how it should be used?

 

Yea and they said that when we went from human phone operators to automated systems. When accounting went spreadsheet. When mail went email. When inventories were automated and barcoded. And somehow we, the free and open markets, seem to find a use for that labor as we produce more and different products and end up with better jobs in the process.

 

How many businesses survive paying more the labor the pay for than it's value to the company? How many have been successful saying they don't want to be to successful because it makes it harder and I have to hire people to perform task.

What kind of business to you invest you savings into that do the above?

 

We have had a GLUT of jobs and ESPECIALLY in robotics and automation. Companies are begging for people to create and manufacture and maintain those systems. And they are BETTER jobs. Were I just graduating high school high my list would be the free technical education and certifications my state and local industry will provide FOR FREE to learn those systems and then start out with a six figure wage/salary. And it would be a MUCH better job than running a spot welder all day or stacking body panels and rolling them around a plant.

 

You mean net income, 2019 was $13.5B down from $17B in 2013.

And what is that ROA's? What percent of gross revenue is that? Just stating a net income figure doesn't tell you much. And you can certainly vote in your state to cut subsidizes to low income people if you don't think taxpayers should subsidize them, states don't send subsidy checks to companies to pay for their labor.

 

Nope. How they spend it is their concern.

 

Why when it is someone else's money meant to be spent in a certain way, why should they have free reign to spend it on anything they want. Isn't the purpose so they can increase their earning power and then no longer have to take money from someone else?

 

The goal of UBI isn’t to “get them off of it” — it is a minimum standard level of living that the nation determines is acceptable to all US citizens. It becomes their money. They are not “taking” it is being given.

 

The goal is to KEEP people on a UBI? Just living off other people's money? Shouldn't the time spent at that minimum standard of living be as brief as possible? Are they "forced" to take it? Do they apply for it? Can it be spent on beer and cigarettes and illegal drugs? How do you know it's going for food to feed any children as the taxpayers want it to be used? Provide proper shelter and medical care as the taxpayers want it to be used?

 

That is literally the name
Universal
Basic
Income

There would likely be no application process, it would be automatic for all US citizens.

Yes, they can buy beer and cigarettes. They can buy drugs. They can buy prostitutes. They can save and buy a car. Or buy an investment property.

How would we know if children are being starved to death? School administrators, neighbors, child welfare agents... Just like we do now.

I can post a few links on the topic if you actually don’t understand how it would work.

 

Agreed. But no one wants to pay a living wage for that kind of work any longer.

 

The whole concept of UBI is that every person shares a small portion of the nations wealth. Every single person gets a small set amount of money every week/month/whatever.

It can be used on anything they want.

The idea behind this is simply that higher paying jobs are becoming far more scarce due to automation practices. The idea that this new field of robotics and automation will spawn a whole new line of high paying jobs is ABSOLUTLEY CORRECT. But it will NOT spawn as many high paying jobs as it REPLACED. So each time we go through this exercise, the high wage earning job pool shrinks more and more.

As this is happening, population is increasing, putting a further pressure on the shrinking number of finite high paying jobs available.


More and more, people are working a combo of a "middle" class job and a "side hustle" to make ends meet now. Low wage earners work 3-4 low wage jobs. Leaving VERY little time to both be a healthy person,, and gain any needed skills to get ahead.


I think the simple fact of the matter is, Americans are going to have to start to learn to live with less. Across the board. The American standard of living MUST go down if people want to be able to survive on the mere pittance that these multi trillion globally spanning conglomerates bestow upon the majority of their workers.

All in the name of stock buy backs, and share holder appeasement.

 

Here's an article on Minimum Wage and the idea some believe it should be 'a living wage'.

Pretty good explanation.

AOC’s Terrible Minimum-Wage Argument (yahoo.com)

 

Well actually our birth population is falling as is in the news today and yes we can replace those jobs just as did telephone operators and blacksmiths, and bookkeepers and mailroom people in the past and we have a glut of jobs even now just as we did before COVID hit, employers are BEGGING for workers and LOTS to work on robotics and automation. And define "National Wealth" the only wealth the nation has is what is in the US Treasury, everything is PRIVATE wealth which the founding fathers made sure was protected under the Constitution. And work is healthy and most people receive training and learn on the job to make the job skills worth more.

You sound like Jimmy Carter and Barak Obama and their "malaise" speeches about the economy when the only problems were THEIR policies.

 

That is why, IMO, every level of government should subsidize the wages paid to unskilled workers by local small businesses.

 

AOC thinks all workers should be paid a living wage. Ideally true, but small business owners and individuals cannot justify paying that wage to unskilled workers.
If we want to get the now idle and unskilled into the workforce government will have to subsidize their market determined wage.

 

How can such a theory be supported? The continued 'give back' is a farce, even the PPP is just a vast pool churn to give the illusion of 'for the people'.

The realization that the poorest American resides in the wealthiest groups in foreign nations takes a little knowledge and a chunk of logic. If half of what is sent off to nations that spit on us was kept to address matters of the American people and the infrastructure of this country, the 'living wage' that that sheep blindly bleat about would come in due course, from the labor of one who wants it.

 

What if real estate in rural America begins to skyrocket in value???????

A plan to pay off the national debt of the USA has been pegged to this possibility and Mr. Bill Gates investing in farmland implies that this theory may be getting noticed??????


The Worgl Austria Great Depression Experiment and a real estate boom in rural America?


http://www.whatcomwatch.org/php/WW_open.php?id=717

 

The current system, especially the minimum wage, is designed to idle the unskilled.

 

What a big, "What if"
and who owns that food producing vastness!
Saudi Arabia? ? etc.


Support Ownership
of food resources!
Food Production is a National resource!



Moi
Nationalist
and YOU should be for yours too
Support Nova Scotia fishing rights.
Profited by Quebec & Ontario



The Depiction of profiteering of the International Jew circa 1900
IS THE GENTILE GLOBALISM THAT ENSLAVES US TODAY.
model!

Duh - Uh
Get It Or Not


Probably, not. <sigh>

STOP GLOBALISM or Else.​

 

Good point..... philosophically I believe that each family should own a decent amount of acreage.......
that can be arranged.......
even artistically to begin with.....


Micah 4:4
"But they shall sit every man under his vine and under his fig tree; and none shall make them afraid: for the mouth of the LORD of hosts hath spoken it."



Was Moses - Moshe a brilliant economist?


Obviously.... Micah was no slouch when it came to economics either!