Would you republicans vote for a $12 minimum wage?

Discussion in 'Political Opinions & Beliefs' started by Patricio Da Silva, Mar 6, 2021.

  1. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    In 1968, the minimum wage was $1.60.

    That is, adjusting for inflation, $12.03 in today's dollars.

    All we would be doing is restoring to what it once was, when unemployment was 3.8%.

    How about it?
     
  2. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the evidence that increasing minimum wage is a fools errand...
     
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  3. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    Thanks for nothing, I gave no such thing. I was asking for a reasonable compromise, so how about answering the question?

    Would you support a $12 minimum, like it once was ( adjusting for inflation) when unemployment was 3.8%?
     
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  4. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    Nope because increasing minimum wage is a fools errand as the numbers you gave more than suggest. Besides aren't there enough people out if work already?
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2021
  5. Patricio Da Silva

    Patricio Da Silva Well-Known Member Donor

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    No they don't. Unemployment was 3.8% when the minimum wage was $1.60, which is $12.03 in today's dollars.

    It suggests precisely the OPPOSITE of what you think.
     
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  6. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    It suggests nothing of the sort because the numbers dont connect the way you think they do. Fact, is we have had the inflation because we kept increasing minimum wage and the size of government involvement in the economy in other ways. Increasing minimum wage reduced job opportunities as well.
     
  7. ChiCowboy

    ChiCowboy Well-Known Member

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    heres numbers all connected

    [​IMG]
     
  8. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    And of course proving only that the two numbers shown have no correlation sat all let alone corresspondence.
     
  9. ChiCowboy

    ChiCowboy Well-Known Member

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    Correct, but you were corelating the two here:

    Fact, is we have had the inflation because we kept increasing minimum wage

    Minimum wage doesn't affect inflation one way or the other. It's a base entry wage for anyone wanting to do business. There are arguments against the wage itself, but outside of abolishing it, it's time for a raise.
     
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  10. Hotdogr

    Hotdogr Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The real minimum wage is $0/hr. Increasing a government mandated wage floor necessarily increases the number of people making minimum wage and is inflationary. The people making $0/hr, and those on fixed incomes are hurt by increases in minimum wage. I respond to people who ask why not increase minimum wage by asking them why they hate poor people.

    To answer the OP, no I wouldn't. I would, however, support eliminating federally mandated wage floors. Full disclosure, I'm not a republican, so perhaps the OP wasn't directed to me.
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2021
  11. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    But you eilllbrecall I also stated other things most notably government involvement in the private sector and of course increase productivity in the private sector...
     
  12. ChiCowboy

    ChiCowboy Well-Known Member

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    Agreed, but the minimum wage has little to no effect on that.
     
  13. Cybred

    Cybred Well-Known Member

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    And the answer is that we don't, you do since your opposed to a min.
     
  14. Hotdogr

    Hotdogr Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I have already explained why wage floors hurt poor people. If you would think about it a bit, and open your mind, you'd see.
     
  15. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    No. And here's why. Minimum wage is meant to boost the bottom level earners. The bulk of bottom level earners rent their housing. Housing is the single largest cost of living expense for the lower (and probably middle and upper middle) class. Landlords raise rent to match whatever renters can afford to pay. So minimum wage increases, in the long term, just becomes capital for the rental economy instead of higher living standards for the lowest working class. Raising the minimum wage will only help minimum wage earners who arent now and will not later be paying rent. How many minimum wage earners dont pay rent?

    The key to increasing the standard of living of the lower class is to reduce the cost of their housing. It seems to me the best way to do that is to decentivize the practice of hording real estate as a means to store wealth. This would have to happen very slowly or it would shock the entire economy and totally backfire.
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2021
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  16. Cybred

    Cybred Well-Known Member

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    My rent goes up, my wages haven't.
     
  17. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    Oh but it does. Any raise not connected to increased productivity is inherentlly inflationary. More money same goods equals inflation.
     
  18. Cybred

    Cybred Well-Known Member

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    And you are wrong.
     
  19. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It will go up even more with your wages. Rent will of course increase with inflation as well, as landlords have costs too, and have to make a profit (or else why bother renting). But it goes up faster with wage increases.

    What I think needs to happen is to make renting housing and buying housing roughly similar in affordability. As it is now, there is no competitor to renting, which is why the cost just keeps matching the maximum renters can afford to pay. If a renter could get fed up with the rent rising and get a mortgage instead, the rent wouldn't go up as much because landlords obviously want to have their properties rented. But for this to happen, property values have to go down, and they have to go down very slowly or the economy collapses.
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2021
  20. ChiCowboy

    ChiCowboy Well-Known Member

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    Micro-economically, yes. Those businesses affected may try to raise prices, but that's no guarantee for success. It depends on the competition, industry, supply and demand, and many other factors.

    The point is that minimum wage doesn't affect enough people to have an effect macro-economically. An overnight 100% increase from $7.25 to $15 certainly would be destructive, and in my opinion, four years isn't enough for that 100%+ raise. Make it six years. Gradual increases give businesses time to plan and adjust. It's past due for a raise. $7.25/hr. is exploitation level wages.

    Romney and Cotton suggested $10/hr. Not enough. I agree with the OP, but let's split the difference; $12.50 in four years. Or $15 in six.
     
  21. Hotdogr

    Hotdogr Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    No, I am not. You are limiting your analysis to those very few who are directly benefited from a minimum wage increase, and forgetting about the multitudes who are unemployed and on fixed incomes; the poor. You are forgetting about the ones who will lose their employment because of wage floor increases. You are forgetting about businesses who will be forced to close their doors because of it. Orders of magnitude more people, and the country as a whole, are harmed by minimum wage increases.

    So I ask again... why do you hate poor people?
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2021
  22. Cybred

    Cybred Well-Known Member

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    I don't, you are wrong.
     
  23. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    Your rent goes up because property taxes go up, liability rates go up, plumbers cost more, maintenance cost more, and that's just the short list.
     
  24. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

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    I make that now at my job because my employer chooses to pay that, the way it should be. You can also choose to not take a job if not enough pay.
     
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  25. garyd

    garyd Well-Known Member

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    The problem is there down stream echo. And fact is like it or not at the rate you going will all be making forty bucks an hour and it will take 80 to live comfortably and none if us will be making that.
     
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