“The Message of Trump’s Embrace of Ashli Babbitt Martyrdom”

Discussion in 'Current Events' started by archives, Jul 12, 2021.

  1. archives

    archives Well-Known Member

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    Interesting point, however, given the circumstances, I don’t think it relates. Remember, this was the last line of defense before the crowd were outside the Chambers. The Capitol police had been unable to hold their advance back, while there were members still present. Given the previous threats and intense violence of the crowd, I don’t think the Capitol police could have waited till “the moment”
     
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  2. Seth Bullock

    Seth Bullock Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    But that is the moral and legal standard we expect of LE officers in this country.

    That shooting is so hush-hush that we really don’t know a lot about it. We can’t even be sure there were still any members of Congress in that room or if they had already been evacuated. I can’t even think of a recent police shooting that has had so much secrecy wrapped around it.
     
  3. yardmeat

    yardmeat Well-Known Member

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    Video of the event was quickly made public. From more than one angle. Hardly secretive.
     
  4. Egoboy

    Egoboy Well-Known Member Donor

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    A fact the 1/6 Commission will likely determine. And it's moot unless the officer who fired the gun knew everybody had been evacuated.

    And even then, while it's a harsh penalty, remember that this woman was killed while committing an act many would consider full blown treason...

    While I agree that ALL deaths that day were completely unnecessary, the cards are stacked against your argument.....
     
  5. Seth Bullock

    Seth Bullock Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It wasn't treason. She was guilty of trespassing and/or engaging in a riot. Shall we apply this new standard for the use of lethal force to other venues?
     
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  6. Starcastle

    Starcastle Well-Known Member

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    This is my last post on this thread.

    Nothing being reported and talked about regarding Breonna Taylor was true. Everything from how she died, where she died, the type of warrant and what happened has been fabricated. Ashli Babbitt never shot at anybody but she gets capital punishment.

    Trump supporters lionizing Babbitt are no worse than those walking around with Breonna t-shirts.
    Michael Brown assaulted and threatened the life of a police officer and that starts a whole movement.
     
  7. Seth Bullock

    Seth Bullock Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I saw the video. It left me with many unanswered questions.

    What is the written policy of the Capitol Police for the use of deadly force? (My guess is that it is similar if not exactly the same as other LE agencies'.)
    Did the shooting comply with written policy on the use of deadly force?
    Were there any members of Congress still in that room or even in the building when Babbitt was shot?
    Were lesser means of force considered?
    Who was in immediate danger of death or serious physical injury by the unarmed woman who was shot at the moment she was shot?
    Was any warning given before the shot was taken?
    Did Ashli Babbitt, herself, communicate a threat of death or serious bodily injury to anyone?

    Who was in charge of the situation?
    Did the officer who fired the gun act on orders or on his own?

    Lots of questions.

    Shall we apply this new lower standard for the use of deadly force by LE officers to other venues where there is a riot?
     
  8. fullmetaljack

    fullmetaljack Well-Known Member

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    It's good that this is your last post, because now I can have the last word.

    Your false claim about the details surrounding the death of Breonna Taylor at the hands of the police stems from ignorance of the circumstances and your prejudiced opinion that the police can do no wrong. Babbit got shot during the commission of a felony by a law enforcement officer attempting to defend the Capitol during an Insurrection.

    An unjust, extra-judicial outcome in the first case, a legally defensible one in the second.
     
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  9. Starcastle

    Starcastle Well-Known Member

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    I copied your comments on the Breonna Taylor thread.
     
  10. yardmeat

    yardmeat Well-Known Member

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    Cool. So does that mean you will finally, honestly be engaging in this thread, or are you going to keep dodging?
     
  11. Starcastle

    Starcastle Well-Known Member

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    A poster now defends lynching in America for anybody who commits a felony. No trial, no defense. Capital punishment on the spot!
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2021
  12. yardmeat

    yardmeat Well-Known Member

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    A poster now makes up blatant bull ****. No logic, no rationality. Just intellectual dishonesty on the spot!
     
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  13. AmericanNationalist

    AmericanNationalist Well-Known Member

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    The main issue is that the DOJ conducted its 'investigation' in secret, and gave us even less transparency than Comey did during the Clinton investigations. Far less than is necessary during a homicide investigation. I should think it bipartisan that we demand answers pertaining events like this.
     
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  14. Starcastle

    Starcastle Well-Known Member

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    Did you read his words?

    Her shooting was justified because she was committing a felony? He said that! Every one of the black people who were treated as martyrs by the media because they were killed by cops committed felonies.
     
  15. yardmeat

    yardmeat Well-Known Member

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    If there is an angry mob around your house that has already committed violent crimes against your security and is chanting for the death of those with you behind a final barricade, and a woman breeches that same barricade and encourages the violent mob to follow her, you are justified in using lethal force to defend yourself. Keep pretending you don't agree. No one is gullible enough to buy that bullshit.
     
  16. Starcastle

    Starcastle Well-Known Member

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    So that couple in St Louis would have been justified to shoot some BLM protesters? Angry mob around their house? Breeched security. Threatening them and their dog? Threatened to burn their house down.

     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2021
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  17. yardmeat

    yardmeat Well-Known Member

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    This group had not committed any violence that I know of, and there is no substantiated account of them threatening anyone. They didn't even try approaching this couple, from what I've seen, and they didn't try entering their home. Try again, but this time actually try.
     
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  18. Egoboy

    Egoboy Well-Known Member Donor

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    Depends on the venue and the goal of the rioters...
     
  19. Egoboy

    Egoboy Well-Known Member Donor

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    4 posts later.......
     
  20. JET3534

    JET3534 Well-Known Member

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    It was a riot. Not an insurrection any more than the liberal riots in Lafayette Park targeting the White House were an insurrection. You liberals torture the English language. That, and you are taking an opinion piece by the left as representative of the opinion of the right. In other words a strawman. But since you are an expert, please explain why lethal force was used against an unarmed woman rioter. Should not the first option be non-lethal force?
     
  21. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    She was shot as police officers stood there next to her allowing her to break through a window. And you haven't a shred of evidence her intention was to kill anyone or was leading anyone to that "goal".

    Remember during the Kavanaugh hearing when those protestors and insurrectionist were taking over the Capital and interfering with a government process trying to stop that process and in one case trap Senator Sass in an elevator? Trapping them in their offices. Were guns drawn and people shot then?

    We don't even know the name of the police officer here, why not? We don't know who gave the order to use lethal force against the protestors, why not? We have heard no explanation of why the many officers standing there next to her on her side of the door did not even draw their weapons on her let alone FIRE their weapons on her to stop her, why not? THEY were in the best position to judge what level of threat there was. Where are their statements on the matter? Why haven't we seen an official report giving us those statements? What are they covering up?
     
  22. Egoboy

    Egoboy Well-Known Member Donor

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    Why?
     
  23. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    Why didn't the officers on her side of the door including the SWAT team in the stairway fire at her, the capitol police did not even draw their guns out. They were in the best position to judge the threat she was posing, why didn't they kill her? Why didn't they even try to restrain her but ALLOWED her to bust out the window and begin to go through it?

    What did the report we all got say?
     
  24. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    Public record this was a homicide. You're OK in the future when a police officer kills someone we never learn their names?
     
  25. Seth Bullock

    Seth Bullock Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That sounds like a “No”.

    I think we have laws and policies that must apply evenly. We should never let politics govern the use of deadly force.
     
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